Poll, Using the magazine as a grip.

[rocinante]

I have been told to never use the magazine as a grip. If anything went kaboom it might damage or remove your hand. Some way it might affect the feed. BUT I am constantly seeing pics of various military and police and other pros doing exactly that. So is it bad and dangerous practice?

 

[Carter]

I've never seen or heard of an AR kaboom that was bad enough to do that, but I could just be uninformed.

Using the magwell/magazine as a grip isn't my favorite practice, but sometimes its usefull or comfortable.

 

[gunnutery]

That's never been addresses in the LE training I've been in, but better safe than sorry. I'm also hesitant to call someone a pro. I can only speak about the military second hand, but from what I've gathered in talking to numerous army/national guard members, firearm training has been lacking. And I can definately say that I'm one of the few officers between two depts that shoots on my own time. The rest only shoot once a year. They're good shots, but training and self training is rare.

 

[wally]

It should in no way affect feed or function, if you can't use the magazine as a hand grip or a quick'n'dirty mono-pod your rifle is broken.

If you used the bottom of the mag as a "cup and saucer" hold and had a case head failure it'd probably hurt quite a lot, but unless the lower actually comes apart, (in which case its likely bad no matter how you hold it) it should not be an issue using the mag/well as vertical grip if a case head fails.

 

[IBEWBULL]

As far as i can remember the Sten and some other sub guns were designed to use the magwell for support due to heat on the forend.
Tell me if I am in error.

 

[GoWolfpack]

On some rifles holding or touching the magazine while firing can cause failures to feed properly. Happened on a Mini-30 I shot a while ago. ARs have much better support for the magazine than Minis.

 

[DeepSouth]

.
.
.
CAUTION! CONTAINS IMPROPER LANGUAGE AT END!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oh1lyMyejpI
.
.
.
I wouldn't want to have my hand on the mag of the gun in that video, but I don't think it would have removed a hand. Probably not the best idea but I'm not overly concerned with it. I guess bottom line is when a gun kaboom's there will be places you really don't want your hands, but knowing where those places are is probably hindsight more times than not.


I have seen some of those super wobbly AK mags that don't feed right when their being pulled on.

 

[as37692]

When I went to the two week Squad Designated Marksman course put on by the Army Marksmanship Unit back in 2008, the only way we were allowed to shot was by holding on to the front of the magzinewell and the magazine. After two weeks being on the range and shooting every day, things have a way of sticking with you, and now the only way I shot my issue M16A4 or my personal M4 and A4 clones is well holding onto magzinewell and the magazine.

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Depends on the firearm I imagine. With the AR15, I sometimes use the magwell (not the magazine) as a grip. That has never caused me any problems.

I've also used the magazine as a monopod and never had any problems.

From those two pieces of data, I would guess you can probably get away with using the actual magazine as a grip if you wanted to; but ergonomically, there isn't much point to it on an AR.

 

[carbine85]

I said yes since I do it all the time and never really thought about it.

 

[mc223]

http://www.armalite.com/ItemForm.aspx?item=GW01A-BLK

http://www.702shooter.com/nifty-gad...b-defense-mag-well-grip-vs-tactical-mag-well/

http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=792

 

[Roan]

The Sten and other early SMGs were designed to have the magazine held by hand in order to stabilize the weapon. This practice fell out of favor not because of personal injury but rather to the fact that this damaged and wore out the magazine latch as well as the feed lips on the magazine. Beyond this, some models would have problems feeding during the practice, particularly when coupled with the higher wear on the magazine locking mechanisms. Holding a weapon by the magazine WELL should not be a problem. These problems were recorded primarily with fully automatic weapons, so I don't know if a semi-automatic would exhibit the same accelerated wear.

 

[LemmyCaution]

According to US Army FM 23-8, it's just fine for the M-14.

 

[Dionysusigma]

Know one guy who swears by it (to the point of being annoying). Claims it helps reduce reload time. Works for him, apparently, as he consistently places in the top 10-20% in local 3-gun matches.

Feels odd to me, though.

 

[SGW42]

I was taught stauchly to keep my hand on the forearm, horizontal. O'Connor told me to tuck my hand up next to the sling swivel. Seems to provide a better platform when shooting off-hand.

I forget what firearm I was reading about that advised not to hold the magazine for fear of misfeads, but sounded like sound advice. All of the pics I see of people holding an AR-type rifle like that seem to be holding the mag well, not the magazine, or so I assumed. I don't keep to many tabs on the tactical stuff.

 

[garyhan]

I used to shoot a rental Sterling smg now and then. One of the staff (she was British and should have known the Sterling) always insisted I hold it by the mag. Every time I did, I got repeated jams which never occurred otherwise. Since then, I have held no gun by the mag.

gary

 

[gunnutery]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utn8j05ZzEs

Not sure how it ended up for this guy, but he was definately holding his left hand after the kaboom.

 

[jpwilly]

I've done it but it's not my prefered method 100% of the time.

There's a neat product that is a little mag well grip if you want to employ this hold with a little more comfort. I saw one for the first time on a Phoenix SWAT unit SBR.

Something like this: http://gunsforsale.com/ghg/2010/06/18/gripwell-review-for-ar-15/

 

[AK103K]

As far as i can remember the Sten and some other sub guns were designed to use the magwell for support due to heat on the forend.
Tell me if I am in error.

Youre in error, sort of.

The STEN was meant to be held by the barrel shroud, not the mag. I cant think of one SMG that the mag was meant to be held onto by the off hand. Mag wells yes, mags, no. Its a good way to cause stoppages.

Not that it wasnt done, as things got hot, but even then, its more Hollywood than anything else.

 

[henschman]

A lot of NRA High Power and CMP shooters put their hand up against the mag on an M-14 or the magwell on an AR for their offhand position, with the elbow down against their rib cage for a solid, bone-on-bone position. This works well if you have no sling (or if the rules prohibit you from using one).

But in a sling-supported position, your hand should be on the forearm, preferably up against the sling swivel, with your elbow under the rifle.

If you're using a supported position, your support side hand should be on the stock.

As for CQB, there are lots of different techniques taught, but I do not favor grabbing the mag/magwell for this. I prefer grabbing the rifle as far forward on the handguard as possible. This gives you better leverage and muzzle control.

 

[AK103K]

I prefer grabbing the rifle as far forward on the handguard as possible. This gives you better leverage and muzzle control.

I agree. It also makes pointing and shooting much faster, easier, and more natural.

 

[HorseSoldier]

Another +1.

It may be good for NRA standing off hand stuff, but for combat marksmanship/CQB sort of stuff it's just bad form. Hand on the front of the magwell (or VFG a couple inches in front of it) is more comfortable, but sacrifices muzzle control and slows speed.

 

[franconialocal]

I don't know what the "right" or technically correct answer is to this question but I can tell you I'd be doing pushups on the range firing line if my Sgt. saw me doing it......just sayin'

 

[blackspyder]

I don't like the idea of holding the mag/magwell for support while firing. Moving parts and extra pressure aren't exactly good combos. Besides with my luck I'd hit the mag release every time.

 

[snakeman]

I have used my mag as a grip and monopod