Need some info on a M1917 New Service Colt revolver

[stonebuster]

I saw an old Colt Model 1917 4" 45 ACP revolver today at my LGS. It's finish is dull blued and it may be a US Army(WW1) model. It's got the hard rubber grips with the Colt name at the top. Serial number is 294764. It appears to be in very nice condition and I was wondering about it's collector's value. I read a lot of these ended up in stock rooms and sold as surplus guns later. This may be one of those because it looks so good for a 100 year old gun. Anyone have any knowledge of this model?

 

[Chevelle SS]

Is it a 4" barrel or a 5.5" barrel? If it is 4" it has been cut-down. Probably in the $500 to $650 if so modified, unmodified $700 to $900.

 

[stonebuster]

Is it a 4" barrel or a 5.5" barrel? If it is 4" it has been cut-down. Probably in the $500 to $650 if so modified, unmodified $700 to $900.

It's definitely not 5.5" but I'll have to have them take it out of the case tomorrow and take a close look.

 

[dfariswheel]

If it's a Colt Model 1917 it originally had a 5 1/2 inch barrel, smooth walnut grips, and a satin brushed blue finish.
Many were parkerized for WWII.

It will be stamped on the butt with a US Army stamp and a USGI serial number, and will have a lanyard loop, or at least the hole for one.
It also has a Colt factory serial number. Some people can tell you the year and even month it was made by the US serial on the butt.

Colt factory number 294764 was made in 1920.
The New Service numbers started that year at 260000.
1921 began at 315000.

 

[stonebuster]

If it's a Colt Model 1917 it originally had a 5 1/2 inch barrel, smooth walnut grips, and a satin brushed blue finish.
Many were parkerized for WWII.

It will be stamped on the butt with a US Army stamp and a USGI serial number, and will have a lanyard loop, or at least the hole for one.
It also has a Colt factory serial number. Some people can tell you the year and even month it was made by the US serial on the butt.

Colt factory number 294764 was made in 1920.
The New Service numbers started that year at 260000.
1921 began at 315000.

Good info, thanks, I read somewhere that the hard black rubber grips were used until mid-late twenties.

 

[ApacheCoTodd]

A 4 inch 1917 would be cool, cooler still as a S&W.

I certainly would not pay any vintage premium for a cut-down though and the crown should be suspect until you know better.

Too, I'd CLOSELY inspect for use related wear and other tinkering before plopping down too much for it.

Still, it sounds like just the thing to catch my eye. One of my favorite pistols is a *ruined* S&W *lend-lease*/*open purchase* .38. I probably, in fact, over paid for it but it really spoke to me upon seeing it.

Todd.

 

[indy1919a4]

A 4 inch 1917 would be cool, cooler still as a S&W.

I certainly would not pay any vintage premium for a cut-down though and the crown should be suspect until you know better.

Too, I'd CLOSELY inspect for use related wear and other tinkering before plopping down too much for it.

Still, it sounds like just the thing to catch my eye. One of my favorite pistols is a *ruined* S&W *lend-lease*/*open purchase* .38. I probably, in fact, over paid for it but it really spoke to me upon seeing it.

Todd.
View attachment 891688

I am intrigued with that trigger & guard.. It looks like someone bobbed the bottom of the trigger to make that trigger guard work..

 

[ApacheCoTodd]

I am intrigued with that trigger & guard.. It looks like someone bobbed the bottom of the trigger to make that trigger guard work..

It was from an Air Force officer who ran across a bunch of them in the U.K. in his day.

It had a semi-bobbed hammer and the trigger and guard are reshaped along with the shortened barrel for pocket carrying by some force or other. He said that most were a bit longer retaining the barrel lug to engage the ejector rod.

Of course - it's hogged out to .38 Special too.

I re-installed - as I HAD to - the lanyard-swivel. I love lanyard loops.

Shoots great and points like my index finger.

A sporterized milsurp pistol. It'll be interesting seeing the 4 inch 1917 if he gets it.

Todd.

 

[indy1919a4]

I re-installed - as I HAD to - the lanyard-swivel. I love lanyard loops.

Todd.

What's to explain...lanyard loops are beautiful things. Nice read, thanks..

 

[stonebuster]

Is it a 4" barrel or a 5.5" barrel? If it is 4" it has been cut-down. Probably in the $500 to $650 if so modified, unmodified $700 to $900.

When I quickly looked at it yesterday through the display cabinet I thought it was a 3" After researching for a couple hours and not seeing any 3". I figured it may have just looked that short because it's such a beefy looking revolver. I measured it today and it's been cut down to three inches. There's no real crown to it but just looks rounded. The top of the barrel was marked Colt A45 and the bottom was marked United States Property. The bottom of the grip frame had a hole for the lanyard but no numbers. Inside the yoke was marked with the serial number only. The overall condition is very good and the cylinder locks up as tight as my 5 year old GP100s and tighter than my well used model 10 Smiths. They're asking $695 which is probably high for a modified model and it doesn't really fit any real use for me. If it hadn't been chopped down and the price was lower I'd think about it. Thanks for the information! I learned some things here, so that's a positive.

 

[Chevelle SS]

I'd pass at $695 as well.

 

[ApacheCoTodd]

Sounds like 695 is high and high enough for me that reasonable haggling still wouldn't get it to what I'd wan to pay.

From the brief description, I'd hope for them to be asking more like 495 and even at that, I'd want the final number to be close up to either side of 400.

In the end, it is merely a .45 acp, moon-clip dependent revolver. A well made one and worthy in its own right but nudging 700 doesn't seem any where near a bargain unless one was already in the market for that overall configuration.

What it is, I like. What it costs? Not so much.

Todd.

 

[stonebuster]

I've never used moon clips and I'm curious about the cylinder on this revolver. The cylinder is not cut or recessed to accommodate moon clips. Would moon clips have sat flush with the cylinder? It looks like any other cylinder to me

 

[Coyote3855]

The barrel has been cut down from 5.5 inches and the grips are not original to the gun. $695 is high. I bought a Colt 1917 that had been reblued for $300 a couple years ago.

 

[dfariswheel]

Without more details we can't be sure WHAT it is.
If there's no US stamps and number on the butt it may have been ground off.
If it's a Model 1917 chambered for the .45 ACP it would be machined for half-moon clips.
Early guns did not have the "steps" in the chambers so they couldn't be fired without clips.
Later production could be fired without clips, but couldn't eject the fired cases. You had to use a pencil or stick.

Colt military Model 1917 revolvers used smooth walnut grips.
Commercial models used hard black rubber with molded in checkering up until some time in the late 1920's.

 

[Tallball]

Sounds like some kind of Frankenstein or Bubba deal.

It might be worth more than $500 as a shooter, but it's not worth more than $500 (IMHO).

 

[ApacheCoTodd]

Not relieved for moon-clips?.... This thing sounds weirder and weirder as you go along.

S&W's cylinders were cut to be run with or without clips but of course, extraction could then be an issue. Maybe someone cobbled this up or custom built a .45 auto-rim in the day.

Personally, this is looking more and more like a project/curiosity gun and as such.... closer to or below $150.00 to me.

Based solely upon piecing the descriptions together.

Todd.

 

[Monac]

Maybe it is an ordinary commercial New Service in 45 Colt that has been rebarreled. That would explain the cylinder and the grips. Surplus 1917 barrels used to be quite cheap.

Photographs would be useful, of course.