My first M39...some photos and a couple questions

[Dentite]

Hey guys,

Picked up a well-worn M39 (Finnish Mosin Nagant) tonight. My only other MN is a garden variety hex 91-30.

It's far from perfect...missing cleaning rod, a couple cracks in the stock, not much metal finish left, and a mismatched bolt (and maybe other problems I'm not yet aware of).

From doing some reading at http://www.7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinMarks01.htm it looks like I might have a russian bolt. It looks like I have a arrow in a triangle on the bolt which seems to be a Russian proof but I don't know what's customary on these. It's stamped with a number on the ball of the bolt handle (does not match reciever number).

Some photos:





91-30 bolt on top, the bolt that came with the M39 on the bottom:


Same:


The buttplate was all jacked up...took it off and one screw was being held in with a paper towel haha:


Crack in stock:


A less significant crack in wrist:


The floorplate is a forced match (original number struck through with matching number stamped above it).

Any thoughts?

Going to clean the bore and do a little shooting and then start cleaning it up if it shoots decent.

 

[Sergei Mosin]

The arrow in triangle is the post-1928 Izhevsk arsenal mark. The bolt body was produced there and presumably was picked up by the Finns during WWII. It's common to find bolts with parts from various makers, and an M39 could have a bolt with any combination of Russian, Soviet, and/or Finnish-made parts. The number on the ball of the handle is a Finnish characteristic.

 

[caribou]

Looks good, like a well worn and used rifle.The lack of pitting and evenness in wear but "unscrubbed" for blueing, I'd chalk that up to mucho use.

I bet the bore is sharp and shiny, unless some monkey shot corrosive and didnt clean it. When the Fiinns evaluated Rifles after the war, Bore condition and group size was the deciding factors for retention as they were limited on how much and of what they could keep militarily within the terms they took to stop the war with the Soviet Union in late 1944. Some rifles I have have minty bore and shrapnel gouges, burned areas and -5% finish left ~~LOL!!~~
As well, the Birch stocks and 70 years of storage get a bit dry as they didnt laquer the wood for long term storage like the Soviets did.

The stock looks very repairable.

I use an M-39 to make a living and its the best tool for the job Ive ever used, for sure.

Despite its small problems, it is the BEST Mosin variation ever.

 

[Dentite]

Thanks for the great info! I personally love the look of a well worn but not abused rifle. The metal work does have some old nearly burnished cosmoline on it but I think once that comes off it will look nicer.

I plan on doing a repair on the crack that runs through the rear of the butt.

Any thoughts on the crack in the wrist area? Leave it alone for now? Try to repair with brass screw? Wood dowel?

I do plan on doing some cleanup on the stock to get rid of the white paint or whatever residue it is. I've refinished the wood on my K31 and my 91-30 and was happy with the results.

Thanks guys.

 

[theotherwaldo]

Most of the guys that used M39s against the Russians apparently pulled and tossed the tight-fitting issue bolts and replaced them with looser-fitting captured Mosin-Nagant bolts. This reduced the chance of the gun locking up because of frozen lubricant.

The thing that I noticed first about my M39 was the smell. Half a century of campfire smoke had permeated the stock. Every time I uncase it, I'm back in the northern forest.

Needless to say, I'll never refinish this stock.

 

[caribou]

The M-39 bolt and recivers were all Russian manufacture, either captured or purchased bythe Finns who started out with MN's when they broke from Russia in 1918 and established Finnland as its own country. The Finns never manufactured a reciver, but all the other parts are upgraged to "Finn perfect"

The Fimm Mosin M-27 variation has "wings" onthe bolt and grooves in the reciver to recive them and tighten th e"lock up" when the blot was closed. Often, these bound up when dirty, and the blots were replaced or had the wings ground off to restore reliability. Im dirty combat ,such things were a liabilty.
As for the wood, if the crack at the wrist is "open, I would glew and pin/peg that, as well as the crack at the butt.....after the butt fixxed, I would drill glue and peg , then redrill the buttplate screw holes.

 

[mshootnit]

caribou what sights are you using?

 

[Dentite]

You guys are a wealth of knowledge...thanks for the info.

I did clean the bore today and got a good look at it. For the price I paid I wasn't concerned about it being perfect before purchase.

Unfortunately the bore is pretty dark and has what I would call minor pitting. Rifling looks pretty strong. I hope to get out in the next few days and see how it shoots.

I need to do a bit more research on stock repair before I tackle it.

I'd also like to pick up a cleaning rod for it eventually.

The trigger pull is so much nicer than my 91-30.

 

[caribou]

I use the awsome sights it came with to great effect
I like th eside slung sling an dthe pistol grip on the stock....the only thing its missing is a buttrap for a cleaning kit!!!

 

[Dentite]

Took it out and shot just 15-20 rounds to make sure all was well. Shot beautifuly, very comfortable to shoot. Didn't shoot for groups with a rest but for how the bore looks it seems to be accurate enough. I'll soon shoot from a rest and see what it can do.

I did take the gun apart tonight for inspection and a thorough cleaning. Based on the info at 7.62x54r.net it looks like the reciever has an 1897 birthdate.

 

[jobu07]

theotherwaldo:

Most of the guys that used M39s against the Russians apparently pulled and tossed the tight-fitting issue bolts and replaced them with looser-fitting captured Mosin-Nagant bolts. This reduced the chance of the gun locking up because of frozen lubricant.

Do you have a citation for this? First i've ever heard of that practice.

 

[toivo]

The M-39 bolt and recivers were all Russian manufacture, either captured or purchased bythe Finns who started out with MN's when they broke from Russia in 1918 and established Finnland as its own country. The Finns never manufactured a reciver, but all the other parts are upgraged to "Finn perfect"

What he said. My understanding is that the Finns made their own barrels and stocks, but that everything else came from the Russian rifles. I'm not 100% sure about the trigger group, though.

 

[CZguy]

I'm not 100% sure about the trigger group, though.

The trigger on mine feels more like a nice hunting rifle. I would be very surprised to learn that it was of Russian manufacture.

 

[paintballdude902]

nice rifle. i like using brass screws to repair cracks. drill a small hole the coat the threads of the screw in epoxy then screw it as deep as you need then cut it off and grind it smooth

 

[caribou]

Jobu07,

the bolts that gave the Finns trouble were the M-27 series when they aded "wings" and small slots in the reciver for them. After some combat, the bolts wer either replaced or had the "wings" ground down. Collectors value M-27 Mosin (Finn Army predecessor to the M-39) is increased if the bolt matches and has wings still.

As well as barrels, sights and stocks, all improved for comfort, carry and accuracy, the triggers were tuned and smoothed at the factory. Most Finn rifles that went through any armory were worked untill they could group 5 cm at 100m.

 

[jobu07]

Thanks for the heads up Caribou. Another bit of information to stash in the vault.