Powder dragout using Imperial Sizing Die Wax inside case mouths

[cwsanfor]

Seeking more uniform shoulder setback, I switched from graphite to Imperial for lubing case mouth interiors, and installed a Redding Carbide Button.

Although the Carbide Button may eliminate the need for lubing mouth interiors, I decided to use a little Imperial on the first 20 or so rounds in the ladders I am working up to shoot tomorrow, just to further slick up the button.

I get an incredible amount of powder dragout with Imperial inside the mouths: so much so that I can hear the kernels falling out and hitting the press, and enough, I am pretty sure, to show up on the chrono.

This is not a huge deal, I can fix it by returning to mica/graphite, or testing to see whether the Carbide Button will actually work well without lube, and not pull the shoulders out. However, I am curious: I know many of you use Imperial or suchlike for this purpose, do you have this issue?

 

[rcmodel]

Using WAY too much.

A little dab will do ya.

Like wipe your fingertip in the wax, and then rub it on a nylon bore brush.
Then use it to do 50 or so cases before adding any more to the brush!

rc

 

[cwsanfor]

rcmodel,

I hear you. I was using a nylon brush, or a Q-Tip, applying what I thought was the minimum amount that would be consistently spread and effective, but I am new to rifle loading, and none too bright.

I'll try the less-is-more approach, and probably also run a controlled trial with and without lube to see if the Carbide Button alone will do the trick. Or maybe do like Hemingway did with vermouth and martinis: just show the die a can of Imperial every now and then.

 

[rcmodel]

Less IS for sure more in this instance.

I use a lube pad sometimes.
I will dab a case mouth on it about once every 4-5 cases.

What you put in there on one case is scraped off the first case by the expander.
And stays clinging to the expander to do what it does for several more cases.

In all, I don't get my panties in a wad about inside neck lube anyway unless the expander starts squeaking & squawking when I pull it out of the case.

rc

 

[cfullgraf]

I agree with rcmodel on lubing the inside of the case mouth. Once every few cases is enough as residual lubricant is left for a few more cases.

I do find that some lubricant is needed on Redding carbide expander balls. It just expands the mouth of the case easier.

Maybe if one used a bushing die with the bushing size near perfect, the carbide button would not need lubricant.

I am just beginning to experiment with bushing dies on 17 Remington and 221 Remington Fireball.

 

[armarsh]

I use Imperial on a small cylinder brush. I only need to reapply it a few times a year to the brush, and then just a small amount.

 

[popper]

powder dragout

sizing after charging? Why?

 

[Dthunter]

This probably a case where you are doing a step in a loading process thats not needed/required.

Have you sized your cases with/without neck lube, then checked/compared for concentricity? you will likely find little to no difference. But make sure to brush the necks with a nylon neck brush prior to sizing. I have found no difference on the target between rounds that are .003"- to .001" out of concentric. Much more than .003" and it seems to start to show up.

Dont sweat the small stuff too much. A reloader can get wrapped up in overdoing it. Find a balance, and go shooting.

 

[Steel Talon]

A little dab will do ya.

a "Dipitty Doo" is still to much.. I apply Imp Die wax with my palms with for bulk runs. I take about every third piece of brass and give the case mouth a gentle twist in my palm. It provides just enough coating for the expander.

 

[b78-22250]

I am with Popper. Size first charge after priming.

 

[sugarmaker]

Just to toss this in: On an LNL-AP I use a lee collet neck size on station 1, and a redding body die on station 2, no need for inside neck lube, never have a high primer, and very good runout.

 

[kelbro]

Just use the graphite with the carbide expander ball. That's all that you need.

You might even consider losing the expander ball altogether.

 

[ranger335v]

"I get an incredible amount of powder dragout with Imperial inside the mouths:"

I don't have a clue what you mean; "dragout" of powder during sizing?

 

[Pete D.]

Huh?

"I get an incredible amount of powder dragout with Imperial inside the mouths:"

I don't have a clue what you mean; "dragout" of powder during sizing?

+2.
What is the powder doing in there at that point?
Pete

 

[Innovative]

My method ...

I prefer to use bushing type FL resizing dies with just a decapping rod, and no expander ball.

However, if you're particular die requires an expander ball, make sure the ball is carbide. Start by cleaning the ID of your case necks with a bore brush before resizing, and it will improve the uniformity of sizing and bullet seating. Then, if your expander is carbide, you'll never need to use a neck lube.

 

[P51D]

As others have asked, what is "powder dragout"?

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I can't believe how many are responding without knowing what the OP is really talking about. What is "powder dragout"?

 

[Innovative]

ArchAngelCD ......

I suspect the OP made up the term "powder dragout" to describe the condition he sees when his expander pulls back through the tight neck of a fired case.

The degree of experimenting can get out of this world when a new shooter is in search of better accuracy. However, the required pressure from the expander ball is minimized if you CLEAN the case necks as I described.

 

[918v]

In my experience, a carbide button does not significantly drag inside the case mouth. Further, inserting a decapper into a charged case is just wrong. Why the OP would do this is beyond comprehension. I have no words other than Step Away from the Press!

 

[918v]

I suspect the OP made up the term "powder dragout" to describe the condition he sees when his expander pulls back through the tight neck of a fired case.

I don't think so:

I get an incredible amount of powder dragout with Imperial inside the mouths: so much so that I can hear the kernels falling out and hitting the press, and enough, I am pretty sure, to show up on the chrono.

 

[4895]

I would throw them back into the tumbler for 20 minutes or so to remove any case lube.

 

[Innovative]

The only way the OP can drag out "kernals" of powder, is to extract the expander ball from a charged case. (It's pretty hard to believe he would do that.)
If the OP is dealing with burned powder residue, it just means that he isn't cleaning his case necks well enough.

 

[powell&hyde]

OP, are you resizing and expanding before you add powder? There should be no reason to be hearing the kernels falling out and hitting the press unless your resizing after you add the powder? Prep the case first than add powder.