Need 1,000 yard .223 load data, AR-15, 20" barrel, any bullet

[IMtheNRA]

I'd like to shoot my first 1,000 yard prone match that a local club is hosting next month.

My best 600 yard target load, using 69-gr SMKs at a bit over 2,600 fps muzzle vel goes subsonic after 700 yards, but surprisingly, it still hits at 1,000 yards without tumbling. Accuracy, is another story however. When I tried it at 1,000 a couple of weeks ago, I printed a 15 shot pattern of about 28 inches, mostly in the black. Two of the 17 rounds fired were nowhere to be found.

If you have a safe, and preferably published 1,000 yard load for your .223 AR-15, please let me know so that I can start experimenting this weekend.

The range altitude is about 5,200 feet and the temperature is expected to be around 65-80 degrees F.

If your load data results in mag length rounds, that would be a huge bonus, but since the match is single loading only, I can live with oversized rounds made for ejection port feeding.

I realize that .223 is not the ideal round for 1,000 shooting, but lets save that for another thread

Thanks in advance for load data and any of your actual personal real world experiences shooting your own loads with a .223 AR at 1,000 yards.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Does the match rules require using a .223? If not what do most iwf the competitors use?

It will be extremely difficult to achieve accuracy with a .223 out to 1000 yards because the wind will effect the bullet greatly especially since time in the air is extended by loss of velocity.

 

[IMtheNRA]

No, I can use any rifle and cartridge I want to. I just think it would be fun to stretch this .223 rifle to the limit and see how it and I do at 1000, even if we lose out to better cartridges and shooters.

 

[bangswitch]

Taking a .223 out to 1000 yards is sort of like shooting skeet using full chokes; you can do it, but you're really handicapping yourself and you have to be extra good.

You want a bullet with the best possible BC and push it as fast as you can, to keep as much velocity as possible as long as possible.

Look at something like a Hornady AMAX 80 grain (BC 0.453), using either CFE-223 at 26 grains, or BL-C(2) at 26 grains. Both will give a MV around 2800 fps. You can also use Power Pro Varmint at 25.5 grains. The ultimate bullet might be a 90 grain Sierra Match King (BC 0.563), but you'd need a 1:6.5 twist to properly stabilize it. You should have 1:8 for the AMAX. Powder loads for the SMK should be about 0.5 grain less than for the AMAX.

If you don't have a barrel with those fast twists, you'll have to risk the bullets not stabilizing, or just have to settle for a bullet in the 75 grain range, and hope it has the legs for the distance. BTW, these are both single-load rounds, too long for magazine feed. They should load around 2.390 COL.

 

[WestKentucky]

I just hope for your sake that the wind is from straight behind. Your looking at nearly 2 seconds in the air. It will move around, a lot. Be very deliberate in powder drops. At 1k on a sub-standard chambering I would not be suprised at all if the minuscule difference caused by a single granule of powder is noticeable on the vertical spread. Weigh, trim, and neck condition the brass too, get the cases absolutely as uniform as possible. Good luck, show us your rig and your targets.

 

[tkroenlein]

28" might be way outside of what it takes to be competitive at your particular game, but just over 2.5 MOA really doesn't sound too bad considering your load wasn't at all up to the task. Can't offer any load data, but I will wish you good luck!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BigBore45]

I think to shoot accurately and expect any sort of acceptable group from a .223 the max range is 600 yards. It's just to slow and light of bullet to deal with wind. YMMV

 

[Bart B.]

In the NRA's competitive shooting, a 28 inch group at 1000 yards is 2.8 MOA. The standard is one inch per hundred yards; 1 MOA.

A single kernel of powder difference in charge weight for charges at 24 to 25 grains is insignificant. There's 3 or 4 kernels per 1/10th grain of powder. A tenth grain of powder in the .223 Rem makes an average muzzle velocity change of about 12 fps; a single kernel would change it by about 3 fps. How is that resolved if the muzzle velocity spread of 25 fps is what happens? Charge weight spreads of 1/10th grain is good enough; the variables in primer output and powder composition cause a greater spread in muzzle velocity than a kernel of powder or even a 1/10th grain change for that matter.

Sierra's load data suggests the following for best accuracy for these bullets in AR's with a 1:7 twist barrel using Remington cases and Rem 7.5 primers:

69-gr. HPMK, 25.3 grains of Varget for 2750 fps. Wind drift about 13 inches per mph at 1000 yards.

77-gr. HPMK, 24.1 grains of Viht N140 for 2600 fps. Wind drift about 12 inches per mph.

28 inch groups at 1000 yards is what the M72 .30-06 match ammo shot when it was popular for long range matches. But the target's high scoring 5-ring was 36 inches diameter back then. Nowadays, its 10-ring is 20 inches.

Full length size your cases and don't crimp bullets in place. Keep powder charges to a 1/10th grain spread. Seat bullets a few thousandths short of the lands then single load them for best accuracy. People have won 1000-yard matches with new, unprepped .223 Rem cases, so all that hoopla about case sorting and uniforming is not needed.

While the popular myth of shooting bullets as fast as possible is best for long range matches, such max loads are rarely, if ever, the most accurate. I'd rather have a load that tested 1 MOA for 20 shots at 1000 yards leaving 100 fps slower than a load that shot 1.25 MOA for 20 shots. The 3/4 inch wind drift difference is insignificant but the 2.5 inch group size difference is. You can correct for wind drift on the firing line; you cannot correct for accuracy of your load when you're shooting.

 

[IMtheNRA]

Does anyone have a published load that remained supersonic at 1,000 yards when fired from a 20-inch AR-15? I haven't been able to find one on the .net

 

[WestKentucky]

Bart B you must be using a different powder than I'm used to. If your using flake or grain powders you might be right. Spherical powders would be a pretty significant difference. Spherical wouldn't be a great choice for extreme distance anyway just because you can't dial it in exactly the same each time.

 

[Bart B.]

I don't think any powder can be "dialed in" with a powder measure or a scale "exactly" for a given charge weight. I've counted the individual powder units (flake, ball or tiny tube) to get a tenth grain change in charge weight for flake, ball and extruded powders. There's a few to several tiny units per tenth grain depending on the make and type of powder of all shapes and sizes.

Nobody I know gets best accuracy with any ball powder in centerfire rifle cartridges. I and others have seen a 2/10ths to 3/10ths grain spread of extruded powders produce much better accuracy than exact weights of ball powders with both about the same burning speed for a given bullet weight in a given cartridge.

Here's a chart showing different powders' fps change per 1/10th grain of charge weight:



Note: formula for 10th grain change with velocity only 50 fps apart is 5 / (fast weight - slow weight).

 

[LeonCarr]

Take a look at the Sierra Tipped Matchking Bullets.

With a 77 Grain TMK at 2750 fps in the .223, it looks like it will stay supersonic at 1000 yards. They can also be loaded to magazine length.

Please follow all safe reloading practices.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

 

[Kaldor]

Take a look at the Sierra Tipped Matchking Bullets.

With a 77 Grain TMK at 2750 fps in the .223, it looks like it will stay supersonic at 1000 yards. They can also be loaded to magazine length.

Please follow all safe reloading practices.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

Was my thoughts as well. The 77gr TMKs are about the longest bullets you can load to mag length. I run mine at 2.265" and the plastic tips just touch the front of my Lancer mags. Im using 23.1gr of IMR 8208 XBR and CCI 400 primers. No pressure signs. Barrel is a 8 twist Green Mountain 18" rifle length gas, 5.56 chamber. Groups at 100 yards are .5" inch. I could probably shrink them down more, but I need to do a better job on case prep.

The only other option is to run 80's or heavier/longer, but single feed them.

 

[73ch13]

Kudos to Bart for giving a data supported response, ill be bookmarking this for sure.