New, but 'linkless' barrel..

[saltydog452]

OK, so you have a new 1911 barrel, not 'E-Z Fit' or 'gunsmith fit', just a new OEM Colt Gold Cup or similar barrel. But it does not have a link installed.

How do you go about selecting the correct size link to use? Should the link be in constant contact with the cross pin of the slide stop, or just in the area where the cross pin rests at the bottom of the feet?

I did a search on 'link' and rec'd 400 hits. My 'puter timed out after page 27.

thanks,

salty.

 

[HSMITH]

Take a look at this site http://www.schuemann.com/ and the timing test kit tab.

A good primer for what you need to look for. Kuhnhausen manual would be a good idea too.

Not rocket science by any means, but it has to be done right.

 

[saltydog452]

Thanks..

Thank you Mr. Smith,

I've read the information on the Schuemann site and will re-read it. I did get the impression from the Schuemann site that their test kit is kinda pricey for one-time use and that it requires a bit more expertise to conduct and interpet than I possess. Gain twist barrels may be the ultimate in accuracy from a fixture or Naval guns, but I THINK accuracy from a handgun barrel has more to do with the fitting, rather than gain-twist. I dunno. If I remember right, the current Civilian record for NRA Outdoor Pistol at Camp Perry is still 2677. And it wasn't done with a Schuemann barrel. If I am mistaken, I will apologise and stand corrected.

i don't want to get this off on some kind of oblique tangent, just would like to have some input, for myself and possibly other members, of the consideration needed to select a link for a repacement, non gunsmith fitted barrel, into a 1911.

Thanks,

salty.

 

[1911Tuner]

Link

Howdy Salty,

If you're fitting a full, hard-fit barrel...first ya gotta get the lower lug cut for good vertical lockup, and then select your link. They come in different on-center lengths to allow for varying frame to slide to barrel specs...and sometimes things have to be fine-tuned to get just the right fit. The Wilson #3 is .278 on-center, adn will work in most guns that fall within what is known as mid-spec dimensions. It may not be perfect for the lower lug geometry though. Might cause the barrel to ride the link...lock on the link...or both...or neither. Depends on several unknowns until they become known.

As a wise pistolsmith once said:

"I only know what I can measure."

 

[saltydog452]

'I only know whqt I can measure'..

The problem is, I don't measure all that good. What I did was measure both of the holes, add the total, divide by two. Then add the length of the space between the holes. That gave me .276. Visually, I can see that the cross pin is almost, but not quite, touching the radius on the lower lug. It (the cross pin) fits nicely into the area at the bottom of the feet.

Its just a plain valilla barrel, not 'E-Z Fit' or 'Gunsmith Fit'. Just curious as to how to go about selecting an approrriate link w/o breaking anything.

Thanks,

salty.

 

[1911Tuner]

Link

To accurately measure the center to center spacing, you need to measure across closely fitting pins or drill rods, and subtract half the diameter of each rod. A caliper measures to plus/minus .001 inch.

You said:


>I can see that the cross pin is almost, but not quite, touching the radius on the lower lug. It (the cross pin) fits nicely into the area at the bottom of the feet.<

That's a pretty good fit, Salty. The barrel is riding the link a little, but doesn't lock on the link. If the amount of "ride' at the lug radius is within .003 inch or so, you can get the barrel off the link by elongating the top of the hole a little...carefully.

The next thing to check is the barrel linkdown and drop timing. Remember the .015 inch clearance at .250 inch of rearward slide travel. You also need to make sure that the vertical impact surface in the frame is stopping the barrel instead of the link. If you've got the clearance between the top of the barrel and the slide, you can stand pat for now.

To make sure that the link isn't stopping the barrel due to a short link...vertical impact surface located too far rearward...or lower lug located too far forward...do this:

Assemble the gun, leaving the slidestop arm hanging vertically. Lock the slide back and push the barrel all the way down and back firmly. if the slidestop arm will swing freely, you're golden. If it's tight, you've got a problem with one of the above areas. If there's just TINY bit of bind, you're probably okay...but no more than it takes to move the arm with just a light flick of a fingernail...about the same force that you'd use to tickle a baby's nose. If the arm will move with that little bit of force, it's probably okay.

 

[HSMITH]

The timing checks are what I was after, Tuner explained them also. You don't need the Schuemann kit, just the information of what to check. If the timing is off the new barrel will be junked in a hurry and may take the slide and slide stop with it. Timing is where you need to focus, especially with a 'pre-fit' barrel.

 

[saltydog452]

Thanks..

Gents, thank you very much. I think I got it.

Mr. Smith, re-reading my previous post, it seemed kinda blunt. That was not my intention. I appreciate your resonses to my questions and the time that you took to try to explain to a knucklehead like me.

Tuner, you may remember from previous conversations we had about 'The Kart In The Nork' where I managed to fit a Kart 'E-Z Fit' barrel to the second lug. I've fired a few hundred rounds or so through the Kart in the Nork since then and there is now a slight ammount of to and fro free play when the barrel is in the slide w/o the recoil spring in place. Not much, just barely noticeable, maybe the thickness of a sheet of paper. If this Kart is going to 'slap seat' itself, it hasn't happened yet. There is a club member here who is about to send off his Colt to Clark. I was thinking that I'd offer to buy his 'take-off' Colt barrel, but wanted a bit more information before I bought the thing and wound up with another paperweight.

Again, thanks to both of you for your insight and patience.

salty.

 

[HSMITH]

Salty, no sweat on my end. I should have been more clear about what I was linking you there FOR. Take care.

 

[1911Tuner]

Slap Seat

Salty sayeth:

>there is now a slight ammount of to and fro free play when the barrel is in the slide w/o the recoil spring in place. Not much, just barely noticeable, maybe the thickness of a sheet of paper. If this Kart is going to 'slap seat' itself, it hasn't happened yet.<
**************************

With that small amount of end-play...a sheet of paper is about .004 inch thick...it won't slap-seat very quickly, and if there's .004 inch until the next lug comes into play, it'll probably take several thousand rounds to do it.
Slap-seating occurs quickly when there's a lot of end-play...in the neighborhood of .012 inch or more. The stock barrel in your Norinco probably had .015 to .020 inch.

 

[saltydog452]

Thanx Tuner. I'm giving serious considerqtion to buying this thing. I have a link that, according to previous posts, ain't too awful. Headspace is .888 + .013 as best as I can measure. No bushing though...no lathe available to fit one either, but I think I can work that out.

Ohhh, by the way, I fimnally had to trash that trigger that had the nasty habit of occasionally failing to re-set. Might coulda fixed it, but no faith in it. I really wanted to use it as it was a 'medium' length. Found another the same length but annodized black aluminum and w/o a set screw to mess stuff up.

As a side note, and not per-zactly gun related, I thought I'd try to sneek this in..have you heard any news about BluesBear? I think Mike is located on the same coast and Jammer is in the Sea-Tac area, I kinda wondered if anyone had heard from Blues Bear? If it isn't appropriate to respond on this forum, please feel free to PM me.

Thanx,

sd.

 

[BEARMAN]

GOTO www.blindhogg.com/gunsmithing look under
"barrels". Sometimes a picture or someone saying the same thing a different way makes things clearer. A bunch of helpful info.