DustyGmt
Member
"She hit the victim, he missed the shooter, she was taken into custody"
I must be reading this wrong, it's a lil confusing. Who hit who?
I must be reading this wrong, it's a lil confusing. Who hit who?
I don't know how long ago he wrote that, but good luck.M. Ayoob wrote of a department that shot the original 90 shot IDPA Classifier for qualification. I think a Sharpshooter score required to qualify.
Male chief (HE) came upon a female assailant shooter (SHE) firing at another (unarmed) female (VICTIM). HE (Chief) fired at shooter (SHE). He missed his target (the shooter). She (shooter) successfully hit her target (victim). Additional officers arrived on scene quickly and the shooter (SHE) was taken into custody."She hit the victim, he missed the shooter, she was taken into custody"
I must be reading this wrong, it's a lil confusing. Who hit who?
Having grown up right outside of a major military installation… I have ran into a bunch of guys at the local ranges who had the attitude of “army training makes me better” and I gladly whipped them when money was put on the line. Very rarely have I had the same thing happen with law enforcement personnel. There seems to be an age difference at play as well, because military pays fairly well for a high school grad, but it takes a bit to get through a hiring process and police academy to become a police officer. Given a 19 yr old private vs the 23 yr old street cop I’m putting my money on blue instead of camo every time. If the officer has a CJ degree then I’m doubling down on the officer. Give that a few years though and it spins. Captain vs Captain I’m betting camo.I noticed the same in both police and military. The officers and soldiers who took their qualification seriously usually sought out additional training in firearms. Which helped qualification. Plenty are happy to pass and be done.
That is an IDPA Scenario or USPSA Field Course.
How are you going to define pass-fail qualification?
Hire a Master class shooter to run it and require your employees shoot half as well?
(I am USPSA C class and am doing well to exceed 50% on Classifiers. I am IDPA Expert but have only shot Expert on the long Classifier once, otherwise match promotions, meaning I won Sharpshooter in that Division.).
The club/range I belong to lets the local DPS do their qualifications on our range. One year I watched several miss the target completely at twenty-five yards from the prone position with an AR15.
Well, yeah, that'd be fun for a few in every department. But some of y'all seem to believe that cops are supposed to love guns and shooting. Just like there are guys working construction or as carpenters who may not be particularly good with certain tools, or master chefs that can't chop veggies like the average tableside cook at your local Benihana, there's mostly officers and deputies who actually don't look forward to in-service weapons training and qualification. I know, hard to believe, right?
And the higher up in rank ya go, well, you already know...
I was an advid shooter so, I agree! However, the training budgets of most departments just cannot handle this level of training due to expenses. Every officer shooting weekly XX rounds- the rounds cost is minimal but, who is going to replace that patrol? OVERTIME. And monthly means during peaking vacation times i.e. summer, when OT is up anyways. When left with no other resources beg/barrow/steal for manpower, the public would be forced with reduced patrols and response times....keep practicing on a weekly basis? It seems like 50 rounds a week should be a mandatory minimum for any LEO who's required to carry a sidearm in the line of duty. Possibly even...
I was an advid shooter so, I agree! However, the training budgets of most departments just cannot handle this level of training due to expenses. Every officer shooting weekly XX rounds- the rounds cost is minimal but, who is going to replace that patrol? OVERTIME. And monthly means during peaking vacation times i.e. summer, when OT is up anyways. When left with no other resources beg/barrow/steal for manpower, the public would be forced with reduced patrols and response times.
So, when 'looks good on paper' meets 'who's gonna pay for this?!!' , well, it falls back into ...what happens in departments training centers, now.
This whole thing makes me wonder about the bigger picture.
Assuming the qualifications are annual or semi-annual, I'd also assume those having to requalify would practice prior to being tested. But after the qualification, do they keep practicing on a weekly basis? It seems like 50 rounds a week should be a mandatory minimum for any LEO who's required to carry a sidearm in the line of duty. Possibly even to shoot the qualification course of fire - not under test conditions, just by themselves - every week.
Skills deteriorate without regular practice, I think we all know that. LEOs may deal with, social interactions, conflict de-escalation, driving, and comms usage on a daily basis. But they don't shoot on a daily basis as part of the job. Yet if/when a rare necessity to shoot arises, they're supposed to do it well.
I was an advid shooter so, I agree! However, the training budgets of most departments just cannot handle this level of training due to expenses. Every officer shooting weekly XX rounds- the rounds cost is minimal but, who is going to replace that patrol? OVERTIME. And monthly means during peaking vacation times i.e. summer, when OT is up anyways. When left with no other resources beg/barrow/steal for manpower, the public would be forced with reduced patrols and response times.
So, when 'looks good on paper' meets 'who's gonna pay for this?!!' , well, it falls back into ...what happens in departments training centers, now.
Unless the Department reloads it will cost over $1000 per officer per year, just for ammo.
IF they reload it will still cost over $500 per officer per year, plus the wages for the employee doing the reloading.
And frankly I have not heard of any departments still doing any reloading!
YMMV!
Long long time ago in a land far away ...called we carried REVOLVERS, there were reloads,FOR PRACTICE ONLY. Full factory fresh ammo for duty carry. Roughly now, ammo would cost $50 for primary arm...DON'T FORGET any secondary gun, i.e. shotgun or AR in the trunk. Multiplied by whatever interval, X total #s of staff shooting, re-shoots/requals, etc. ... any post or division that fired would have to be updated, not just line staff.Unless the Department reloads it will cost over...
and I'll link my following answer to this quote...Quarterly or even in trimesters then? The real smart move would be...
Cost$ of training to make the individual staffer competent comes at a cost other then dollars. One side of the public would say ''they're stone cold HIGHLY TRAINED killers!'' . The other side would say similar, ''why did you miss?'' Somewhere in the middle the Chief gets the call from HQ (think Mayor) ''why don't you train to shoot in non-lethal areas?''I'd assume the general public would be shocked to know officer aren't required to practice regularly already.
Cost$ of training to make the individual staffer competent comes at a cost other then dollars. One side of the public would say ''they're stone cold HIGHLY TRAINED killers!'' . The other side would say similar, ''why did you miss?'' Somewhere in the middle the Chief gets the call from HQ (think Mayor) ''why don't you train to shoot in non-lethal areas?''