Old Powder, Is It Still Safe To Use?

[AuProspector]

Getting back into reloading again, I have some old rifle, shotgun, and handgun powder (H110, H380, surplus 4831, IMR's, etc) and I was wondering if it is still good to use. Some of it is from the 1960's-1980's. (The H4831 had a price tag of $1.89/lb.)

It was stored in a non-heated storage building. It was cool and dry, but at times, it was very cold (I live in Colorado).

Is it still safe and usable? If usable, will the powder loose anything? What?

I've retired and its been fun getting back into reloading, something that I really enjoy doing. I always shot and saved all my brass but I don't want to pay the price of store bought ammo and I have a lot of brass to reload.

Thank you for you help.

AuP

 

[zxcvbob]

The two big tests:

1. Dump some out on a white sheet of paper. Is there a bunch of red dust? (bad)
2. Is the can rusty on the inside? (bad)

What does the powder smell like? If it smells like ether or acetone, that's good. If it doesn't smell like anything, that's generally good but doesn't mean much. If it smells like acid, that's bad. There are a very few triple-based powders that do stink, so this is not a great test all by itself.

My guess is that all of it's still good.

 

[jcwit]

Pretty much covers it, not much more to add.

 

[Salmoneye]

I'm shooting a 3 pound canister of Red Dot from 1961...

Yellow Hercules label, and the can is Pink, not Red like in the late 60's...

3 digit lot number...

When this is empty, I have a 5 pound waxed cardboard canister from the 70's to start on...

 

[medalguy]

Powder is fine even if a few years old as long as it passes the smell test. I'm still using some powder I bought back in the early 70's.

 

[Ex]

What will happen if you use "acidic" smelling powder? Is it a KB or a dud?

 

[Salmoneye]

What will happen if you use "acidic" smelling powder? Is it a KB or a dud?

In my experience, it simply does not burn 'right'...

No KB...

Others may have different experiences...

 

[Varmiter]

Don’t expect the same performance out of powders from that era. Many, back then were military cut cannon powders and NOT NEW. Performance varied from batch to batch.

Chris

 

[Walkalong]

What will happen if you use "acidic" smelling powder?

It will corrode stuff. Spread it out in the yard.

 

[zxcvbob]

What will happen if you use "acidic" smelling powder?

It'll rot your brass if you don't shoot it right away. I don't know if it will burn right or not.

 

[Hondo 60]

Powder can be pretty dang old & still usable.

How was it stored?? If it was stored in sealed containers (especially inside the house) I'd bet it's fine.

+1 to zxcvbob's answer (post # 2). I like it & feel it deserves a thumbs up...

 

[Edarnold]

The only one to worry about is likely the 4831, since it was old surplus when you bought it.
You can run into problems with some of the old Hercules powder that came in the square cans with the snap-on top. I had some old (probably 1960's) Unique that apparently had lost enough weight from solvent evaporation that it was stronger by weight: some .357 loads that should have been OK were way too high pressure, I had to pull down the ammo and got rid of the powder.

 

[Slamfire]

Nitrocellulose-base propellants are essentially unstable materials
that decompose on aging with the evolution of oxides of nitrogen. The
decomposition is autocatalytic and can lead to failure of the ammunition or disastrous explosions.

ROLE OF DIPHENYLAMINE AS A STABILIZER IN PROPELLANTS;
ANALYTICAL CHEMISTRY OF DIPHENYLAMINE IN PROPELLANTS

http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/783499.pdf

Old deteriorated gunpowder should not be fired as its burn rate has changed. It can blow up your firearm.

A shelf life rule of thumb is 20 years for double based,45 years for single based.
Heat, as you can see in the report, will age gunpowder.

Gunpowder that is red or smells is way past a safe shelf life. You can still have pressure issues with old gunpowder that does not smell.

The surface of double based powders become nitro glycerin (NG) rich as gaseous water wicks the stuff to the surface. This will cause pressure spikes.

NG will also cause rocket motors to go poof!. I am aware, from a person who worked at the facility, of a Pershing rocket motor explosion that killed at least two workers. This motor was installed in a test stand and the side of the rocket broke, spilling big chunks of double based rocket propellant. Rocket propellant is based on nitrocellulose, nitroglycerin, with special herbs and spices.

Workers went into the test stand with a wire bow saw. That was the procedure at the time, cut the propellant into smaller chunks with a wire.

It is likely the surface of the propellant was sensitized, due to age, and the friction between the wire and propellant was enough to set off an enormous amount of propellant. Like thousands and thousands of pounds of propellant.

At least that is what the people who worked there heard as a probably cause, what actually happened will never been known.

 

[Ky Larry]

I may get flamed, but I've been reloading since 1974. I have never had any problems with any of my loads because I've followed one simple rule:


When in doubt, throw it out. YMMV.

 

[CSA 357]

smell test, then load a few and try them! im not one to throw away powder, i got some red dot from a friend his dad had passed away years prior loaded alotb of ammo out of that 8# can now all i have is the can, it was cardboard with meatal top and bottom so it was pretty old