New Shooter: A Slug seems loose

[twofewscrews]

Hi,

New to the forum, new to the wonderful world of shotguns. Sorry in advance for a wall of text (I've been told I'm long winded sometimes). I just purchased my first shotgun. An ugly little beast, a Maverick 88 12 gauge Security/Field combo. I have yet to put any rounds through her but I purchased some Federal #8 target loads for skeet (NIB), some 00 buck for "things" (NIB), and a pack of Remington Slugs. The slugs, it turns out, were not new nor were they all the same brand. The store I purchased them from is a pawn shop/range/gun store so its my fault for not checking to make sure they were brand new or that they were all the same brand.

The Remington slugs were the standard 2 3/4 1oz rifled slugs sold in a five pack (box number thingy SP12RS). I got home and opened the pack to find that the pack of five was actually four Remington slugs (proper green) and a Federal slug (red). The slug I'm worried about is the Federal slug.

The slug in question is the 2 3/4 Federal slug in the red case. The wording is faded on it but I am pretty sure it reads Federal Maximum Super Slug.
The issue is the slug or rather the cartridge has a little rattle in it. The slug itself does not have any play but when I shake it I can feel/hear something rattling in the base of the round. I searched the internet and found out that sometimes the powder rattles or the wad separates but most of that was dealing with bird or buck shot.

My questions are:
Is the slug in question safe to shoot?
Is this considered normal or abnormal for slug? What about birdshot or buckshot?
What is the cause of the noise I'm hearing/feeling?
What should I be looking out for in regards to shotgun shell defects?

Thanks for your time and sorry for the wall of text,
TwoFewScrews

 

[kudu]

I believe you have nothing to worry about. I have seen slugs that were (loose), but most of the pack was also. Slugs are rolled into the plastic and set. Sometimes they are a bit loose when done.

Bird shot and buck will sometimes rattle, nothing to worry about there as well. I only worry about reloaded ammunition unless I know they came from a trusted source. I reload all my own and have never had a problem except a couple shells a bit low on powder that went Pop instead of bang, check barrel to make sure the wad came out and continue shooting. Out of a few hundred thousand shotshells loaded over the years I don't think that is too bad.

 

[kudu]

What is the cause of the noise I'm hearing/feeling?

I'm guessing it is the powder that sets in the base and has some air space to shift around. And welcome to the high Road

 

[a_canadian]

Seems to me the safer decision with any questionable ammunition is to throw it away. Especially if it's just a single round or a small box. Ammunition prices may be up by a quite a bit, but is it really worth risk to your safety, or even the safety of your firearm, to just load up a questionable round and let it off to see what happens? Looking at what happened a while back to that guy shooting some unknown 'slap rounds' in .50BMG, how close he came to dying when his very solidly build Serbu single shot blasted into pieces... it's just not worth the risk. I understand your curiousity about the shell but it's just that, a curiousity, not worth risking your health nor your shotgun.

 

[earlthegoat2]

Slugs can and do shake around within the loaded hull. I notice it more with fosters but sabots can too.

 

[PapaG]

If you think the slugs are loose in the case, open one up and drop it down the barrel. Foster slugs are notoriously and intentionally undersize. This so they can safely be shot through even tight full chokes. Some guns are pretty accurate with them out to 75 yards or so. I'm working on an article about my sixty years of shooting, making, casting, loading and playing with a dozen kinds of slugs...and I'm still behind the curve having discovered some new Russian and other designs.

 

[twofewscrews]

Thanks for the warm welcome and your input. If I end up shooting it I'll be sure to pay attention to the sound it makes and check the barrel before firing/chambering another round.

I'm guessing it is the powder that sets in the base and has some air space to shift around. And welcome to the high Road

I believe you have nothing to worry about. I have seen slugs that were (loose), but most of the pack was also. Slugs are rolled into the plastic and set. Sometimes they are a bit loose when done.

Bird shot and buck will sometimes rattle, nothing to worry about there as well. I only worry about reloaded ammunition unless I know they came from a trusted source. I reload all my own and have never had a problem except a couple shells a bit low on powder that went Pop instead of bang, check barrel to make sure the wad came out and continue shooting. Out of a few hundred thousand shotshells loaded over the years I don't think that is too bad.

 

[mjsdwash]

I cast and load my own slugs, and have a rattle. I'm not sure exactly why, but only the slugs do it. The rattle wouldn't worry me.

That said, I would not shoot any of it. Around here we have a pawn shop that sells shotshells in that fashion, and they're just reloads anyone can sell them, no questions asked. A friend bought them a few times, and could have easily trashed his gun, but was shooting a double barrel, so even though no one stopped him in time (squib) nothing blew up. There were many in the box he bought that didn't make it out of the barrel. Several had extreme powder degradation as well. Lots of horror stories of degraded powder.

 

[twofewscrews]

Seems to me the safer decision with any questionable ammunition is to throw it away. Especially if it's just a single round or a small box. Ammunition prices may be up by a quite a bit, but is it really worth risk to your safety, or even the safety of your firearm, to just load up a questionable round and let it off to see what happens? Looking at what happened a while back to that guy shooting some unknown 'slap rounds' in .50BMG, how close he came to dying when his very solidly build Serbu single shot blasted into pieces... it's just not worth the risk. I understand your curiousity about the shell but it's just that, a curiousity, not worth risking your health nor your shotgun.

Yea I heard about that one. From what I understand it was due to ignorance (not meant as a poke at him or to demean him) regarding how the rounds functioned and how they interacted with the gun. The rounds he was using caused a blockage in his barrel. He mistook the high and low hits as being "hot" rounds or something, or they were in fact "hot" rounds, but that is not what caused the explosion. In reality the low hits and high hits were a result of uneven pressure in the barrel due to the blockage caused by the slap rounds plastic sabot thingy melting as he fired repeated rounds out of it.
That being said, you make a valid point. High prices or curiosity is not worth the price of an eye or worse.
The round in question does not seem to have a defect other then the sound/feeling of looseness and so far, based on the information I have been told here and found on the interwebs, the round should be fine.
I'm leaning towards shooting it . . . or at least I was until mjsdwash pointed out that given the source and how they came it might be a reload.

 

[twofewscrews]

I cast and load my own slugs, and have a rattle. I'm not sure exactly why, but only the slugs do it. The rattle wouldn't worry me.

That said, I would not shoot any of it. Around here we have a pawn shop that sells shotshells in that fashion, and they're just reloads anyone can sell them, no questions asked. A friend bought them a few times, and could have easily trashed his gun, but was shooting a double barrel, so even though no one stopped him in time (squib) nothing blew up. There were many in the box he bought that didn't make it out of the barrel. Several had extreme powder degradation as well. Lots of horror stories of degraded powder.

I hadn't even considered it might be a reload. Is there any reliable way to tell if the round is reloaded? or if the powder has degraded?

 

[twofewscrews]

If you think the slugs are loose in the case, open one up and drop it down the barrel. Foster slugs are notoriously and intentionally undersize. This so they can safely be shot through even tight full chokes. Some guns are pretty accurate with them out to 75 yards or so. I'm working on an article about my sixty years of shooting, making, casting, loading and playing with a dozen kinds of slugs...and I'm still behind the curve having discovered some new Russian and other designs.

I'm more worried about some kind of adverse discharge. A user on here pointed out that people are not always the brightest and that ammo companies that produce slugs most likely make the rounds small enough to fit through everything up to a full choke so as to avoid accidents and lawsuits.

 

[SixteenGauge]

Every single 2 3/4 federal slug I've ever shot rattled around. Don't worry about it.

 

[mjsdwash]

I hadn't even considered it might be a reload. Is there any reliable way to tell if the round is reloaded? or if the powder has degraded?

I have never seen a starcrimp on a factory slug, but lots of people can rollcrimp at home. If its fully enclosed in plastic, and you cant see either the bullet (slug) or a flat piece of cardboard, but rather a swirl shape formed from the case, I would assume its a reload. I could be wrong, I'm not as much a shotgun guy as many here, but thats my experience.
Its common enough to reload slugs with a starcrimp like you would find on trap loads. I know I use a starcrimp on reloaded slugs.
https://www.ammunitiontogo.com/lodge/rolled-vs-folded-crimping/

 

[Riomouse911]

Some slugs will have a plastic, cardboard or fiber wad between the powder and base of the slug. It could be the powder has clumped in the base, leaving a gap between the powder and the bottom of the wad. If the wad is loose in the shell casing, that could be the source of your rattle.

For training new Deputy DAs about firearms, several years ago I created a bunch of cut-away shotshells from Win 1oz Foster slugs and 00 buck. I pulled the powder (using a toothpick to loosen it) and replaced it with Model train sand, then sealed with clear glue allowing the student to see the insides of a shotshells without risk of powder ignition. I was amazed that in these shotgun shells the powder was usually in a clump at the base of the shotshells... while in airtight cartridge cases the powder usually remains loose.




For birdshot shotgun shells I used clear tubes used for dimes as “shotgun hulls” and put the railroad sand, wad and birdshot inside to create a see-through, 360 degree visual of the interior.



These (and others I’ve created) have been a big help in my 4 and 8 hour lectures.

Stay safe.

 

[Riomouse911]

Having just read the previous post, if you’re not familiar with the star or roll crimp that was described here is a pic.

Orange OO buck is a star crimp enclosing the end of the shell. It’s good for holding loose shot and buffering materials in the shell and (if a solid crimp like this one) a star crimp helps keep water out, too.

The red Foster slug with the open end has a roll crimp holding the solid projectile in place.



Stay safe.