Opinions on 1873 winchester

[silicosys4]

lgs has a 1895 made 1873 Winchester. 32-20 for $699.
Wood is good, finish is 0% with heavy brown patina, nothing is chewed up just aged, barrel has been cut down a few inches and the bore is pretty bad. Action is stiff but functions, sliding dust cover is there.

I can't really afford it at the moment but I'm thinking I shouldn't pass this up as anything 1873 seems to start at double the asking price for this one.

Opinions?

 

[blue32]

Outside of it not being a stronger 92 I would consider it because the cloned guns use the same parts so you have a ready supply if something needs to be replaced. But a "pretty bad" bore could be a deal killer.

 

[silicosys4]

Outside of it not being a stronger 92 I would consider it because the cloned guns use the same parts so you have a ready supply if something needs to be replaced. But a "pretty bad" bore could be a deal killer.

Bore has visible rifling, but is definitely dark with pitting.and there is always the possibility of resleeving. I'm interested because the wood isn't beat up and looks original, the receiver is heavily patina'd but no rust or pitting, same with the barrel, and overall even if I had some resto work done, its a solid foundation that wouldn't need a huge amount done, like rewelding pits, heavy buffing, parts replacements, etc.

 

[tark]

The "bore is pretty bad" part would probably shoot it down in flames for me. But, having said that, I have a #2 rolling block in .32 rimfire that has a bore well to the south of "pretty bad" and it shoots accurately. Any way you could be allowed to test fire it? Just a few rounds at, say, 50 yards or so. To check accuracy and for key holed bullets. At the very least, I would try to cycle a few rounds through it. That "stiff but functions" part is a bit worrysome.
What do the screw heads look like? Do they look like they were attacked by a drunk monkey with the wrong size screwdriver...or are they in reasonably good shape? You mentioned the barrel had been shortened. Does it look like a good job with an acceptable crown, or does it look like the afore mentioned monkey did it? Same criteria for the front sight.

My bottom line would be this: At the very very very least I would want to remove the side plates and inspect the innards. If they are covered with rust I would pass on the deal.

Are you near any Cowboy Action Shoots? That would be a good place to shop around for a used 73 replica at a reasonable price.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

lgs has a 1895 made 1873 Winchester. 32-20 for $699.
Wood is good, finish is 0% with heavy brown patina, nothing is chewed up just aged, barrel has been cut down a few inches and the bore is pretty bad. Action is stiff but functions, sliding dust cover is there.

I can't really afford it at the moment but I'm thinking I shouldn't pass this up as anything 1873 seems to start at double the asking price for this one.

Opinions?

You just answered your question. You can't afford it. Walk Away!

The reason it's $695 is because it's beat to crap, modified, and in no way a collector piece of any kind. With the bad bore as you described, it's not even a shooter. Do you want hang $700 on your wall at a time when you can't afford it?

I feel your pain. I've been on the lookout for a 32-20 lever gun for yearrrrrrrrrs, and I passed one up at $800 ten years ago for the same reasons I would pass this one up. Better to bide your time, save your money, and use your limited resources wisely on the gun you want, rather than waste it on what you don't.

ETA: To be honest, based on your description, I don't think I'd buy that gun at any price, but I'm a bit of a purist.

 

[silicosys4]

You just answered your question. You can't afford it. Walk Away!

The reason it's $695 is because it's beat to crap, modified, and in no way a collector piece of any kind. With the bad bore as you described, it's not even a shooter. Do you want hang $700 on your wall at a time when you can't afford it?

I feel your pain. I've been on the lookout for a 32-20 lever gun for yearrrrrrrrrs, and I passed one up at $800 ten years ago for the same reasons I would pass this one up. Better to bide your time, save your money, and use your limited resources wisely on the gun you want, rather than waste it on what you don't.

ETA: To be honest, based on your description, I don't think I'd buy that gun at any price, but I'm a bit of a purist.

I guess I should clarify. I can afford it, I just wasn't planning on the extra expenditure. Its not "beat to crap", its a solid, no rust, no pitting, no metal damage, good original wood gun.....with a pitted bore yet still visible rifling, and a decently cut barrel. Its not a basket case or a hot mess, its a 130 year old gun that was used, taken care of, but wasn't kept in a climate controlled vault. The action is stiff because any lube inside the gun dried into varnish decades ago.

I'm gonna do what I can to get it, I think it's good foundation for a resto.

 

[blue32]

I've shot frosted bores without issue but then the crown was good. No one knows how it will shoot but roughness towards the muzzle would cause me to walk.

 

[Varminterror]

Sounds like nothing more than an opportunity to spend money to spend more money. Pass.

 

[gpb]

I'd pass on the rifle, for the following reasons.

I've been thinking about getting an 1873 in 32-20. I'm not really a collector but more of a shooter, and considering the prices asked for "decent'' 1873 Winchesters, especially 32-20. I'll probably look for a new reproduction. Also, I think a new reproduction would be more suitable for use with smokeless powder. Whereas an original may require use of black powder, and I don't want to get into black powder loading and cleaning.

I came across this video on the internal problems of an 1873 and the repairs. It may be of interest.

Link to Video on repair of Winchester 1873

 

[King Medallion]

Outside of it not being a stronger 92 I would consider it because the cloned guns use the same parts so you have a ready supply if something needs to be replaced. But a "pretty bad" bore could be a deal killer.

Clones are usually made in Italy, and Most parts are not interchangeable without a bit of modifications. Keep that in mind.

 

[Dave DeLaurant]

Just for reference, last week I shipped off a .22 RF Remington No.4 Rolling Block for barrel relining -- cost with return shipping was $475. Not a trivial cost these days!

 

[BigBlue 94]

I would probably buy it. A stiff action can be fixed. A rough bore is only a bad thing if it cant hit a barn at 50 paces, or if you are an accuracy nut. Worn condition just means you dont have to worry about scratching it.

For reference, i paid $2100 for a nice shooter 1897 16 ga and this 1873 (left the warehouse in Dec. 1890) about 9 years ago. 32-20, 30" octagon, full length mag, set trigger. Used but very good condition throughout, though virtually no blueing left. Very smooth action.

 

[Paul R Zartman]

I have a 94 built in 1937 that has a pitted bore, crown and half inch in is real bad...30/30, shoots good enough...I call it my "Rat Rod Rifle"

Oh yea, paid 250 for it, but there's a gazillion of these...

 

[Robert]

You said you can't afford it. There's your answer. Going into debt or overextending yourself is never a good idea, especially for a rifle with a bad bore that would likely cost more to bring back than it's worth.

 

[silicosys4]

Yea, I went through the math with the LGS,
I told him considering the following facts,
Nice replica's that ultimately are better shooters are $1200 +/-,
A barrel reline and having the action freshened would easily be $1k, maybe more,
The gun has little collectors value given it has no provenance, no finish remaining, a cut barrel, and a bad bore.
Guns in similar, maybe slightly worse condition are going for $400-$600 as parts guns or relics

Ultimately, bringing the gun up to the same shootability as a replica would cost hundreds more than the replica, and the "cool" factor of being an original gun wasn't worth as much to me as it was to the seller.

I offered $500 take it or leave it.
Rejected.
Oh well,
For the money a replica makes more sense for me as a shooter anyways. $700 is a lot of money for a wall hanger that needs $1500 worth of work to be worth $1500.

 

[Dave DeLaurant]

A quick afterword, since I don't think it's been mentioned here yet: the current issue of Rifle magazine features a review by Mike Venturino of the current Cimmaron/Uberti 1873 carbine and short rifle in .32-20.

 

[Steve Milbocker]

I’ve been well pleased with my Miroku 1873

 

[Scout21]

Yea, I went through the math with the LGS,
I told him considering the following facts,
Nice replica's that ultimately are better shooters are $1200 +/-,
A barrel reline and having the action freshened would easily be $1k, maybe more,
The gun has little collectors value given it has no provenance, no finish remaining, a cut barrel, and a bad bore.
Guns in similar, maybe slightly worse condition are going for $400-$600 as parts guns or relics

Ultimately, bringing the gun up to the same shootability as a replica would cost hundreds more than the replica, and the "cool" factor of being an original gun wasn't worth as much to me as it was to the seller.

I offered $500 take it or leave it.
Rejected.
Oh well,
For the money a replica makes more sense for me as a shooter anyways. $700 is a lot of money for a wall hanger that needs $1500 worth of work to be worth $1500.

I think you made the right choice. Sleeping on these things always seems to help.

 

[Pat Riot]

I know you have already made your decision and I agree with your decision but for a different reason.
I am always leery of any used “cowboy” gun if there is a chance the some “Cowboy Action” shooter owned it, “slicked it up” then fired thousands of rounds through it before moving in to their next victim…I mean, rifle.

I have bought former CAS. guns that had “minor modifications” and “only used for one or two matches” only to discover “the cowboy way” must not cover big white lies about the condition of the gun being sold.

 

[Nature Boy]

only to discover “the cowboy way” must not cover big white lies about the condition of the gun being sold

Same could be said for horses. The only thing you know for sure when you’re shopping for one is you aren’t getting the truth from the owner

 

[Mosin77]

Voice of dissent here: I’d have bought it. It probably just needs a good cleaning and some oil to work nicely, probably shoots great, and the only thing I’d view as a serious mark against it would be the cut barrel… which, though unfortunate, is like as not to have happened a long time ago, being a period modification. And if I decided I didn’t want it/found a better one, I know I could put the thing on Gunbroker and expect it to bring at least what I paid for it, likely several hundred more.

 

[CraigC]

Tough call without actually looking at it. Sometimes words on the screen don't relay what you hear when a rifle speaks to you. I love the 1873 but for me, the .32-20 chambering makes them too heavy. The cut barrel takes out the collectibility factor and that's a plus for a shooter. I got a really nice 1901v 1894 for a song because it was originally a 24" rifle that had been cut to 20".

That said, a new barrel wouldn't be $1000, relining should be less than half that. Still, for the kind of shooting I do, I'll take an original 1886/1892/1894/1895 but for the toggle link guns, I'd prefer a modern replica.

 

[CoalTrain49]

I think people often confuse collectable with shooter. Collectable IMO means in original high condition. Shooter means new or in the case of used, good condition. Shooting involves buying or loading ammo. Ammo is hard to find these days and in the case 32-20, it's going to be expensive if you can find it. If that isn't a concern then the cartridge doesn't matter.

I like old firearms and own a few WW2 relics. One I shoot, the other one I don't because it has some collector value.

I've been looking for a lever rifle for awhile because I don't own one. The first deer I ever shot was with a model 95 Win. That was stolen or I'd still have it. So I've ruled out the old rifles because of the cartridges like 32-20. Fun but not practical. 357 seems to be a good replacement so it will be a new Japanese Winchester. Didn't we fight a war with Japan. I have to decide on the available model 73 or the maybe soon available model 92. Haven't seen one of those at MSRP in a long time.

 

[Weflyfast]

Personally I have never shied away from an orig. Winchester that had the potential to be a good shooter- even if the gun had small issues or was not all orig. However, the price really needs to reflect a true value for the gun..... Just because it's a 1873 does NOT make it worth $1000 like many pawn shops....or non-winchester people think-

Be mindful and don't overspend ..... especially if you are tight on cash- ....save....be patient....and wait for the right gun for you and a fair price- Good luck on your search.....oh and keep your eyes open- sometimes great deals or opportunities just fall in your lap.

 

[MI2600]

I would tend to buy such an old rifle if I felt I could do most of the rehab myself. In the OP's description of that particular rifle, it appears that rifle is past the realm of saving and enters the wall-hanger stage unless he's willing to spend further.