Question about rearsenaled Sistema's......

[CrazyIrishman]

Hey guys,


I have a general question about 1911's that went through the rebuild process at one time or another.

In particular this concerns the Sistema Colts. I have been looking for the correct hammer to replace the damaged one without much luck. Now I know that this 1911 hardly qualifies as a high dollar collectible when compared to many other 1911's. I just want to keep this pistol like it was issued and not detract from it.

I can find Colt hammers (which are slightly different,btw) which of course will work just fine.

So here's the question:

Is it possible that the rebuilder (I assume it would an armorer) during reassembly would use whatever parts were at hand similar to rebuilding M1 Garands or were they picky? I'm not sure how the Argentinians did it.

If its possible a different brand hammer could have been used at one time so be it! I did find out that at least one Sistema owner has a standard hammer instead of a wide spur.


Thanks for your patience from a 1911 newbie!

 

[Johnny Guest]

I bought a Sistema 1927 a few years ago.

It wore the old 1911-style hammer. Two problems with the pistol - -The long, wide hammer did pinch my hand a bit, and the trigger pull was terrible. I got into my limited stock of spare parts and did a little swapping around. The substitution of a stock GI, narrow 1911A1 hammer both cured the pinching and improved the trigger break enormously.

Good luck to you.
Johnny

 

[BluesBear]

It seems that the Sistema is a popular platform for customization. One of the first things that usually gets replaced it the hammer. If you look around and find someone who works on these you'll possibly find a hammer or two laying around in their parts box.

Since all of my Colts wear wide hammers I grab them when I find them since I have never found one that didn't work very well with the stock Colt sear.

Also check eBay. Quite often I have seen Sistema parts there.

 

[Old Fuff]

The Argentine military and police forces purchased genuine Colt pistols at various times except during and shortly after World War Two. It is possible they had parts that for one reason or another were used in repairing their own guns. While a Colt hammer in a Argentine gun is not probable, it is not impossible either.

 

[Seraph]

The EMC wide spur hammer is a dead ringer for the hammer you want, and it's machined from tool steel in the USA (Kingsport, Tennessee). I have one on my customized SA Mil Spec. Mine's bobbed a little to prevent hammer bite, but few would notice. You can order one from Brownell's.

 

[CrazyIrishman]

Seraph,

I spoke to the Tech Dept. at Brownells several months ago I guess about this part after I received their catalog supplement(cat #57,sup #2,pg#12) and saw the exact hammer we are now talking about.

The Tech guy told me that this hammer was for 1911's but not 1911a1's due to it being the shorter of the two. I don't recall his name.

Does the hammer thats on your Springfield have a radius cut or square cut on either shoulder right where the spur widens?

BTW,thats a nice lookin' Springfield! I'll bet ya get a real good grip on 'er too with the style cut you have on the grips!! LOL


Thanks for the info!

 

[Seraph]

This pic from Brownell's shows the square corner where the wide part of the hammer begins. I guess it may not be a dead ringer, but it certainly fits my 1911A1 just fine. As far as quality, I don't think you could find a nicer part, however much more correct.
I don't quite get your joke about the grips, but they are sure grippy enough. My only complaint with them is they feel a tad narrow, due to the vertical furrows. I'll probably be getting some more conventional grips on there soon. I'd love to have a nice Sistema to keep this and my other Springfield company.

 

[CrazyIrishman]

Seraph,

What I meant about the grips, is that by the way they're cut instead of the traditional checkering, the pistol would not budge at all under recoil, so...."ya get a real good grip on 'er". I sorta think of the grips as having "tread" in a sense! LOL. Some are more agressive than others and may not be real comfortable while a smoother set would feel better but the recoil might bother some.

Years ago (1981-82) I had an Interarms "Virginian Dragoon" 44 mag SA 7.5 bbl. revolver which is a little larger than a Colt SAA. The stock grips would move under recoil even if you used a 44 Spl load. The lower edge on the grips would dig into your hand and get your attention quick. They were pretty but not real functional. I put a rubber Pachmayr grip on it and solved the problem.

After seeing the pic you posted about the hammer I'm gonna get with the Tech dept. this Monday and have at it again. One last thing. If ya have a chance would ya mind measuring from the flat (where the firing pin hits) to the end of the spur? That would tell me in an instant if its the critter I'm lookin' fer!

I want to thank all of ya for your help 'n ideas!


Marty
(aka--CrazyIrishman)

 

[Old Fuff]

The hammer pictured is typical of those used in World War One 1911 Colts, and in 1911A1 pistols made between the wars up until about 1939. Thereafter Colt shortened the spur slightly and rounded the end to help prevent "hammer bite."

The Colt pistols made for the Argentine government had the same hammer, and Argentina used a similar pattern in they're own guns. The principal difference was that the cut in front of the flanks was square rather then radiused. One can duplicate the same effect on a Colt part by making a few file-strokes. The checkering pattern on the Argentine hammer was slightly different too, but few would notice.

The expert at Brownells was sort of right. The hammer under discussion would not be correct in a post 1939 Colt USGI pistol, or one made by another contractor using Colt hammers. It would however be O.K. in a pre-1939 Colt, either military or commercial.

As the Argentine guns are exact copies of the Colt (Colt after all set up the factory) all Colt parts, including hammers should interchange.

 

[Berg]

I don't have an answer about the hammer but I wanted to say good for you on keeping it original.

Most military collector guns today (if not all of them) were low-dollar items that people thought nothing of taking a saw, file, drill or whatever to.

Think of all the Krags, M1917 Eddystone, and M1941 Johnson rifles "sporterized" back in the day.

That Sistema is one of the best surplus 1911's available and will easily gain value over time.

 

[CrazyIrishman]

Berg,

The only mods I would ever do would be non-permanent in nature and don't require frame cutting/grinding etc. I could see a drop-in beavertail, commander hammer,match trigger,and grips ,but nothing else.

If I want different sights and a lowered ejection port than its time to buy a good ,used slide and modify that one.

Later on down the road I might have a barrel put in it. I've only been to the range once with it sp far. With everything original (bbl,frame,slide #'s match) I managed 3.00"-3.50" groups @ 25 yds. w/230 grn. ball. At one point I got a smaller group but I felt that was a fluke and not a true indication of accuracy.

The rifling is still there but its not far from being a 45 cal. "shotgun" LOL! Not bad for a 48 year old pistol though. I only had 125 rounds with me, but it went through all of 'em w/o a SINGLE PROBLEM! Imagine.....NO FTF's, NO FTE's, NO misfires, NOT even a plain old jam! Most of the ammo was new (100 rds. Remington) and the rest (25 rds)was either Korean or WWII vintage issue.

Next time I'll try some HP's. My ONLY complaint with the Sistema is the miniature sights on it! (I really need glasses).