Old load data for Accurate #5, Lead 158 Grn 38 Spl

[lagerratrobe]

Hi All,

Sorry for picking up a VERY old and well worn trail, but I'm somewhat frustrated by lack of data. I had a hard drive failure awhile back and I lost the copies of old reloading manuals that I had squirreled away.

I'm trying to work up some 38 Spl loads to shoot from a Ruger Service Six revolver and there appear to be large gaps in the current Accurate #5 loads, at least compared to what I recall of older data that I think I've seen.

Current, published load data from Western Powders

powder|bullet|brand|type |min_grn|min_fps|max_grn|max_fps|max_psi|OAL
------|------|-----|------|-------|-------|-------|-------|-------|----
No.5 |158 |MCB |SWC BB|5.3 |827 |5.9 |940 |16,100 |1.481

I was out earlier this week to test my 1st attempts and am feeling a bit stuck. I tried one set of loads at 5.2 grns and one at 6 grns. Both shot "ok", but the 6 grn load was more accurate, albeit very dirty. I'd like to bump up gradually until I find the "clean spot", but of course, I'm already at the published max.

I would expect to see some hotter loads listed, that bump up closer to the 17,500 SAAMI spec, and also some +P loads that go up into the 20,000 psi range, but I don't see it at that bullet weight. In any case, without getting into the hot mess of debating the right or wrong of this, I'm very curious if some of the older reloading guides had a wider range of loads shown?

I'm not looking to make .357 rated rounds here, but I feel like I should have more room to work up this load.

Thanks for any data you can provide,

Roger

 

[LiveLife]

38 Spl ... Ruger Service Six ... Accurate #5 ... 158 gr SWC

tried one set of loads at 5.2 grns and one at 6 grns. Both shot "ok", but the 6 grn load was more accurate, albeit very dirty. I'd like to bump up gradually until I find the "clean spot", but of course, I'm already at the published max.

Here's Speer load data for your reference - https://reloadingdata.speer.com/downloads/speer/reloading-pdfs/handgun/38_Special_158_L.pdf

• .38 Spl 158 gr LSWC No. 5 COL 1.44" Start 5.8 gr (874 fps) - Max 6.2 gr (922 fps)

 

[BBarn]

Western Powders listed the following Accurate #5 38 Special +P loads in their last manual:

158gr. Berrys Plated Flat Point, 5.8gr, 891 fps, 6.4gr, 980 fps, 1.43"OAL

158gr. Nosler JHP, 5.6gr, 886 fps, 6.2gr, 983 fps, 1.43"OAL

 

[tominboise]

Here ya go, from the Accurate manual itself, issue #1

 

[Slamfire]

My standard for the 38 Special is a 158 grain bullet going 760 fps in a four inch barrel. This is based on my early chronographing of factory loads. I do not see any particular reason to push my reloads faster. This load with AA#5 is just where I want to be, plus or minus the vagaries of chronograph alignment and temperature.


S&W M64-5 Four inch barrel.

158 JSP RMR Bullets 6.2 grs AA#5 lot DM mixed nickel cases WSP
10-Jun-20 T = 88 °F

Ave Vel = 771.4
Std Dev = 39.35
ES = 143
High = 836.6
Low = 693.5
N = 19

When I have chronographed factory +P ammunition in my pistols, I get velocities above 850 fps. Velocity is not pressure, but I am of the opinion that 158 grain bullets moving 850 fps plus, are going to be producing +P pressures. And I don't want that. Notice how the same ammunition, same gun, different days, the average velocity is a little different. Temperature does make a difference, but there is also the issue of instrumentation variance. It is hard to know if the difference in velocities is due to temperature, or off axis alignment of the barrel with respect to the chronograph. And six shots have very little statistical significance. I trust my 32 round velocity data more than six shots. But, six will give a ball park.


4" M66-2

Zero Factory 158gr LSWC-HP + P
16-Aug-92 T = 75°F

Ave Vel = 877 fps
Std Dev = 23
ES = 77
High = 923
Low = 846
N = 6

Zero Factory 158gr LSWC-HP +P
19-Aug-90 T = 100°F

Ave Vel = 917 fps
Std Dev = 29
ES = 91
High = 955
Low = 864
N = 6

 

[243winxb]

CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The High Road, nor the staff of THR assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.

No. 5 powder has been manufactured by many different companys, over the years. Its shape has changed. The old data is hotter and very dangerous.

Use current Hodgdon data or Speer. Want cleaner- Magnum Primers. Work up loads.

 

[lagerratrobe]

That's very interesting, thank you (all of you). My chronograph battery died when I was out last week, but it looks like its time to get it out and see what's actually happening.

I don't love this powder and will switch to something else once I use it up, but appreciate the info you've given me. Should help me tweak what I've got into something a bit more reasonable. The suggestion to use magnum primers is a good one, but given the utter PITA I had just to get small pistol primers in the past 2 years, I think it's unlikely I'll try it.