Police use stun gun on UCLA student

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tasers

On my University in Texas, every single police personnel is issued a taser, regardless of rank. They are used daily for non-compliant situations. Granted, I believe tasers are wonderful tools for the right purpose, but around here, they are used much too often for the wrong reasons.

If you so much offend an officer, he/she commands you to lie on the steaming hot pavement face down in the name of terroristic threats. – No joke, a boy said ‘F*** you’ to an officer that told him he couldn’t bring his umbrella into the football stadium, but could buy one inside for $20. Officer draws his taser because he’s “out of control” and boy responds with another F bomb. Tazed and booked for terroristic threat.

There was absolutely no reason to shoot that boy, even if he was upset; he didn’t cause any problems. As good of tools as they are, they are more often abused than rightfully effective.

In the end, I believe the city dropped the charges. (probably after threat of litigation, but still, he's been booked, I.D'd and stayed in jail for a whole weekend.)

I don't trust anyone with a badge.

-koko:p
 
Do some people deserved to be tased or beat? YES. Do some police officer use their position to abuse power? YES AGAIN. There are alot of cops and rent-a-cops that are rude, abusive and lack etiquette. Education and good manners can get you far without the need of force. Does this abuse of power or lack of manners by cops happen often? HELL YEAH, I know 'cause I go through it because I'm Latino.........

Now, for this case, just because he went limp and started screaming about patriot act or abuse of power DOES NOT JUSTIFY the use of a taser to "control" the guy. The guy better sue the crap out of both university and police.

Be cordial and you'll recieve in kind....
 
Too bad there isn't a video of the *whole* incident.

Did he disobey a direct order and was breaking the regulations ?

Besides, *** is someone doing on a computer in the library?
I mean... every student I know has a wifi enabled laptop*, and/or PC in his dorm room.
(funnny things is, that due to regulations at some dorms, you can't run heaters, so people heat their rooms with computers.. 2x200 watts makes a lot of difference in a 2x4m room)
*so that some people play GTA during some lectures. Now that's multitasking...
** or do webdesign

I can do nearly everything that can be done in school at home, over the net.
Only one network drive is still inaccessible outside of school.. and that's because of admins' incompetence imho.

-The tasers seem overutilized...

(here's a paranoid fantasy... the evil gun-grabbing liberals won't stop with gun control..
oh no. You'll all be electronically tagged from birth, every movement traced and have electrical disablers implanted too. The cops won't need to carry a tazer.. just a stick that they'll point at you and you'll go down and stay down.. )
All in the name of security and protection from terrorism. :)
 
Clearly the campus police officers' view on the proper use of a taser is shown at the end of the video. One officer threatens to taser a student who asks for his badge number.

"Back up or you'll get tazed too."
 
BADGE number ?! They don't have badges with large, legible numbers pinned onto their shirt?

Those cops aren't cops, they are pigs..
 
Be cordial and you'll recieve in kind....
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You are under no obligation to be "cordial" to police officers, especially if they make an unreasonable request or are rude. To say so implies a state of cowed subservience that is in no way related to being a American.

And if you're saying so out of fear that they'll use their high-voltage "whip" on you and make you writhe in agony on the ground just for using profanity or otherwise being discourteous, if you as a law abiding citizen are AFRAID of your police like that, stop and think about what you're saying.

Because you're becoming a sheep.

"Back up or you'll get tazed too."
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To me, that statement would have been, in my mind, complete justification for the group of students to take down and restrain the officers in a citizens' arrest, as they had stepped way over the line with that threat, and were now unjust and unlawful criminals. To me, at least. If it were anywhere but UCLA, if it were in some other part of the country where people are more likely to find that over the line as well, I think that might have been met with a cry from somewhere in the back of the group of "get them!" and a sudden inrush of the crowd.

Statements like that have been known to start riots and revolutions.
 
"There are alot of cops and rent-a-cops that are rude"

Heck, i'm a rent-a-cop (hate that term) and a lot of us are RUDER than cops.

True statement!

Again i to think the situation could have been handled better. Again, and it would have taken more time, but i would have just done what you would do with an unruly kid. He goes limp, fine, leave him in cuffs and let him lie there. He'll get sick of it eventually and comply.


My .02
 
Wait a minute. I don't see this as a civil rights issue. The article stated that there is a policy of having to show ID when using the library late at night. The point, I assume, is safety concerns regarding non-students who may be on university property for nefarious purposes.

This is not that different from hotel employees asking to see someone's room key if they are roaming around guest use areas late at night.

If the person did not have proper ID, it was legitimate to ask him to leave the premises--again, if this is the policy for use of the library. Refusing to leave would be a reason for use of force. Whether the tasing is appropriate might be another question that I won't judge at this time.

K
 
[q]To me, that statement would have been, in my mind, complete justification for the group of students to take down and restrain the officers in a citizens' arrest, as they had stepped way over the line with that threat, and were now unjust and unlawful criminals.[/q]

Thinking like that would only resulted in people getting killed.

Maybe I have been spoiled here in WI but I have never encountered any police officers who have ever been anything but respectful and accommodating, even when they are writing me out tickets. Coming from a family involved in law enforcement, and seriously considering that path myself... I find that I disagree with many people on here pretty often. I respect authority, especially with police, mostly because they are the means that our society uses to keep the peace. In other societies there are other methods, religion and morality have been two used in the past, but religion and societal standards do not sway people to do right anymore, so someone has to do it.

With that said, did they go to far? Without more information all I can say is maybe. Its possible they abused their power to tase him, probably due to continuing frustration with college students who make their job difficult, but it is also possible that dragging the man out could have resulted in more injury (maybe they drop him or something). I'm at a loss for more words, I'll just shut up now.

P.s By the way, saying everyone with a badge is a power-hungry corrupt evil person is just the same as gun-grabbers saying that everyone with a gun is a murderer; in my mind. Lets not make the same logical mistakes those we are against do.
 
The taser has become the modern whip. To many cops, it seems like it's a form of coercion based on pain, or the threat thereof, NOT the defensive device it was meant to be.

I see it used more for offense than defense. It's nothing more than an electric whip to many, I think.
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You are right on both counts....1) IT IS BASE ON PAIN...IT IS CALLED PAIN COMPLIANCE...2) I dont know what Police Academy you went to, but it is not a defensive weapon it is an offensive weapon...The cop no longer has to to get sucker punched. There is NO documented death attributed to the use of a taser ANYWHERE..Now there are a ton of half truth newspaper articles that claim someone had died because of being tasered, but when you read the followup if there is one, you will find it was not the case...Sorry if you dont like the facts. Besides the article I read made no mention of a taser....Im not starting an argument with you, as I wont participate in one, just trying to state the facts that I believe you are distorting to help your anti-police argument...
:)
 
There is NO documented death attributed to the use of a taser ANYWHERE
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http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/0730taser30.html

Bottom line: lots of folks have dies after being tasered. In most of those cases, the taser has been a contributing -- rather than sole -- factor. That, IMO, is a fairly weak defense, as folks who died from a combination of drugs and a taser, or a heart condition and a taser, or whatever, would not have died if not for the taser.

Regardless, more cases are coming to light where the coroner has determined that the taser was the sole cause of death. Yes, Taser disputes this, but that's only to be expected.
 
The student was wrong for not showing ID according to university policy. However, that did not justify even one tazing let alone mulitple ones (especially while he was cuffed). In my opinion, good police officers get lumped together with those who have authority complexes and abuse their position and power and therefore many non-LEOs have a low opinion of all officers. I'm sure he'll get some compensation and maybe the officers will change their line of work if they can't handle it.
 
Bottom line: lots of folks have dies after being tasered. In most of those cases, the taser has been a contributing -- rather than sole -- factor. That, IMO, is a fairly weak defense, as folks who died from a combination of drugs and a taser, or a heart condition and a taser, or whatever, would not have died if not for the taser.
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With those facts one could argue that such people could have died if you put them in a headlock and hauled them to your Squadcar by force; if your fragile enough to die from such a sudden jolt then I think it stops being the Tazer's fault and ends up the nature of the illness.

I don't think if I saw a person resisting my fellow officers arrest; putting myself in their shoes; I'd ask him if he had a heart condition or was currently on LSD before I lanced his punk ass. Of course, that's just my personal opinion, and presumed like of my Parter's charming gook looks.

Regardless, more cases are coming to light where the coroner has determined that the taser was the sole cause of death. Yes, Taser disputes this, but that's only to be expected.
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Again, I'd like to mention this was probably the same arguement presented with thre Billy Club was introduced to police officers. People seem to forget the 'Protect' part of 'Serve and Protect' doesn't mean giving you a pillow to hide behind.

It's impossable to know if the person who's resisting arrest has a heart condition or some drug-interaction that could cause an acute CNS shutdown; the same way it's impossable to know if that guy freaking out on the corner has Brittle Bone disease, and if restraining him with handcuffs will snap his writs like pretzels on Superbowl Sunday.

It's not the Tazer here that's killing people. Force is force, and you can abuse a Riot Baton, a pair of Handcuffs or your own pair of meaty fists as easily as you can a 50,000 volt shock to the face. The latter just ensures YOUR safety more then the former.
 
Why does everyone keep saying he was handcuffed prior to be stunned. No article I have found says he was handcuffed first?

He was not complying, and was resisting. I know, we must wait for violence before we use any technique to stop the incident from escalating, otherwise most of you think it is excessive. I understand that you believe an officer has to be injured before doing anything to the suspect. I believe that they can keep an incident from escalating to the point that there are PEOPLE injured, instead of a PERSON injured.

And, there is nothing wrong with telling someone I am gonna taze you if you don't do X, Y, Z. I could tell him I am gonna kick his butt if he doesn't step away from me, and there is nothing wrong with that.

Michael
 
Bottom line: lots of folks have dies after being tasered. In most of those cases, the taser has been a contributing -- rather than sole -- factor. That, IMO, is a fairly weak defense, as folks who died from a combination of drugs and a taser, or a heart condition and a taser, or whatever, would not have died if not for the taser.

Regardless, more cases are coming to light where the coroner has determined that the taser was the sole cause of death. Yes, Taser disputes this, but that's only to be expected.
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I agree with you......:eek:
 
Why does everyone keep saying he was handcuffed prior to be stunned. No article I have found says he was handcuffed first?
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From the video I watched his hands appear to be behind his back, which is not a position most people usually take, especially with a good amount of electricity hitting them.

He was not complying, and was resisting. I know, we must wait for violence before we use any technique to stop the incident from escalating, otherwise most of you think it is excessive. I understand that you believe an officer has to be injured before doing anything to the suspect. I believe that they can keep an incident from escalating to the point that there are PEOPLE injured, instead of a PERSON injured.
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I think we can all agree he was not complying but I didn't see any active resisting (unless not doing what you're told or going limp is resisting). Repeatedly telling someone who has been stunned multiple times to stand up does not seem like a great idea anyway. I would think they would realize after a few tries that it wasn't getting the job done. From what I saw the officers were in no danger other than maybe pulling a muscle carrying him out (which they ended up doing anyway). This was not to keep a situation from escalating, they escalated the situation. It seemed like they just wanted to "win" by making him stand up.

When an officer threatened to taze other students for not listening to the officers I believe this showed his belief that the tazer is to enforce compliance rather than to stop a violent act. Police officers, despite what some might think, can do wrong. I'm sure it is tough to make split-second decisions, but that is par for the course of being an officer.

I should add that officers do not need to wait until they are attacked to use force, but using force just because someone won't listen is unnecessary escalation.

And, there is nothing wrong with telling someone I am gonna taze you if you don't do X, Y, Z. I could tell him I am gonna kick his butt if he doesn't step away from me, and there is nothing wrong with that.
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Making a threat might not be criminal, but I sure wouldn't appreciate someone threatening me. And they didn't just tell him they were going to do it, they did it. You can say something all you like, but following through with it may or may not be wrong.

The student should have presented ID and should have complied, but not doing so was not violent. It seems to me that the tazing escalated the situation into something more than it needed to be. Without being there, it is impossible to know all the details, but from what I saw I think the officers were wrong to repeatedly taze him.
 
Posted by Manedwolf
Quote:
Be cordial and you'll recieve in kind....

You are under no obligation to be "cordial" to police officers, especially if they make an unreasonable request or are rude. To say so implies a state of cowed subservience that is in no way related to being a American.

And if you're saying so out of fear that they'll use their high-voltage "whip" on you and make you writhe in agony on the ground just for using profanity or otherwise being discourteous, if you as a law abiding citizen are AFRAID of your police like that, stop and think about what you're saying.
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That was meant for the cops. I meant to say that all cops got to learn some manners. If they were polite towards others, their job would be easier. If they are rude to you, be rude to them!

Posted by wirewrx
And, there is nothing wrong with telling someone I am gonna taze you if you don't do X, Y, Z. I could tell him I am gonna kick his butt if he doesn't step away from me, and there is nothing wrong with that.
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Ofcourse there is something wrong with that. You're a peace officer and you can't use the threat to use force to make somone comply when it is not warrented. Just because somone asked for a badge number and the cop feels threatened by it, then THAT COP NEEDS TO FIND A LESS STRESSFUL OCCUPATION because he has no bussiness playing as an authority figure!

That's why having a cam IS A MUST. Noone should have to go through this type of police bs.
 
Sic, you do realize that 'Resisiting Arrest' is a CRIME; even if the arrest your resisting was invalid?

If they want to arrest your butt for somethign silly; let them and then watch it go away when your lawyer gets invovled.

Or you could jsut make it WORSE and give them actual rights to put your ass in jail.
 
That was meant for the cops. I meant to say that all cops got to learn some manners. If they were polite towards others, their job would be easier. If they are rude to you, be rude to them!
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Its statements like this that make me wonder about people's preception of LEO's. As I stated before, I have never encountered a police officer that was rude or anything other then polite. Sure their tone was authoritive, but they were still polite about it (mind you I have encountered them in areas like Halloween in Madison, and if you know anything about that time... it is very stressfull for LEO's), but there are those out here that hate 'pigs' and the 5-0.

I have had a driving expiriance where the police who pulled over a buddy (for a extremely moronic driving manuver right in front of the officer, I would have ticketed him in a heartbeat, hell I nearly punched him later for putting me through that stunt) and the officers were very nice and polite, even offering good travel advise once they knew where we were heading. I came out thinking, well he got a ticket but at least they were nice.... he came out saing 'man what a *$%#% I hate all cops.'

Maybe you take your own pre-concieved notions out of an encounter, I don't know.
 
Sic, you are totally wrong.

An leo can tell me to leave or he will arrest me, or beat me, or taze me, or shoot me. He can gain compliance anyway he wants, and there is nothing wrong with it. He can attempt to gain complaince with the threat of blowing my head off.

If you can show me one place that indicates that the threat of force is not allowed, then please show me. Why one would need to ASK someone for his badge number, when it is right there for everyone to see, and he is close enough to read it, is just an attempt to egg on the officer. He told him to move back OR ELSE. So what. The fact that he threatened to TAZE him, whether he would or not, is being used to show how the Tazer is being used improperly. In fact, all it proves is that the THREAT of being tazed is being used inthe hopes of getting compliance. Nothing wrong with that. Now, if he actually tazed him for that, that would be wrong. But threatening him, nope, not wrong.

Do you really think that once you are Tazed, that is it, you lose all control, all faculties, and you just become a lump of coal for ever afterwards, or for hours, or 10s of minutes.

You get tazed, you comply, it is over. Besides, he was coherent and capable enough to yell and scream and had faculties enough to refer to the Patriot act and all that.

It does look like his hands are behind him, but I am not sure he was handcuffed BEFORE being tazed. When he is lifted up, it is possible that the officers are holding his hands behind him, and it is not because of handcuffs. The timeline in the video is very hard to discern. Perhaps he had been tazed several times before the start of the video, perhaps that was the first one.

Again, the ACT of going limp is ACTIVE resistance. Sure, it may not be violent or dangerous to the officer, YET, but it is resistance none the less. Sure, they could have used some sort of other comoliance technique, the officer chose to taze since there is no lasting effect, it is a temporary discomfort/pain, and because it is safer for the officer. Don't fault him for that.

Michael
 
With those facts one could argue that such people could have died if you put them in a headlock and hauled them to your Squadcar by force; if your fragile enough to die from such a sudden jolt then I think it stops being the Tazer's fault and ends up the nature of the illness.
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A number of folks with mild electrical cardiac instability -- me, for instance -- don't consider themselves exceptionally "fragile". I get an average of two hours a day of cardivascular exercise and enjoy mountaineering and 100 mile bicycle rides. I think I could survive being dragged around in a choke hold and physically tossed into the squad, but there's an above average chance that a large electric shock would kill me in my tracks. And I'm not a rare case; not by a longshot.

Regardless, I'm not really even arguing against the taser. I just think it's a good idea for folks to regard it as a "less lethal" weapon as opposed to a "non-lethal weapon".
 
There is no indication that a tazer would harm you.

In fact, when I was a medic we used electrical shocks to help people ;)

But, technically, NO FORCE application is NON LETHAL. It is ALL less lethal. A headlock could cause the release of a blood clot, something which MANY americans have, that could cause you to have a stroke, or kill you. Of course, if they did that to the student, people would be screaming that they choked him into submission, and they could have talked nicely to him instead.

It is a lose lose situation. No matter what the officers would have done, people would be upset that they were syrupy sweet, and nice about it. Please mister tresspasser, please leave the building. If you resist, don't worry, we will just beg and plead in the hopes you will. OTherwise, we will just wait here all night, since we have no other crimes to prevent or other service calls to take care of, and or maybe just leave, cause obviously, what YOU want to do is just the MOST important thing in the world, rules and laws be damned. :banghead:

The guy is an idiot. Anyone with half a brain would have walked out, and then gotten an attorney to sue the School and the Police for "violating his civil rights" because he us a Muslim, and asked to leave the Library even though he is a student. Instead, he thinks he is gotta some how fight the law, and win. This time, HE LOST. Too bad for him. As long as the cops are within policy, they will be fine, and I believe they are.
Michael
 
Posted by wiredwrx
An leo can tell me to leave or he will arrest me, or beat me, or taze me, or shoot me. He can gain compliance anyway he wants, and there is nothing wrong with it. He can attempt to gain complaince with the threat of blowing my head off.
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That's police brutality. You can't beat or taze or shoot somone because they refuse to leave. No, they cannot gain complaince anyway they want, there are procedures and rules to follow. So, no, they can't gain compliance through the threat of blowing somone's head off if it is not warrented.

Posted by wiredwrx
the officer chose to taze since there is no lasting effect, it is a temporary discomfort/pain, and because it is safer for the officer. Don't fault him for that.
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No lasting effect? Temporary discomfort? Why should anyone have to endure through such crap? Because he went limp? So what if he grabbed the door and wouldn't let go? shoot him? He was no longer a threat, he had his armed restrained by the officers or hancuffed, if he started thrashing or whatever, they could have easily taken him down and held him there.

Posted by Jrsmith
Its statements like this that make me wonder about people's preception of LEO's. As I stated before, I have never encountered a police officer that was rude or anything other then polite. Sure their tone was authoritive, but they were still polite about it (mind you I have encountered them in areas like Halloween in Madison, and if you know anything about that time... it is very stressfull for LEO's)
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I got nothing against cops in general. I just don't like the ones that take it too far and/or lack manners. I've encountered some of the most polite and chill cops ever and I've had the misfortune of having to deal with some of worst educated ones. I also do not deny the fact that their job is not stressful enough but like I said before if you can't deal with stress then you're in the wrong occupation.

One good example of police BS: at a friends house, the neibour called the cops cause our music was "too" loud. He cop tells us to lower the music, so we did. After a few mins, we went to walk the dog and who drove by? the same cop.... And you know what he said to me? "I better not see you again". So I told him in the same rude tone "Well, I better not see you either". He clearly got pissed and would have probably arrested me but his partner told him to cool down or something and just drove away. So *** BS was that? I would have had a field day if he arrested me or whatever. I would have gone to the news paper, tv news etc and made a huge noise.
 
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