P10c vs PPQM2 vs Glock

[critrxdoc]

Hello THR brothers. My collection of autoloaders for a long time has consisted of Glocks (I have 5). I have shot many M&P, Sig, Kimber, HK, etc brands and have always come back to Glocks. They are certainly not perfect but I shoot them well and nothing had performed better in my hand.

Reading the gun magazines and watching multiple reviews on YouTube gun channels enticed me to buy the PPQ and most recently the P10C. Both of these pistols are very good and I enjoy shooting both. I had not expected to get an completely unbiased opinion from these sources but I have to say the negatives of these new striker fired, polymer pistols were not discussed in adequate detail for an informed decision.

All these pistols I believe are very reliable so I will not discuss this.

Glock:
Cons: grip angle we are all familiar with requires significant wrist canting (can be mastered - I have never understood not being able to get the gun to point for desired shot placement); Gen 3 grip texture is poor; trigger is not stellar; sights are cheap plastic; accuracy is acceptable but not stellar; chamber support not optimal in high pressure rounds
Pros: low bore axis, manageable recoil impulse, still the giant in striker fired for a reason

PPQ:
Cons: sights are cheap plastic; higher bore axis increases recoil impulse and delays time back to target; my thumb rides the slide stop often precluding the last shot slide open
Pros: ergonomics are great; grip angle is natural; grip feels great; trigger is the best of the 3 in my opinion - outstanding crisp smooth pull and short reset. The pull before the wall does not feel as long as the P10C. Accuracy is superb. Multiple shooters in rested and unrested positions have validated this.

P10C:
Cons: The controls for magazine release and slide stop are VERY stiff and difficult to operate. I have read (see comments above) that this improves over time, we will see; my thumb rides the slide stop often precluding the last shot slide open; the grip texture verges on being too aggressive and can be uncomfortable in long range sessions; the backstrap is retained by a roll pin which can be difficult to remove. Accuracy is good but not great. Similar to glock, inferior to PPQ
Pros: ergonomics are great; grip angle is natural; trigger is good but many have stated is equal to the PPQ which I do not agree, it has what feels like a long initial pull before the "wall", I don't have a way to measure this, it feels "creepy" during this initial pull and not as good of an initial pull as the PPQ; short trigger reset

These are only my opinions and in comparison to glock. I wish that I could choose elements from all three. I would have probably bought the PPQ and P10C regardless, but I would have appreciated more honesty in the reviews. I was able to handle the PPQ but not shoot it prior to purchase and I bought the P10C unseen.

I hope my review may provide fair balance to someone on the fence about either of these two pistols. Describing the feel of a trigger is very difficult and I used the best adjectives I could to describe the feel.

 

[stchman]

I've never shot a P10C, but I have shot a M&P and a Glock.

I own the Glock 34 and it has a FAR nicer trigger than the G17 or G19. I own an M&P Shield 9 and it is a nice gun as well.

 

[JONWILL]

Ever had a PPQ. I can't comment on it

Glock are good guns. Didn't like the grip angle or sights.

CZ P-10 is my best shooter. Not sure what you mean about not accurate. Maybe you got a bad one. I can keep 5 shots at 25 yards inside the eyes and nose area on a B27 target

 

[stchman]

Ever had a PPQ. I can't comment on it

Glock are good guns. Didn't like the grip angle or sights.

CZ P-10 is my best shooter. Not sure what you mean about not accurate. Maybe you got a bad one. I can keep 5 shots at 25 yards inside the eyes and nose area on a B27 target

I used to own a PPQ M2 5". It was a pretty nice gun. I traded it for something else. I own a VP9 and like that gun very much. The Ruger American Pistol in 9mm I understand is a good gun as well.

 

[herrwalther]

I personally am very comfortable shooting a PPQ. I like them much better than Glocks or other polymers. And as far as models go, I like them almost as much as my P99AS. I do not have the same problems with the slide stop or high bore axis you mentioned.

 

[jjones45]

Yeah I can agree with the walther being the most accurate out of the box. I've bench tested all the major players in the striker fired game in stock form and the ppq will consistently group better than the rest at 25 yards. People always hype up the latest and greatest so when the Cz p10c came out all the YouTube gun channels and Cz fanboys (I'm a Cz fanboy by the way) were claiming it had the best striker trigger, even better than the ppq. That was a lie. I've handled 3 p10c's and probably 5 or 6 ppq's and the worst ppq trigger out of the bunch was still a little better than the best p10c trigger. Don't get me wrong the p10c's trigger is way better than a stock glock trigger, but ppq killer it is not. I rank the p10c trigger pretty closely to a good p320 trigger, maybe a tad better, barely. The Cz does have the lowest bore axis out of the 3, but I'm to the point I don't buy into that being a really big deal, especially in 9mm. If we are talking 40, .357 sig, or 45 caliber pistols then it plays a bigger role in the shoot ability of the gun for follow up shots and such. As far as bore axis goes my p320c has the highest of the striker fired guns I own and shoots about the softest, so there's a little more to it then bore axis alone. The glock is just a safe choice with great aftermarket support and the longest proven track record, but isn't the best at anything in stock form except size vs weight vs capacity ratios. The g19 nailed that part and is the gun all compact 9's are compared to for that reason. And they just work. A little over a month ago I passed on a p10c for another ppq (m2 5") because the rebate walther was running made it a no brainer and the triggers just don't compare. I do plan on buying a p10c though eventually, maybe when the gen 2's come out in the next few years. But for now the striker guns I have do everything I need them to do and do it well.

 

[Redfisher60]

PPQ 9
Ergonomics
Accuracy
Speed trigger!
Does "snap" on recoil. although with the 147 I started using more of a push
Should have better sights

I love mine and will not get rid of it

 

[wanderinwalker]

In my opinion, the Walther PPQ is a Glock that went to finishing school. At one point or another I've owned a Glock 17, 19 or 26 (sometimes multiple at once), and have several thousand rounds through each frame size. Right out of the gate I could shoot faster and more accurately with my PPQ-M1. It shoots much more "naturally" for me, generally putting rounds where my eyes are looking on close targets, while allowing me greater precision once ranges open up. I swapped out the M back strap for the L fairly early on, because I've found I shoot best with slab sided grips, similar to a 1911 or a set of Ahrends Combats on a S&W revolver. And I added a set of Trijicon HD sights with green front dot, as I don't like three dot sights. Luckily Walther took a page from Glock's book and ships the PPQs (and P-99s) with cheap plastic sight slot fillers, so the end user can install his or her preferred system.

As for the "bore axis" argument, most of the people I see at the range complaining about it can't keep a group on a basketball at 20-feet, no matter the shooting speed. It is what it is, proper grip and fundamentals make it a non-issue. Service size pistols in service calibers just don't generate huge amounts of recoil. Most of the popular service pistols don't generally present any quirks that will hinder good shooting.

Eventually I'll get some targets and nice photos of my PPQ like I've done with my 1911s and K-frame .22s. It's a great pistol, though I honestly don't think I'd want to see at as, say, the next Army service pistol, nor would I necessarily recommend it to somebody who "just wants a 9mm" as a casual gun owner and occasional shooter. But for a dedicated enthusiast, it's a tough pistol to beat.

I do want to try a CZ P-10C at some point. I've handled a couple and I will say I think it's got some potential as a good pistol at a sub-$500 street price.Also on my want to try list is the Beretta APX. As funky as it looks overall, there's just something about how it felt in my hand at the gunshop counter.

 

[sigarms228]

I own a 9MM PPQ, Gen 2 Glock 19, and tried the CZ P-10C. All are fine pistols but the PPQ is easily my favorite and the one I shoot the best. I use my Glock 19 for CCW when wanting to CCW a double stack but these days I mostly CCW my Walther PPS.

I find the trigger on my PPQ noticeable better than the P-10C but the P-10C has a decent trigger. Even the trigger on my Gen 2 Glock 19 is pretty decent for me.

In the end one needs to try out whatever they are considering to see what works best for them, I found that trigger reach on the P-10C is too short for me, even shorter than on my Glock 19. I wear XL gloves and use the large back strap on my PPQ though the medium works fine too but I feel I have better control of my PPQ with the large back strap.Bore axis is a non issue for me and the PPQ either. I find my PPQ comes back on target very quickly. There are many factors that affect the recoil and muzzle flip characteristics of a pistol beside just bore axis. Some are pistol size/length, pistol mass and mass distribution, slide velocity, slide size/length, slide mass and mass slide distribution, springs such as recoil/RSA and hammer springs, and grip size and shape optimized for the shooter. Then of course the shooter's skills/experience, techniques such as stance and grip, and size and strength of the shooter all affect how one perceives recoil/muzzle flip..

These are good times for someone looking for a striker fired pistol. The number of fine choices is amazing.