Question about New York City gun laws

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Kentak

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I truly am posing this for information--not to get political. Please, no comments about the character or personality of any political figures.

It's my understanding that CCW in NYC would be possible if one was issued a handgun license, but that doesn't happen because licensing is on a "may issue" basis, and the powers that be have decided they are not going to do that for ordinary citizens.

It is also my understanding that that situation could change IF the mayor would simply direct the appropriate police official to issue the licenses more freely.

Is my understanding correct, or not?

K
 
My understanding is that you must have a "handgun license" to posess a handgun in NYC, even in your own domicile. Most licenses, if issued, are restricted to one's home, and unloaded/cased transport to/from ranges/gunsmiths/etc.

You have to show "reason" to have an unrestricted license, which is the equivalent of a carry permit most other places in the USA.

It is the position of those in power that more guns = more crime, and therefore, in order to reduce the number of "guns on the street", any such request will be given the strictest scrutiny.

As a result, few such permits are issued. Most of them are issued to celebrities and the very rich, who cite their celebrity and/or wealth as the compelling reason why they are in danger, and therefore in "need" of a sidearm.


So, to answer your question, it's primarilly a policy issue. There's nothing structurally preventing them from adopting a policy of "defacto shall issue", which is pretty much how the state of CT does it.

As a policy issue, it's politically impalatable, (basically, political suicide) as any mayor who direct _that_ change in policy lays himself _wide_ open to taking the blame for even the normal amount of crime in the city.

No one wants to have to answer the political commerical that says, "in 2008, Mayor X loosened the requirements of handgun licenses. Since that time, Y people have been killed. Doesn't mayor X have enough blood on his hands?"


Historically, the Sullivan Laws, which go back to 1911, were basically an artifice of the Tammany Hall political machine, devised to disarm recent immigrants, generally of Irish and Italian stock, and Republicans. Any Democrat in good standing could obtain a permit easily.
 
Thank you, geek,

That gets to the meat of what I wanted to know.

In other words, no LAWS have to change, just the attitudes and policies of the city officials. Political considerations aside, a NYC mayor could, by fiat, allow citizens to get licenses to carry.

K
 
Word is since taking office current mayor Bloomberg has revoked a lot of pistol permits, including carry permits.

I believe NYC has a permit that only allows keeping a handgun in your domecile for self defense (no carrying).
 
Start by going here. http://www.nraila.org/statelawpdfs/NYCCL.pdf
You need an NYC permit to possess any firearm. You need approval to buy each and every handgun.
This a few of the highlights pertaining to handguns in NYC.
"The Commissioner of the New York City Police Department is the issuing authority for handgun licenses."
"To obtain a license to carry a concealed handgun the applicant is required to show that proper cause exists for the issuance of the license. The decision to issue or deny this license is within the discretion of the Commissioner, administered through the Pistol Licensing Division. A court will only overturn any decision granting or denying a concealed carry license if it can be shown that the Commissioner abused his discretion."
"The license to possess a handgun is a license to carry unless restricted, but almost all licenses are restricted."
"Handgun licenses issued elsewhere in New York State are not valid in New York City. New York City licenses are valid throughout New York State."
They'll let you drive through, but your firearms must be locked up and you can't make any stops.
"non-refundable application fee of all licenses and renewals is $170.00 for the first two years...The fingerprinting fee is $99.00."
 
They'll let you drive through, but your firearms must be locked up and you can't make any stops.
Click to expand...

FOPA 1986 supercedes any state or local laws. NYC has to abide by the FOPA 1986 interstate travel clause
 
The fees are now $440 to apply, non-refundable, even for a premise permit. Also, regardless of federal law, you probably will be arrested for traveling through NYC with a firearm, even if it is locked in your trunk, if you don't at least have a NYS permit.
 
LAR-15 said:
FOPA 1986 supercedes any state or local laws. NYC has to abide by the FOPA 1986 interstate travel clause
Click to expand...

Do you recall offhand if FOPA addresses ammunition? I can just hear a NYC police officer telling me "well, the gun is properly stored per federal law for your transit through our fine city, but these rounds in it..."
 
Geek is correct, there are varying degrees of pistol ownership in NYC. It's something like this:

Premises license: easy to get
the myriad of middle grade licenses: harder to get
carry: very difficult to get

all are expensive (if you consider ~$500 expensive).

Note, it is not impossible to own a gun in NYC. It's just a royal pain and costly. If you own bolt action long guns, pump shotguns, and 1911 pistols, you could bring all of them into NYC, you'd just have to pay a great deal. However, when you consider that space downtown is at a premium anyway, you're not going to be bringing your entire collection with you unless you can afford larger space, in which case, you can probably afford the permit fees.

Do you recall offhand if FOPA addresses ammunition? I can just hear a NYC police officer telling me "well, the gun is properly stored per federal law for your transit through our fine city, but these rounds in it..."
Click to expand...

Yes, you can bring it through NYC, they even list a traveling exemption in their bylaws. It must however be unloaded, because NYS and NYC do not permit transportation of a loaded firearm even for NYS and NYC residents.
 
First and foremost to own a handgun in NYC you need to get the license. The license that you get is broken into the following categories


Premise License: Allowed to have and keep in home

Premise Place of Buisiness license: Allowed ot have at your place of buisiness

Target License: Allowed to own it and bring it to the range for practice, no where else

Hunting: Allowed to have it for the strict purpose of hunting

Carry Buisiness: Handgun allowed to be carried while employed.

I'm going off memory on the license divisions, i'll check my handbook when I get home. But yes, with the current laws on the book it's pretty much, you can have a handgun sure, but you have to show us a good reason why you need it.
 
They did away with the target license, if you have a premise license it is a de facto target license. Though the law doesn't allow you to transport it to the range (or even home from the gun shop), the policy of the licensing division does, so you can.
 
yeah this business of showing need is BS.
people routinely get mugged for amounts far smaller than the amounts that would qualify you to get a carry permit in the city.
I'm going to try to get a carry/limited carry for my business but the process is like opening up all your books to the police.
 
and don't forget

that you can't possess any ammo unless you have a permit for a gun that uses that caliber. So even if you have a carry permit for a .38 revolver you can go to jail if you have even 1 round of 9mm ammo. And a 15 round mag is a felony (unless its preban).
 
that you can't possess any ammo unless you have a permit for a gun that uses that caliber. So even if you have a carry permit for a .38 revolver you can go to jail if you have even 1 round of 9mm ammo. And a 15 round mag is a felony (unless its preban).
Click to expand...

I don't believe that the ammo part is correct. Could you please link to that.
 
Looked up in my book here, this is the licenses that were applicable back in April of this year

Premise Dwelling
Premise Business
Sportsman License: Target Shooting
Sportsman License: Hunting
Bank Courier / Express Messenger
Employment Carry
Employee of Corrections
Full Carry
Full Carry: Retired Police or Federal Law Enforcement Officer
Gunsmith
Firearm Dealer
 
Jay,

So, I assume the issuing of "full carry" to ordinary civilians is very rare? By ordinary, I mean people without unusual political influence or contacts.

K
 
I grew up in NYC and worked for a CPA firm there. One of our clients wanted a carry license because of the amounts of cash he would bring to the bank. A few grand in cash per week was not enough. He had to set up new bank accounts and basically started shifting five-figure sums of cash around. Large sums of cash draw the scrutiny of bankers not to mention the hassle it is for everyone involved.

For perspective he lived and worked in Staten Island (pop~450,000), which is the most suburban of NYC's five boroughs. His business and residence were mid-island in a middle-class area, and he was a middle-aged Jewish guy. I won't say what kind of business, but let's say by it's very nature it would be a target for anti-semitism.
 
One of my friends said it best

"In order to get a full carry, the Lord himself must part the heavens, descend on a gilded cloud, kneel before you and present said license on a red velvet cloud"
 
I grew up in NYC and worked for a CPA firm there. One of our clients wanted a carry license because of the amounts of cash he would bring to the bank. A few grand in cash per week was not enough. He had to set up new bank accounts and basically started shifting five-figure sums of cash around. Large sums of cash draw the scrutiny of bankers not to mention the hassle it is for everyone involved.

For perspective he lived and worked in Staten Island (pop~450,000), which is the most suburban of NYC's five boroughs. His business and residence were mid-island in a middle-class area, and he was a middle-aged Jewish guy. I won't say what kind of business, but let's say by it's very nature it would be a target for anti-semitism.
Click to expand...

Diamond Merchant

One CA sheriff wrote on his website that CCWs are only for people such as diamond merchants and actors. I'm not sure if the sheriff was Jewish.
 
Prince Yamato said
don't believe that the ammo part is correct. Could you please link to that.
Click to expand...

http://law.justia.com/newyork/codes/new-york-city-administrative-code-new/adc010-306_10-306.html

d. It shall be unlawful for any person who is required to have a
permit in order to possess a rifle or shotgun (that means just about everyone except Peace/Police Officers) and who has not been
issued such permit to possess rifle or shotgun ammunition or an
ammunition feeding device which is designed for use in a rifle or shotgun.

g. Notwithstanding any other provision of this section, any person
authorized to possess a pistol or revolver within the city of New York
may possess ammunition suitable for use in such pistol or revolver and a
dealer in firearms or dealer in rifles and shotguns may dispose of such
ammunition to such person pursuant to subdivision i of section 10-131.
 
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