Object to my definition of recoil if you like. But the attitude that "You don't need a muzzle brake because I don't need a muzzle brake" is just silly. Perhaps you would like to share your secret of recoil control? Are you hulk sized? I'm not, I'm 5'5". Do you shoot low power loads? I don't, I don't even reload. Are you a grand master wizzard shooter? I'm not, just a country boy. However, I have been shooting since I was quite young, and completed a course in long range shooting. Everyone there that shot profesionally had a muzzle brake. So why is it that the best trained people there were useing them? They sure weren't the "tacticool" crowd. They were the type that wouldn't want to hump the extra weight if it wasn't paying off somehow. Why do they need it, and you don't?
Muzzle brake effectiveness.
- Thread starter jerrard
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I have re-read all your posts in this thread several times. You took issue with my seperating recoil and muzzle flip. My 308 doesn't "kick" back into my shoulder hard at all, but it does lift itself off the bipod, and land several degrees off the target. Watch the video I posted, that rifle recoils straight to the rear, with no jump, and stays on target.
CApighunter
Member
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- Jul 5, 2012
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My biggest issue with muzzle brakes is the blast for other shooters. Right before deer season I made a last minute trip to the range to check the zero on my .30-06. The only bench that was open was next to these young guys with full sleeve tatts, that had a high dollar AR-15 with a brake that looked like it belonged on a .50 BMG. Each time they fired I could feel the concussive blast (this is a .223...) and it was blowing some targets I set on the bench onto the ground. It was very difficult to get an accurate shot while being hit with the muzzle blast every second or two. I had to shoot while they were changing mags to get a decent grouping. Muzzle breaks on anything smaller than a .300 Win Mag seem pointless to me. On a .223 it seems just ridiculous. For a heavy, semi automatic .308 I would say it's totally unnecesary. The recoil will not be bad at all, and I highly doubt you will need to make that quick follow up shot on paper. A good alternative would be an A2 style flash hider, as they protect the threads and don't give off a concussive muzzleblast.
CApighunter
CApighunter
floorit76 said:
I took issue with your seperation of recoil and muzzle jump to avoid anyone else's posts that do not differentiate from being dismissed. I and everyone I know considers muzzle jump to be a given biproduct of recoil, and as I posted, I'm sure there are many others that do the same.
As to your video, but more specifically your own personal circumstances, if you are unable to comfortably control the recoil of your .308 or any other rifle you own to your liking, and feel that a muzzle brake will offer the solution you are looking for, then by all means, go ahead and get one.
Other people like to add more weight to the rifle to tame recoil, and others still do not have an issue to begin with with their .308s or other rifles.
As I posted before, I do admit that everyone's level of tolerance is different.
floorit76 said:
http://i.word.com/idictionary/tolerance
3*:*the allowable deviation from a standard
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/_/dict.aspx?word=tolerance
2.a.*Leeway for variation from a standard
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/tolerance?s=t&ld=1120
2.*a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward opinions and practices that differ from one's own.
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A brake, yes. A flash hider, not so much. This is why some cans are rated for full auto if used with a brake mount but not if one is using a flash hider mount. Look at a brake and look at a flash hider. A brake has chambers in essence act as additional baffles and take the initial blast. A flash hider is just open from the muzzle until the first baffle of the can. There is nothing really taking the blast.
A Brake mount
Flash hider mounts
View attachment 644559
People that make statements like this clearly have a pretty limited understanding guns and various kinds of shooting. There are a number of good reasons and notable advantages to be had from good brakes and comps on even semi auto 5.56 guns, to say nothing of 308s.
It baffles me that rather than try to learn why others do what they do, so many people simply assume that everyone else's needs, desires, and aims must be the same as their own and are dismisses or worst towards things they haven't even taken the time to educate themselves about. Just because you don't see a benefit to a brake on your 308 (or even 300 win mag) deer rifle doesn't mean it might not be crucial equipment on someone else's 5.56 3 gun carbine.
My grandpa used to always say, "What you're not up on, you're down on." That is showing its self to be very true in this thread.
Lloyd Smale
Member
Im not a fan of breaks. Im deaf enough allready. Only one i have left is a 7stw that came with one when i bought it used. they do help though if your recoil sensitive. I bought a used model 7 stainless 308 from the buddys gunshop. Someone had a break installed on it for there wife. Recoil was so mild i thought i had made a mistake loading the ammo. About felt like shooting my heavy barreled 22250. But it was LOUD. So i had another friend cut it off and recrown it. I dont have a problem with heavy recoil so they dont do much for me but its probably a good deal for someone who is disabled or for a wife or young kid.
stubbicatt
Member
Thank you! That's so true!
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
When it comes to discussions of recoil reduction and/or control, there always seems to be a contingent of people who engage in unabashed willy-waving, and that if you use a comp, especially on a gun like an AR15, it is implied that you're somehow not manly.
For those who can only put recoil into the categories of "hurts" and "doesn't hurt", all explanations about split times, accurate, rapid-fire shooting, high-round counts, and faster target transitions are just going to fall on deaf ears.
At the end of the day, it doesn't really matter. I've shot compensated and uncompensated guns side-by-side and have seen a noticeable difference even when shooting .223 rifles, and even with .22 LR handguns.
Some of the best competitive shooters in the world, including Jerry Miculek and Taran Butler shoot guns with compensators, and seem to think that they help.
Between my own personal experience, and seeing comps used by any number of respectable world-class shooters, I think it's fairly clear that they are an improvement. If someone else wants to deny reality, I suppose that's their prerogative.
Kingcreek
Member
I put one on a M1a Bush Rifle 18" barrel. After shooting it a couple times, I took it off and tossed it in a box under the bench. Little less recoil- lot more noise.
break
Had an AR 10 heavy barreled carbine with a break, that thing was LOUD, Sold it. The carbine I own now has a flash hider. Reasonable noise but its still a short barreled .308 and pretty loud.
The heavy barreled 20: rifle has a flash hider. don't notice the report nearly as much. Or the recoil. It aslo has a heavy scope.
Speaking Armalite, zero experience with the clones.
Put a Czech break on a CZ 58 and what little muzzle flip there was dissapeared.
Much more noise though.
Had an AR 10 heavy barreled carbine with a break, that thing was LOUD, Sold it. The carbine I own now has a flash hider. Reasonable noise but its still a short barreled .308 and pretty loud.
The heavy barreled 20: rifle has a flash hider. don't notice the report nearly as much. Or the recoil. It aslo has a heavy scope.
Speaking Armalite, zero experience with the clones.
Put a Czech break on a CZ 58 and what little muzzle flip there was dissapeared.
Much more noise though.
Well, I guess if you're a CQB kind of person or if you must reduce recoil for medical reasons, then it's a good idea. But if you just poke holes in paper at the local range and are not recoil sensitive, then it's just making a lot of unnecessary noise.
45crittergitter
Member
Although I'm an engineer, I've never figured out why a person's size should make any practical difference with regard to recoil tolerance, assuming the proper gun fit and technique, although I do have some conflicting theories.
Me, I'm 51 years old with a bit of arthritis, about 5'8", about 140#, and shoot a ~9# .416 Rem. Mag. without a brake. But if you want one on your .22 Short, go right ahead!
stubbicatt
Member
LOL! The willy wavers are out in force!
+1 Justin.
+1 Justin.
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