My local public gun range may close... looking for solutions.

[CoalTrain49]

This is the same reason all of our public land around here has been gated and locked. Lots of state and USFS land near me where we used to shoot. Old quarries make good places to shoot. People just can't seem to clean up after themselves and insist on dumping old appliances and garbage just about anywhere with vehicle access. There is one old quarry that is still used but the county sheriff patrols it and will issue a citation for littering.

Without any on site management of that area I don't think it will remain a place to shoot. Next up will be signs saying no shooting. Then police will start patrolling it.

Your best bet here is to convince the city that it's a needed rec facility. If you can get the city to realize it can get some revenue from it if they manage it properly you might have a chance to keep it. The airport probably has some way to limit access, our local small airport does. A sign in/out process is the first step. A small fee for the use of the facility is the next step.

It's my experience that these small city airports already have some security and administration staff. Most of the time they are under utilized which is typical for small towns. They may even have an airport administrator who you can talk to but I'm thinking you will have to organize a user group to have any hope of negotiating with the city.

Looks pretty bleak to me.

 

[mgresh]

The problem on the insurance side is that the carriers who insure municipalities don't want, or have any experience with, gun ranges. Gun ranges are a very specific and very limited market for insurers, and re-insurers. I work in insurance and represent most all reputable carriers in the country and I can't imagine any of them being ok with a shooting range with no rules, supervision, or organization, as part of any package of policies.

The best bet would be to somehow get the range as it's own stand alone entity, establish some policies and procedures, and look for a specialized carrier to take it.

 

[kBob]

Look into starting a strong NRA affiliate gun club with the idea of offering to lease the range and operate the range for member only use or open only when Member Range officers are present.

Club I belonged to did that 30 years back and still operates the range in the local airport authority area. Right next to the local Fair grounds and across the street from the Horsemans' Arena that has frequent shows. Had a round in a building some years back, but club demonstrated that could not have come from on the range. Range is fenced and locked when not under supervision. Shooters must sign in and out. RSOs must certify open in time and lock out time. The City is allowed to continue police training when the club has no event scheduled and for a bit police had entry fees for action type events and NRA handgun waived to encourage their participation (most only came a time or two until they found themselves in the lower third skill wise then quit coming)

Belonged to a club that ran a city owned range in another city a few years, using volunteers for range safety officers on behalf of the city. The range was fenced and locked when not under supervision. Same same on locks and logs. Local politics finally closed that one though despite our best efforts. Local Government was told that FAA objected to the operation, but later when FAA was asked they claimed the issue never came up. Just a local jerk with political connections basically lied to those in power to "do something" within two years a group of club members opened an expensive but operating private range. Now under the third set of owners it is still in business after 20 years.

Seriously contact your State and local NRA affiliates. Consider starting a CMP club as well. Make the safe operation of the range a community asset with hunter sight in days, family and youth shoots and sponsor NRA Basic Safety Courses and if you have 100 yards CMP Garand and Carbine shoots. Remind the local politicos that their voters NEED a safe place to shoot. Remind them that by closing down a range with out options like turning it over to a club that they are causing safety concerns.

-kBob

 

[George Dickel]

There is also the liability the city would incur should a shooter intentionally or unintentionally shoot an aircraft causing anything from a crash and fatalities to a hole in an aircraft. Most small towns don't have that kind of money to pay out in a law suit and there is a possibility the town's insurance policy might not cover that type of incident.

I shot once on a public range near Knoxville that was located on a former national guard base. You had to sign and pay a small fee at the entrance gate with a state employee but that person doesn't monitor the shooting line. There was a gun club that had a club house at the range and provided range officers to maintain discipline and safety. They played no games, you adhered to the rules or you were kicked off the range and if severe enough of a violation it could be a permanent banning from the facility. There is another public range on state property nearby that only has a person to allow admittance to the range, again that person doesn't monitor the firing line, in fact there is no one who is responsible for the safety and operation. The state installed cement block and concrete benches one week and before the next week ended some waste of air used an AR or AK to shoot the legs out from under the bench top. When unsupervised morons will do what morons do.

You might explore the possibilities of forming a gun club or talk to an existing club and see if you could do something like is done at that range I mentioned near Knoxville. The range would have to be fenced to keep out people when no one is there to supervise. Maybe the town would be interested in that type of partnership and build the fence with the club paying a percentage of the range fees to help cover those expenses and liability insurance. If the town council was smart they would install cameras at the building that was shot up. Don't expect the town to correct this problem because it is a potential law suit and a pain in the posterior to have to deal with the problems, it will have to be local shooters that have to stand up and try to save the range.

 

[fpgt72]

Problem is that anyone immature/uncaring enough to throw shots at that storage building would probably think it a lot of fun to see which one of them could hit the camera(s).

As long as they do not get the recorder and the cameras are placed well...let them, just add the charges up.

 

[Mad_Max]

There will be a city commission meeting a week from today and the range is on the agenda. We'll see what happens.

 

[CapnMac]

One of the larger difficulties in this situation is that the property is on an airport reservation.
It's incredibly hard to bifurcate property withing such a reservation without triggering a bunch of other conditions.
The joint agreements on these things get to book-size dimensions of expensive lawyerese very quickly.

I learned about this by being on the design team that built a hotel inside an international airport; the airport status was the least of the issues. All sorts of things get covered, like noise abatement, emergency situation, employee access, and more.

Sure, this is a podunk muni, but FAA rules still apply. Several DHS rules apply. State and local rules will also apply. Even when these have not been observed in the present or past.

As a minimum, expect that, if separated, the range would need its own drive access. Probably another berm facing the airport, and dedicated parking. Also, full accessibility upgrades. And, if lucky, probably only around 80 hours of attorney time.
It's do-able, but not necessarily an easy thing. Will require probably having to go and testify before the City Council, the airport board of governors (if not the City Council) and possibly County officials as well.

 

[WestKentucky]

Here is my rub, John Q Public is an idiot. He will destroy things in various manners and leave the mess for others to deal with. If confronted with his own idiocy he will roll off a list of things that entitle him to the right to do whatever he did. If forced to pay reparations he will either file bankruptcy or be unemployed and then have an excuse of why he can’t pay to fix that which he destroyed. We all know a few of these people, or at least know of them. So, with that in mind, have you, in good faith, found something of public use on your personal property and put up a sign telling people to come and take advantage of this resource? The answer is always a resounding and instant NO! You don’t want these people on your doorstep, so why should the mayor, the airport guy, the police chief, and the solid waste collection people all want to share the problem. The idiots ruin things for everybody else. Used to be that there was a way of the public straightening out the idiots on their own time and in their own ways, but such is not the case anymore.

My suggestion, buy 30 acres that is arranged in a long and narrow tract. Put the berm smack dab in the middle and put up fences. Post signs saying that it’s a shooting range and no trespassing, private property etc. Once it’s set up allow the Sheriff’s office and city police to use it as a range. Police traffic deters the idiots.

 

[exbrit49]

I will do Speedo66 one better. Get a group of friends that use the range; incorporate a non-profit gun club; lease the site from the city; only gun club members can use the range. If the rent and upkeep is low then club dues can also be low.

Edit Also perhaps more such "bays" can be created and this used as a competition range.

Great idea. I'll bet the city and the county would be willing to even provide fill dirt to construct a larger or additional berm! Go to the city meetings, well dressed with a good plan and have a well informed well spoken person to present your case to the council. We had to do this several years ago for a flying site. By being polite and with a good plan you might get them to work with you. I agree also with many of the other comments, you will need a volunteer range master at all times the range is open. In our case members pay a deposit for an entry key and it is returned if they leave the club. Hope all goes well for you.

 

[BilliamB.]

I belong to a small, rural club that's organized along similar lines, though the land is club owned. Dues are a modest $50 a year, so it's through the good will and efforts of our members that the range is maintained and everything runs smoothly. Sadly, this being New York State, membership is both graying and declining. Nonetheless, it's a good model to emulate if you can assemble a well intentioned group of responsible shooters who are willing to do a little work.

 

[bob40caliber]

Contact a local police or sheriff dept.
Speak to whomever is in charge of their training.
Throw out an idea of a joint range with their dept. And a local gun club with strict vetting of members and extreme safety rules.
If no such gun club exists......create it!
This shared type of venue has worked in places I have lived......And your worries of being shut down in the future would be greatly reduced.

 

[Swifty Morgan]

their insurance co will make them shut the range down if they cant protect the building.

I would try to extend the berm or see about paying to move the building.

A small berm very close to the building would be ideal, since it would cover a wider angle of attack and discourage morons and chimps from shooting.

 

[Mad_Max]

I just wanted to update this thread to mention that NOTHING has happened, apparently the insurance company has not gotten back with the administrators to discuss the range so until it does there is no further action. A great example of bureaucracy (or is it gridlock) .

 

[shoobe01]

Don't assume it'll all be fine. Continue planning.

My city has been selling property off to private entities (another gripe, but man do I get gripey about it) including a pending deal for a dog park which will be private and they are going to vacate the park land that it will take over.

This makes me think it may well be plausible to: make a club, make a plan that includes background checks on members, access control, and monitoring (video should do), then a thing where you have exclusive... whatever the city will go for. Ownership that reverts to the city if you fold is one way.

Start visiting local LE agency and private security org training officers and see where they shoot for quals, if not legit training time. If they are hard up for it, or use this place already, get them on board and give them a deal on the time they use the range (they mostly do bankers hours, so give them a few days a week and it will hardly interfere with member usage). Then, you have a pile more people on your side when the city comes back to deal with this.

 

[Mike OTDP]

Concur with keeping up the planning efforts. At a minimum, that range probably needs a baffle system to keep stray rounds contained.