Poll:Should it be Mandatory to Notify LE You are Carrying Concealed With a Permit?

[Duke Junior]

We've discussed this issue ,but I've never seen a poll of how most THR members think about the consequences.
10 of the 48 shall issue or may issue states require you to notify LE during a traffic stop if you are carrying concealed with a permit.
Proponents argue this helps protect LE and is a minor infringement.
Opponents contend only law abiding citizens obey this law and it's another infringement against our 2nd Amendment rights.
Those 10 states are AK,LA,MI,NE,NC,OH,OK,SC,TX and UT.
Illinois and Wisconsin do not issue permits under any circumstances.
Opinions?

 

[Dookie]

Needs to be one or the other, we have to many instances where someone is legally allowed to carry and get hassled because they did not know the exact laws

 

[HK G3]

I say no, because your right to carry shouldn't be superceded by a peace officer merely conducting an investigation into possible unlawful activities.

That said, I'd inform during a traffic stop, if for nothing else, than to try and make the LEO feel more at ease.

 

[Standing Wolf]

My guns are none of government's big nosy business.

 

[Deanimator]

It's stupid. Here in Ohio, there's "mission creep" where some cops demand that you notify even if you AREN'T carrying, even though that's not required by the law AT ALL. They need to do away with the ENTIRE requirement.

 

[EShell]

Don't ask, don't tell.

 

[Biker]

It shouldn't be required by law and it isn't in Idaho, but I inform anyway just to expedite the contact and to put the officer at ease.

I don't look like the friendliest guy in the world...

Biker

 

[SCKimberFan]

In many states, your permit is tied to your DL, so they aready know in a lot of cases. However, if it is not pertinent to the stop, I don't think it should be volunteered.

Having said that, I live in one of the 10 states that require you to inform.

 

[jpruitt]

Should I have to tell an officer if I have bubble gum in my pocket? If not, what's the difference? Either is completely legal and does not threaten the officer's safety and has no bearing on whatever he is doing (unless I just shot someone).

 

[BBQLS1]

I'm kinda on the fence about this. On one hand it's none of the governments business, but on the other, it can save a lot of hassle.

 

[Code3GT]

Its kind of a Catch-22 in Texas IMO. I dont like it but when they run your DL, it comes up (if computer equipped) that the person may be armed and has a CHL/CCW. So even if you arent carrying (in which notification ISNT required) they may still hassle a person for not notifying. I, out of politeness, notify either way. Usually helps.

 

[ditch_dgr]

I have several friends that are police officers in my town and state, all of them told me it would be a good thing to inform because then they know the gun is there and they won't react badly if they see it. They all said the stop will go much smoother. I have no problem with it, I don't think that every single person working for the government is looking for an excuse to hassle me.

 

[DMXRoid]

Seems as though there are two questions here:

1.) Is there a compelling reason for the state to force you to disclose the fact that you're exercising your freedoms

2.) Is it a good thing to let a cop know that you're armed.

The answer to the first question is almost certainly no. I can't think of any reason why I would want to, or be required to, notify the government, or its agents, of my exercise of ANY of my freedoms, as they relate to firearms or speech or my refusal to quarter soldiers in my home or whatever. The fact that they are my freedoms removes the state's oversight from my use of them, until I cross some line (shooting someone, fire in a crowded theater, whatever).

Partially, that's the distinction between positive rights and negative freedoms, and how you look at the way the role of the state is defined. If our rights exist because they're granted by the state, then they are beholden to the whim of the state, there's no underlying, inherent principles which make any right inviolate. In this example, the government grants you the right to carry a concealed weapon, and, as the granter of that right, can determine the conditions under which you can exercise it, including a requirement that you notify law enforcement if you're carrying.

On the other hand, if the job of the state is merely to create a framework in which we can exercise our freedoms in such a way that we don't impinge upon the freedoms of our fellow citizens, the rationale for this kind of regulation is much weaker. In this view, we as citizens HAVE the freedom to protect ourselves from other people, wild animals, and runaways governments, and the state has no business limiting that freedom in any way until we prove that we can't be responsible with it. A regulation requiring that I tell a cop that I'm carrying would be unjustifiable given that the state's only business is to ensure that I, as a citizen, am able to exercise my freedom of self defense.

I'm a fan of negative liberty over positive rights, but it's a valid point of contention.

That said, as to question #2, I can think of few scenarios where telling a cop you're carrying is a bad thing, and a lot more where NOT telling the cop is a bad thing. It's mostly common courtesy. Put it this way: wouldn't YOU want to know if you were in their shoes? Just so you can have all the information? An interaction with a police officer isn't like an interaction with anyone else, it's an inherently confrontational scenario that can be stressful for both parties, and accidents can happen. If there's no downside to it, I don't see an issue with being up front about something that could be VERY important. That said, it shouldn't be mandatory, the government shouldn't force me to NOT be a jerk.

 

[Crimp]

Our state says you don't need to disclose. Many others say you do. I believe in state's rights, so I ain't arguing. Know your laws when you travel!

 

[csmkersh]

In Texas, if you are licensed to carry concealed and are doing so, you are required to tell the officer. If, OTOH, you are not licensed and have a handgun in the glove box, under a towel on the passenger seat, or otherwise hidden from view, you are not required to tell the officer you're armed.

§ 46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person
commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or
recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun, illegal
knife, or club if the person is not:
(1) on the person's own premises or premises under the
person's control; or
(2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle
that is owned by the person or under the person's control.
(a-1) A person commits an offense if the person
intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or
her person a handgun in a motor vehicle that is owned by the person
or under the person's control at any time in which:
(1) the handgun is in plain view; or
(2) the person is:
(A) engaged in criminal activity, other than a
Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance
regulating traffic;
(B) prohibited by law from possessing a firearm;
or
(C) a member of a criminal street gang, as
defined by Section 71.01.
(a-2) For purposes of this section, "premises" includes
real property and a recreational vehicle that is being used as
living quarters, regardless of whether that use is temporary or
permanent. In this subsection, "recreational vehicle" means a motor
vehicle primarily designed as temporary living quarters or a
vehicle that contains temporary living quarters and is designed to
be towed by a motor vehicle. The term includes a travel trailer,
camping trailer, truck camper, motor home, and horse trailer with
living quarters.
(b) Except as provided by Subsection (c), an offense under
this section is a Class A misdemeanor.
(c) An offense under this section is a felony of the third
degree if the offense is committed on any premises licensed or
issued a permit by this state for the sale of alcoholic beverages.

​

​

 

[TexasRifleman]

I live in Texas so it doesn't matter, I have to anyway. (CHL)

I just rarely agree with things that have the words "always" or "never" in them.

 

[Geno]

The only thing worse than having to advise, is having to get a permit to carry. Put the two together, and you have society control, not societal security.

Clingin' to my Bible and guns...

Doc2005

 

[possum]

i don't think you should have to notify the leo's that you are cc'ing

 

[ConstitutionCowboy]

It's simple. Having to tell anyone in government you are carrying a weapon is an infringement.

Woody

 

[cerberus65]

In my state (SC) I am required to inform if I'm carrying but not if I have a gun in the glovebox or console. That makes no sense at all to me. One is about as accessible as the other.

For me, my gun has absolutely no place in the conversation about whatever bone-headed traffic-related thing I might have done. But if I was the type of person that would be tempted to introduce a gun into that sort of conversation would I have a permit? Would I volunteer any gun-related info that would tip my hand?

So I fail to see how it makes the LEO any safer. But I'm always up for learning new things so feel free to educate me (esp. if you're LE).

Personally, I fear the LEO who wants to control my carry piece during a stop and might be inclined to deprive me of it. I'm carrying it legally and it should be no basis for any probable cause.

Having said all that, the law is the law and I will inform. Of course, you can also bet your bottom dollar that I will be as respectful as I can during the whole encounter. I try not to be a bother to anyone (LE or not) and if I've already bothered them enough to have to stop me I'm not about to do anything to add to that bother.

 

[slewfoot]

If you are a legal concealed carrier, you have already passed a background check.

Nothing more should be required.

 

[ROVERMAN]

The law is the law wether I agree or disagree with it here in NC I follow it. That is part of being a LAW ABIDING CITIZEN. For my opinion though I put myself in the shoes of the LEO walking up to a car I just pulled over on some remote road. I would want to know for my own piece of mind.

 

[wyocarp]

It seems like it is backwards to me. If I were a cop, I'd be more concerned about those without a permit than those with. It shouldn't be a handicap to do something completely legal and by the book. Cops need to stick to business of crime and leave the rest of us alone!

 

[slow944]

Here it Texas it's the law you have to ID yourself to a police officer if stoped for a traffic violation.

 

[Treo]

I doubt there's any serious question as to how I voted.
In Colorado no permit is required to carry a concealed weapon in your car, there is also no requirement to inform and, depending on what county issued your permit, no database to tell the cop you’re carrying.

So in no case in Colorado am I required to inform. For those in states that allow carry in a vehicle w/out a permit but require CHP holders to inform it’s a ridiculous requirement.

No if we can just get Colorado to pass a Vermont style CCW law…..