Police officers, insight needed

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Danus ex

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Minneapolis, MN
Hey all,

About an hour ago, I got a citation for doing 10mph over (70mph in a 60mph zone). $118, poof gone, potential airfare-to-see-girlfriend money.

I was driving my nice, shiny silver 1988 BMW 535is in the left lane, with cars in the center and right hand lanes going the same speed as me (there was a lot of traffic). I had left a lot of space in front of me (must've been nearly 10 or 15 car lengths). I saw the speed trap from way out, but I obviously didn't think I was speeding at all. Other cars put the brakes on, I just let off the gas a bit. I was clocked at 72mph.

The policeman was firm but friendly, like most are. I kept my hands where he could see them and it was "yes sir" "no sir" from me as it should be. He told me they'd have the speed trap there all summer :(.

I'd just like some insight into how you guys pick who you pick. The officer could have easily chosen someone else. Is it just random radar gun beaming?

The irritating thing is that I've never had a citation anywhere EVER except in Ramsey county--I've had three within the last year. The first was a missing front license plate (my license plate bracket was literally delayed by hurricane Katrina--the parts depot was in southern Alabama--I couldn't make that up. The second was "unsafe opening of a car door" when some woman hit my car door while it was open (for a while, too, why they cited me I'll never know). And then today was probably the lamest ticket ever: 70mph in a 60mph zone where everybody was going 65mph to 75mph. I'm happy that the police are always very nice and we get along well (I've never actually met a jerk cop), but why pick on this dashing, eloquent but dirt-poor graduate student? :) I regularly drive through four other counties (Anoka, Hennepin, Sherburne, Dakota, with most of my time spent in Anoka and Hennepin) and all is well. What makes Ramsey county's law enforcement so draconian?
 
Danus:

Well, around here the Beemers are a good target.... :evil:

LEO's sometimes look for the "nosedive" when speeders spot the radar and hit the brakes. Perhaps because you didn't nosedive....

Being "out in the open" may be a problem, too. Easier to catch.... :D

I'm a rent-a-cop. I don't give tickets, I get 'em.... I do hang with more than a few LEO's. In the absence of issues like "Driving While Black", I think it's a mix of a solid case ("out in the open") and pure random chance.

DWB is a problem in some areas. Doesn't seem to be an issue around here, but I had a co-worker at the former day job who used to work some seriously odd hours. Every time he bought a new car (which tended to be about half a step from the crusher when he got 'em), every field Officer on the Township PD would stop him until they got to know the car. (DWB, generally.) While this sounds racist, and probably was, his cars were sufficiently junque that he appreciated being "noticed". We were one of the Township's major employers at the time and as soon as an Officer found out where he worked, it was "have a nice day."

The other potential problem is what happens to the Lincolns and Caddies on I-95 in FL.... Or at least used to - I'm not sure if it's still going on. Drug runners or just "rich enough to pay the ticket" issues.... DWB issues too in pointing out which Caddy to stop.

In reality, when you're running a speed trap like that, part of the game is visibility - stopping "x" cars in "y" time. Hopefully your luck with lottery tickets will be as good. I generally don't drive fast enough to get a ticket these days, and keep a radar detector running in the car anyway. It beeps randomly (cheap RS model) which helps me remember to check once in a while. A friend of mine pulled in behind me one day and keyed "CQ" on his radar, just to watch my face....

(And to watch my neck tan in the RF field.... Their radar at the time could be "seen" on my cheap detector from about two miles away. Old unit....)

(My daughter, OTOH, is good at "But Officer, you're not filling that ticket out properly." She slowed down a bit when she realized that she gave the County about everything she earned being a CIT at a kiddie camp on year, and she hated the job! Not to mention the nuisance value of having her mom come with us to the hearings. One OSP Trooper actually _did_ fill the ticket out improperly, sort of. He put the wrong phone number on it, and the County went nuts trying to find us. When I found out about it, I called the clerk: "You've got a couple other cases pending for her, and our last name is odd enough that you'd have to find us in the phone book before going the Certified Letter route...." "New girl handling this stuff...." Sheesh....)

Hope you have better luck.... My wife won't let me visit my girlfriend. :D

(OK, it's actually a waitress at a "Friday's" I met in Dallas last Monday evening. The wife wouldn't let me keep her.... Only 1500 miles away....)

Regards,
 
You drive a silver BMW and you ask "Why me?" Get a red one and I bet you get even more tickets.

I'm 55 and drive a silver Subaru Forester and I didn't get a ticket on I-64 in Charlottesville when the State Trooper passed me after I slowed down to 80 and moved into the right lane. I did signal before I moved over, so maybe I got a couple of brownie points. Boy, was I surprised it was a Trooper, it didn't look like a Trooper - of course it was dark.

I am curious, do you have tinted windows or any other attention-getting features on the car?

John
 
Hello fellow MN resident. First you were speeding? Second you were in hammer lane? Lets see this would me my thought when I wrote tickets. (which I seldom did)
A group is all going over speed limit, unless one car/truck is clearly going much faster I would consider the one in hammer lane the (likely) fastest. As traffic is (supposed) to go from slowest on right to folks passing on left. Add in a nice/fast car and its a slam dunk.
Try not to speed, If you do keep it to 5mph over. Let someone going 10mph over pass you and follow them at just your line of sight. (he gets ticket and you slow down long before you hit speed trap)
When you get caught be polite/honest and pay your ticket ASAP. Ask if there are any programs to reduce/remove points of Officer. (make dang sure you don't word this like a bribe) "so who can I give some cash to and make this ticket go away" is not a good choice. :)
And sorry to say in some areas you might get a hint of how much cash would make it a warning. IMO DON"T DO IT. Take the ticket. IF they are willing to take a bribe they would be willing to arrest you for giving one/etc/etc. I highly doubt this is likely nowdays. 20 yrs ago it was happening. :(
 
What makes Ramsey county's law enforcement so draconian?
Click to expand...

Enforcing the speed limit with a citation hardly seems draconian. It sounds like you just got caught. People describe speed traps in a lot of different ways, but you saw the police car, so it doesn't seem to fit the normal definition.

It sounds like you are afflicted with the realization that life's not fair. Sure everyone else was speeding, but so were you. Their guilt does not relieve you of your's. Why you? Perhaps you were going 1 mph more than the next car, perhaps your's was the car that gave the clearest return, as you said you were in the passing lane, and therefore provided a clearer radar signature (no other cars between you to break it up). Maybe it just wasn't your day.
 
They will always give you 5mph, but over 10mph is askin for trouble. Bare in mind the inaccuracy of your speedo and the radar gun and that explains the 5mph buffer. If you are the most eye catching vehicle out there you get nailed. My "Arrest Me Red" Corvette always made me a popular target. Not only did he stop a speeder but he got a chance to check out a new Vette at the same time. Once had a LEO buddy of mine explain the "but everyone was going that fast" excuse this way. "Do you ever go fishing?" "Have you ever caught all the fish?"
 
1. Get a RADAR/LIDAR detector.

If you figure you stick out, then that little beeper will remind you that cops are around. Even the playing field.

I'm not advocating driving recklessly and relying on the thing; I just find that the little reminder sounds make me more aware of the speed limit on a regular basis. Spend the $80 or whatever; a ticket will be more.

2. Don't drive in Oregon. Ever. That road would probably be posted 40 in Oregon. And forget the 5 MPH leeway. Silly place.
 
I think the car does sometimes make a difference...I used "fly" when I was a kid (including more than a little street racing), but they were more lenient then (and my cousin was NYS Trooper, who all the Troopers knew---that got me out of a few).

But when I got older, and now, I rarely go very much over the limit. But a few years ago, I had a Firebird Formula (white/red) and got 2 tickets in 6 months. In one case I was probably speeding a little (relatively unused road, no traffic, wasn't really paying attention to my speed), but in the other case I KNOW I wasn't speeding. Oh Well.

But, about once a week I drive a stretch of expressway south from here about 40 miles and back, and there's almost always a Trooper or two stationed along there. And it does seem like I see a higher number of expensive/sporty cars pulled over. Now, sometimes I expect that, as the guy blew by me a few miles back, but it does make you wonder...
 
Um, radar detectors are illegal in MN. I too have been taken my the MN police for speeding. He said I was doing 49 in a 30 when I was only doing 39 (His word against mine.:( ) on a road that would be posted for 40 MPH in ND. What really got me mad was it was the people who where passing me in the left lane that his radar picked up. (Yes, there where people going faster than me and he pulls ME over.:cuss: ) I was nice to him even though I was wishing that a car would run him over. I paid the check, but I messed up the magnetic ink on the check so it would have to be entered manualy and would take the check longer to clear. I carry a hidden tape recorder in my car now for such events.

Many people don't respect MN police much anymore where I live.(At least those of us on the ND side of the river.) They are seen mainly as tax collectors with the insanley high ticket prices and speed limits that are set too low.

ND cops are a different story, unless you are doing something incredibly dangerous or illegal, they leave you alone. That is the way it should be.
 
To the above: I was in a friend's car when I learned that lesson on 30 going north one time, where the cops like to congregate to make "quota" near the end of the month.

The highway was designed in the 50's and was built for a top speed of around 50. All the exit ramps are these tiny, twisty little short things with merge lanes on the ends that are quite literally in some cases about two car lengths long.

Tricky place.

Anyway, the crowd seems to dictate that everyone wants to drive about 80-85 along most of it, where the posted speed limit on wide swaths of it is a rather unfair (in my opinion) 45. I think 65 would be a better bet, but apparently people can't be trusted not to hang around in the merge lanes.

Anyway, we got popped doing 60 and running the risk of getting blown off the road by the other drivers. Luckily I wasn't in that driver's seat. The officer insisted we were doing 80, which was a bit of a stretch... Despite my interjection (and being curtly told to 'shut up') my buddy got a ticket for 80 in a 45, points on his license, mandatory class, and all that jazz.

Took it to court and lost. His word against the cop's.

Nowadays, my GPS reciever is always running (may as well) and my PDA is always logging. My last trip is automagically stored on an SD card for my later perusal, query, and playback. You can't forge GPS logging data without some serious fudging of calculations, because you'd have to know all the time differences being broadcast by all the satelites and be able to put that together for a different locaton/heading/speed at the same physical time on earth.

I drive route 30 every day. I don't do much over the speed limit.

I'm waiting.
 
+1 to the Valentine 1. It really is the best detector available.

My advice is to stop breaking the law and then complaining about it later. Live with the consequences of your own actions. The end.
 
As a kid in my 71 Roadrunner, I was moving as fast as I could through interstate traffic. Had some joker behind me that moved with me toe-to-toe. I remember making a comment to a friend in the car with me that "no matter how fast you go, there's always somebody who wants to go faster". When we hit a clear spot, I moved over for the faster fella, turned out he was a STATE TROOPER! :eek: He must have been in a real hurry to get somewhere else because he just waved an accusing finger at me and took off.


Sometimes lucky is good enough.

:)
 
I was going 75 in a 50 zone last

week and a NHP cop going in the other direction gave me that "slow down"
wave.

I speed all the time, but my old ford ranger just doesn't attract any attention
 
Gezzer:

Drive speed limit NO ticket, real easy.
Click to expand...

Sometimes you can't.... "Suicide Circle" in Atlanta comes to mind....

However, overall, that is correct advice....

I shall now bore everybody with the reason why I've got a radar detector.

(As a rent-a-cop, I've always felt a moral obligation to not need one. However....)

The former day job owned a plant in Western South Carolina (close to Atlanta), and I used to drive down there from NE OH two or three times a year.

One quiet evening, near the bottom of the WV Turnpike, about dusk, I noticed a nice place to park a radar trap. Academic interest.... I was doing more or less the speed limit, which may have been 55 at that time - this was a while (and two cars) ago.

As I passed the hot zone of that putative speed trap, a little white car went by me at a substantial bit faster....

The blue lights in the bushes came on....

The violator pulled into my lane and stood on his brakes!....

I managed to avoid decorating the other guy's rear bumper (good discs on the old Crown Vic). The Trooper sort of waved me on.... :D

About a year later the same thing happened!. :cuss:

I bought a radar detector when I got back.... :neener:

It's retired, as is one more, but the third one's on it's second car. Not all that great, and no LIDAR capability, but I like to know where they are. I've been too cheap to upgrade and don't trust the LIDAR issues anyway.

Regards,
 
gezzer

Drive speed limit NO ticket, real easy.

Speed limits are usualy set using the 85 percentile rule. Meaning that 85% of the cars on that strech or road will be doing at or below the speed limit. So if everyone was doing the speed limit, they would LOWER the speed limit. Plus, at $118 for 10 over the limit, nobody in their right mind is going to want to stop feeding from that money trough. MN has money problems and the state is doing everything in can to not have to "raise" taxes. MN cops are seen as tax collectors and not much else. The cops need to be doing things like catching people for running red lights (No camera :cuss: , have them there catching people.) or stop signs.

For a college town and the poor in general these fines are blatently exessive. (Cruel and unusual?) Traffic fines should not hurt a person. Take away a little disposable income, yes. But getting a $118 ticket for just keeping with the flow of traffic a few MPH over the limit can cripple those on a low income. $30-40 would be a reasonable fine. That or give the person the choice of working off the fine by doing community service on their days off. (Would never happen cause the government wants their $$$.) No matter what you call it, the speeding fines in MN are extortion plain and simple.
 
Radar detectors give you a fighting chance. Police radar is Doppler - it tells you someone's going fast, but you're not necessarily sure who it is. So the cops will look for a distinctive target (left lane, distant from other vehicles, etc).

Laser detectors aren't useful unless you make the 1/10000 chance of catching beam scatter from a car in front of you... otherwise, if your laser alarm goes off and you're speeding, all it does is tell you it's time to pull over and get your ticket.
 
Poor college students don't drive shiny BMWs. They sell the BMW and buy a Chevy Metro, using that savings for booze and seeing their girlfriends.
 
Asknight:

Poor college students don't drive shiny BMWs. They sell the BMW and buy a Chevy Metro, using that savings for booze and seeing their girlfriends.
Click to expand...

Agreed, but this is an '88. That's 18 years old. Probably worth $118, but....

Probably not all that shiny either :eek: .

Still a lot of money.

OH's fee schedules are about the same, btw.

Regards,
 
I speed all the time, but my old Ford Ranger just doesn't attract any attention.
Click to expand...

Same here. I drive a clean, older Nissan pickup. I've only been stopped once by a state trooper who had a string of cars going behind about 8 miles (construction season in AK). He was being a weenie and doing exactly 65 mph with lots of clear highway in front.

Well, bold as brass I kicked it up to 70 and went around him figuring he'd spot me 5 points and leave me alone.:D


But oh no can't have cars passin' the trooper's pace so he pulls me over.:uhoh:

However, I kinda got the jump on him because at the time I was working for another department in the area and had my radio on monitoring the AST channels. I heard him radio my plate number in and advise he was doing a traffic stop and I immediately signalled I was pulling over.
Anyways he come up to my truck with a confused look on his face and asks if I knew why he pulled me over. I say yes. Then he asked me how I knew I was getting pulled over before he hit the lights. I told him. He asked if there were any weapons in the vehicle. Yes. Why? And I told him.
I didn't get a ticket out of it, but the SOB kept me there for about 20 minutes or better while he BS'd on his cell phone.:rolleyes:
The up side is that while I was keeping the trooper occupied, traffic out of the valley speeded up cleared faster.:p

That being said, I don't do much traffic enforcement myself unless someone is being reckless, and there is a big difference between speeding and reckless. I've never really got along with or had much respect for the tail-light chasers.

I'm not willing to ding someone for something I do myself. I also don't do seatbelt enforcement either, although I wear them on the highway and urban areas and highly recommend their use.

During my years in LE I've learned that nice cars and trucks are pulled over to extort revenue......nice vehicle can afford the fine mentality.
POS cars are pulled over fishing for a criminal case.
 
I think the car does sometimes make a difference...I used "fly" when I was a kid (including more than a little street racing), but they were more lenient then (and my cousin was NYS Trooper, who all the Troopers knew---that got me out of a few).

But when I got older, and now, I rarely go very much over the limit. But a few years ago, I had a Firebird Formula (white/red) and got 2 tickets in 6 months. In one case I was probably speeding a little (relatively unused road, no traffic, wasn't really paying attention to my speed), but in the other case I KNOW I wasn't speeding. Oh Well.

But, about once a week I drive a stretch of expressway south from here about 40 miles and back, and there's almost always a Trooper or two stationed along there. And it does seem like I see a higher number of expensive/sporty cars pulled over. Now, sometimes I expect that, as the guy blew by me a few miles back, but it does make you wonder...
 
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