Mossberg 500 Combo or Persuader? Why?

[bsochs]

Hello folks. I am a new shooter with many questions, I've been reading for a few days now - in fact I haven't shot my gun yet. Never shot a shotgun before (BB guns don't count) Got a Persuader 8 shot for HD right at 300.00 But I just saw the Combo selling for 350.00.

My main interest is HD but I want to get out and do some shooting, learn ' shotgun marksmanship', have some fun shooting skeet/clay/trap and try hunting. I don't want to feel uncomfortable with the steel in my hand, God forbid, if a BG breeches my family's security. My children's rooms are opposite my rooms and a bad guy in the hall way would stand between me and my babies (not a good idea for bad guy). So, I have to be on target and choose the right ammo.

I like the Persuader's parkerized pistol grip, 20", 8 shot but I'm feeling like the more traditional Mossberg 500 Combo will be more versatile. Can a few folks weigh in for me. What seems like the best option for a single shotgun ?

I won't be collecting more guns soon so I hope to maximize the use of this one or replace it. For 133.00 I can get 28" barrel for the persuader. But chokes can't be changed-how big of a deal is that for mostly target practice ? I imagine the Combo is a 6-shot - for HD - those who have shot at the "bump" in the night - how important is having an 8-shot ?

Lastly, I read that the MOssberg 500 passed military testing - was that a particular Mossberg 500 or the full design line? THANKS

 

[Chindo18Z]

Get the 500 Combo; MUCH more shooting versatility. 6 shots is fine.

Most importantly...if I understand you correctly...the Persuader you are looking at has only a pistol grip (and no stock)?

Forget that.

A pistol gripped only shotgun is an absolutely abysmal choice for a home defense weapon. Piss poor. Horrible.

Pistol grips came into favor many years ago for certain folding stock equipped weapons (like the 870) and evolved into a useful way for entry teams to hold a shorty breaching gun for blowing away door hardware. They occasionaly see some specialized bodyguard use for concealed carry or PSD from inside an automobile. The weapons I'm describing have no stock, very short barrels (10"-14") and reduced magazine capacity.

They suck for taking a precise shot. Which you will need to do in a self defense situation. At room distance, that 20" Persuader barrel (with an 8-round tube under it) will be muzzle heavy, unwieldy, and your shot spread will be about the size of the palm of your hand. You'll be lucky to accurately hit a moving human target beyond about 5 meters.

It's not that it isn't lethal. It's that it is wildly inaccurate in almost all hands (especially when compared to a standard stocked shotgun). Ever wonder why folks don't deer hunt, bird hunt, or shoot skeet/trap with pistol gripped shotguns? Think about it.

I have watched more folks wind up with the rear receiver & back of their own firing hand rammed straight into their face when trying to sight down the barrel of a pistol gripped 12 GA. Broken teeth, lips, cuts, etc. And that is the natural reaction for unpracticed shooters. They tend to bring it up to shoulder level and then pull it in tight to their face (because there isn't a stock) and get smacked in the face.

Quite frankly, although the pistol gripped versions are designed to look "bad", you will be outshot at the range by anyone with a $120 wood-stocked pawn shop pump.

The 6-shot Mossberg is a fine HD weapon. In fact, the full stocked Persuader was/is primarily produced as a 6-shot weapon. I'm not sure if they still make it.

I've used a lot of bone stock 500s in the Army and yes, they are fairly common in military arms rooms. There are military versions with ghost ring sights, metal trigger guards, metal safety buttons, and bayonet lugs, but the generic black 500A is fielded in quantity throughout the military.

The ambidexterous tang mounted safety (top rear of the reciever) is (IMHO) the most intuitive shotgun safety in existence.

Some will argue the Remington 870's steel reciever holds up in the long term over the Mossberg's aluminum one, but in my book it's Ford vs. Chevy. You'd need to fire many thousands of rounds to appreciate the difference.

I've owned several 500s over the years and currently have the Combo you are probably looking at (Camoflaged Stock/Reciever/Foregrip, Blued 18.5" Cylinder Bore Barrel, Bead Sight, Six-Shot with an additional camo 28" Turkey Barrel).

Hope this helps.

 

[Big_E]

I would go for the combo. Barrels are kind of expensive, so I think the combos are good deals.

I got the 535 turkey/waterfowl combo (22'' turkey bbl and 28'' waterfowl bbl) It is only 4+1 and I have 4 shells in the chamber for HD, 22'' barrel for manuverability. (#4 birdshot, 00, 00, slug) I figure if home invaders aren't gone by either the racking of the pump and/or the first shot then they aren't too smart by the time my old man wakes up w/ his 870 and my neighbor comes rushing over armed as well.

Anyway, 6 shots is fine. The persuader is just tacticool stuff for mall ninjas, but I do like pistol gripped full stock shotguns. But the only pistol grip ones are worthless IMO.

Mossbergs are excellent shotguns and I like them better than 870's but I won't complain w/ either.

 

[bsochs]

Sorry I didn't give all the info. My 8 shot Mossberg Persuader # 50578 comes with a synthetic normal stock. I may just get a used Mossberg 535 or 590.

 

[Chindo18Z]

bsochs: My 8 shot Mossberg Persuader # 50578 comes with a synthetic normal stock.

(Gilda Radner voice): "Nevermind..."

 

[zhyla]

What you've got is fine. Find a local tactical shotgun match to participate in. Also consider taking some training courses. I'm sure shooting clays is useful but unless your BG is jumping really high you'll be better served with defense-oriented practice.

 

[rcmodel]

I'm sure shooting clays is useful but unless your BG is jumping really high

If you can go 25 straight on a skeet range, a BG isn't gonna get past you I betcha!

Shooting BG paper targets at 15 yards may be some folks idea of learning to shoot, but it won't get you diddly squat as far as really handling a shotgun goes.

rc

 

[natman]

Since you say versatility is a high priority the Combo is the clear choice. The 8 shot is intended for a dedicated HD gun.

 

[Jack2427]

If you cannot get the job done with 6 rounds of 12 Gauge buckshot, you probably cannot get it done with anything. The PG advice is sound. The combo will do what you want and allow you to do some recreational shooting into the deal.

 

[bsochs]

If I can find a used Maverick part # 90241 I will have an 8 shot combo. That part features the accu-choke system which, I think, does allow or changing chokes for different kinds of hunting - I was mistaken in my original post.

 

[Big Bill]

Hunting shotguns and HD shotguns are two different animals. When I hunt ducks, pheasents and other upland game birds, I want a long barrel and ammo that will reach out and knock them down dead. In the house, I want a short 18 1/2" tactical barrel that swings easy and holds lots of ammo. One that I can attach a sling, light and other tactical goodies to.

That's why I have always had at least two shotguns. One for HD and another for hunting. My hunting gun is an older Remington Express 12 gage and my HD gun is a Remington Express 870. And, of course, I do still have my 1988 Winchester 1300 Defender, which I will never sell or trade.

BTW, I've killed lots of birds with that Remington. I'm glad I put out a little extra money to get it. It is/was sure worth the money.

 

[bearmgc]

I think the combo is a great deal.

 

[CajunBass]

Back in 1977 I bought one of those Mossberg combos (rebranded as Sears/Roebuck, but still a Mossberg). It had a 28" mod barrel and a smoothbore slug barrel.

Over the years it's been the only shotgun I needed for anything. Doesn't mean I didn't have others, but it's the only one I needed.

 

[tactikel]

Buy the combo, you should be able to shoot just about every thing with it. Shooting clay will help you learn to pump the gun (and not to short stroke it) and break it in; learn the sequence of: mount the gun, safety off, fire, cycle the action, and repeat as needed. Shooting a box of shells and putting the gun in a closet loaded it unwise. For the extra $50 the second barrel is and absolute bargin. Good luck, be safe ,and have fun.

 

[Zach S]

If you're gonna hunt/skeet/clay/trap/etc get the combo.

I got the 590, but I don't hunt/skeet/clay/trap/etc.

 

[Fred Fuller]

My children's rooms are opposite my rooms and a bad guy in the hall way would stand between me and my babies (not a good idea for bad guy). So, I have to be on target and choose the right ammo.

I'd feel a lot better about your situation if you were spending this much effort on getting advice about developing a viable home defense plan instead of just worrying about what shotgun to buy. The simple fact is, any reliable shotgun will do, if YOU will do. It's a lot more fun to talk about hardware than software, I know, but please humor me for a bit. After all, this is why they pay me the big bucks around here.

I'd be the last person here to underemphasize the value of good training and subsequent practice in learning how to handle and shoot a shotgun safely, and then learning how to fight with one. But there's a LOT more to the issue of home defense than being good with a shotgun. Home defense starts with hardening your home and doing those things which make it unattractive to would-be intruders in the first place. If no one can come close to your place without tripping motion sensitive lights, for example, the number if ill-intentioned people who hang around will likely decrease a good bit. If there are no 'easy' doors or windows to get in without having to make a lot of noise in the process, the possibility of you being surprised by intruders goes way down. And so on. See http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/propertycrime.html for some good information on this general topic.

Any family IMHO should have a basic set of emergency plans in place that covers possible problems that might happen. Do you have a fire evacuation plan, for example? Live in earthquake country? Likely to have blizzards, ice storms, floods, tornados, hurricanes or wildfires in your area? All those things are more likely threats in some areas than 'hot' burglaries or home invasions, even though they don't burn up nearly as much testosterone to talk about. Your family emergency planning should cover all possible threats, no matter how likely or unlikely they are to happen to you.

But since the one you brought up was home defense, lets talk about that. For starters, go to http://www.nrainstructors.org/CourseCatalog.aspx and take a look at the class called Personal Protection In the Home. Look at the locator and see if anyone in your area is teaching it. If not, you can get the classroom stuff on DVD from http://materials.nrahq.org/go/product.aspx?productid=ES 26840 . It's easily worth twenty bucks- I used to be an NRA certified instructor in this class, and I have the DVD. And you can get the textbook as well, from http://www.nrastore.com/nra/Product.aspx?productid=PB+01781 .

One of the very first things your home defense plan should include is putting yourself and your shotgun between your family and any threat, not trying to figure out what magic shotgun bullet will stop a bad guy and still not go through a wall and hurt your kids. And if that means moving across the hall before you trip the trigger- then move! Your family should be together and behind safe cover, with your wife on the phone to the police, leaving you the sole responsibility of stopping any threat that gets to your designated safe area. How much your shotgun/load penetrates should be a secondary concern so long as you do not endanger neighbors.

A good home defense plan involves putting yourself and your loved ones in the dark while lighting up the areas the intruders might be in or have to cross to get to you. It involves taking cover or making cover, depending on your house's architecture and contents. It involves having a reliable way to call for help and keep in touch with the cavalry while they're on the way- sometimes the bad guys cut outside phone lines, so maybe a cell phone might be a good idea too. Sometimes bad guys pull electric meters before they break in too, so power-failure mode backup or battery powered lighting might be a consideration. And so on.

If you plan to use a shotgun as a home defense weapon, you certainly need to know how to run it safely and effectively under the worst level of stress imaginable. But you also need to do what you can to avoid having to use it, if possible. First things first...

If you can't manage to get formal instruction on fighting with a shotgun, try starting out (after you finish your basic familiarization period) with one of the several defensive shotgun videos available. IMHO Tom Givens has the best one for shotgun beginners- go to http://www.rangemaster.com/ and see the section on Books and DVDs. The 'standard' shotgun video for many years was Louis Awerbuck's, see http://www.paladinpress.com/product/40/Shoulder_Weapons for that one. And Clint Smith's defensive shotgun video is excellent in all regards, see http://www.thunderranchinc.com/home/index.html for more on that one, or see the intro at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhgwHQCJwWw .

This may be more answer than you were bargaining for when you posted your question, but since no one else offered it yet, here it is. I hope it helps,

lpl