I want a SW Model 25 in .45 Colt (Not 45 ACP) so my choice is to buy a brand new Model 25 in the Classic series or...for around the same price...buy an excellent used one like a 25-5 made in late 1970s or early 80s. Question: If I do not care about the lock, which I do not, are the manufacturing standards so different, so much higher in the old ones, that I should buy an early one or is it just as well to have a brand new unused gun straight from the factory made currently? I am undecided and want an opinion from several of you. Thank you in advance for your time and assistance in helping me decided. Either way I am spending in the neighborhood of 8-900 dollars.
Question about SW Model 25-Buy old or New
- Thread starter moewadle
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woad_yurt
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I'd go with an original if the prices were similar. I bought a beautiful M1917 for about the same price as a Classic re-issue. It would seem to me that the re-issue came about because of some interest in the original. The copies, in turn, will probably expose new folks to the originals, inspiring even more interest in the originals.
The first rule of revolver (or any gun, really) buying in my book is "Buy the Gun, not the model." I mean that I want a better built gun regardless of which variant it is - if it's newer with less desirable features but tight, smooth, and well built, that will trump an aged classic with a loose action, Bubba trigger job, or some machining or fitting defect.
The 25-2 (old style) is a very good gun, but there were periods of less-than ideal quality control at S&W, I find it generally runs from '68 to '79. Guns in this (the Bangor-Punta management days) range I examine the same as any other in person, but I am more leery of when buying unhandled over the internet or by phone.
Apples to apples, I think the older gun is a much better deal. I think that price range should be able to find you an excellent older 25, so I'd go that route. But follow the "check out" steps stickied here. Try to get one with original grips - the lack of them should detract from the price. I am not against the "new" ones, and indeed, the few I have handled have been very well built, and I am hovering around buying a model 21 that is now being closed-out at a very good price. The only real problem I've seen with the new ones is inconsistent grip fit, which I find very annoying and disappointing. The old ones were all individually hand fit; the new ones are slapped on and even CNC production methods can't get it right every time.
Good luck. I have an N-frame .45LC (not a 25, though) and it is a hoot. Coincidentally, I was actually planning on taking it out this weekend for the first time in a year.
The 25-2 (old style) is a very good gun, but there were periods of less-than ideal quality control at S&W, I find it generally runs from '68 to '79. Guns in this (the Bangor-Punta management days) range I examine the same as any other in person, but I am more leery of when buying unhandled over the internet or by phone.
Apples to apples, I think the older gun is a much better deal. I think that price range should be able to find you an excellent older 25, so I'd go that route. But follow the "check out" steps stickied here. Try to get one with original grips - the lack of them should detract from the price. I am not against the "new" ones, and indeed, the few I have handled have been very well built, and I am hovering around buying a model 21 that is now being closed-out at a very good price. The only real problem I've seen with the new ones is inconsistent grip fit, which I find very annoying and disappointing. The old ones were all individually hand fit; the new ones are slapped on and even CNC production methods can't get it right every time.
Good luck. I have an N-frame .45LC (not a 25, though) and it is a hoot. Coincidentally, I was actually planning on taking it out this weekend for the first time in a year.
Radagast
Member
The seventies was when S&W was owned by Bangor Punta and quality control was supposedly at it's worst. The introduction of MIM parts and CNC machinery has lead to a standardization of quality. You don't see dogs with unrifled barrels, but nor do you see guns that are the hand crafting of a master gunsmith who saw his work as Art that he was lucky to be paid for.
I have the pleasure of being a casual employee of a gun dealer and when I want to I get to shoot the second hand stock as a safety check. Last week I fired a near mint S&W model 19 from around 1980. Smoooooth trigger, tight cylinder lock up, three inch groups at 10 meters.
I have a 1971 manufactured 66 that will shoot 5 rounds into one hole with one slight flyer on the sixth chamber. At 100 meters it will do the job on steel plates, so I am happy with it.
Early 686s I have shot have ranged from "OK I guess" to "freaking awesome! How much?" Ditto for model 28s, accuracy ranging from "meh" to If you ever want to sell this I have first call!"
None of the S&Ws I have shot that were made since the introduction of CNC machining and MIM parts has been "freaking awesome", but none have been "OK I guess" either. They have been uniformly good, with OK triggers and excellent accuracy. I don't think there will ever be a 'perfect double action' on a non performance center S&W again due to the use of MIM parts to avoid hand fitting, but the triggers are still acceptable and the use of MIM parts means there is a single standard of quality.
Old S&Ws are not necessarily better guns, but some are. If you can shoot a second hand gun and you find it to be accurate in your hands then I would certainly recommend buying it if it passes the revolver check out test stickied at the top of this sub forum.
As for the lock, be aware that they do fail. The lock in my fathers 617 has jammed up on a couple of occasions, and required a little jiggling to get it to work. Not a worry on a range gun, but certainly an issue if you are carrying for self defence.
I have the pleasure of being a casual employee of a gun dealer and when I want to I get to shoot the second hand stock as a safety check. Last week I fired a near mint S&W model 19 from around 1980. Smoooooth trigger, tight cylinder lock up, three inch groups at 10 meters.
I have a 1971 manufactured 66 that will shoot 5 rounds into one hole with one slight flyer on the sixth chamber. At 100 meters it will do the job on steel plates, so I am happy with it.
Early 686s I have shot have ranged from "OK I guess" to "freaking awesome! How much?" Ditto for model 28s, accuracy ranging from "meh" to If you ever want to sell this I have first call!"
None of the S&Ws I have shot that were made since the introduction of CNC machining and MIM parts has been "freaking awesome", but none have been "OK I guess" either. They have been uniformly good, with OK triggers and excellent accuracy. I don't think there will ever be a 'perfect double action' on a non performance center S&W again due to the use of MIM parts to avoid hand fitting, but the triggers are still acceptable and the use of MIM parts means there is a single standard of quality.
Old S&Ws are not necessarily better guns, but some are. If you can shoot a second hand gun and you find it to be accurate in your hands then I would certainly recommend buying it if it passes the revolver check out test stickied at the top of this sub forum.
As for the lock, be aware that they do fail. The lock in my fathers 617 has jammed up on a couple of occasions, and required a little jiggling to get it to work. Not a worry on a range gun, but certainly an issue if you are carrying for self defence.
I think Radagast gave it all in really good detail - his experiences almost PERFECTLY mirror my own experiences, right down to the gun models/year range. Very good explanation, Radagast.
My best built gun ever I think was a 28 from 1978. My most loosely built one was a 27 from 1970 (A 27, for heaven's sake - the flagship gun!). The 70s were just that up and down. Things in the 80s/90s were very good/excellent on average. Things from WWI until about the time of the Tet Offensive were, on average, outstanding.
It also varies by gun - the more expensive, generally the more skilled worker who assembled it. A 25 should be safe no matter when made; that is what made the near-new 27 such a disappointment to me.
My best built gun ever I think was a 28 from 1978. My most loosely built one was a 27 from 1970 (A 27, for heaven's sake - the flagship gun!). The 70s were just that up and down. Things in the 80s/90s were very good/excellent on average. Things from WWI until about the time of the Tet Offensive were, on average, outstanding.
It also varies by gun - the more expensive, generally the more skilled worker who assembled it. A 25 should be safe no matter when made; that is what made the near-new 27 such a disappointment to me.
Stainz
Member
Some early 25-5's in .45 Colt had over-sized chamber exit bores - impossible to fix without a new cylinder. This alone would be enough to deter me. A newer model would have the lifetime warranty, too - as would a new one. My worst-ever S&W was from 1983 - a LNIB 6.5" 24-3 - horrid QC. Most of my S&Ws were made in '01 or later - and bought new. I don't like the IL, but it's inclusion in a new model won't deter me. No problems thus far with new S&Ws or their IL.
I love SS - and my first-ever S&W was a 4" 625 Mountain Gun in .45 Colt - bought new for me as a gift from my wife 8/02. The .45 Colt was my favorite for many years - and I found a '96 LN version I use as a plinker now, trying not to wear out my sentimental favorite. I highly endorse the 625 MG in .45 Colt - gripped in wood. Great plinker!
The 625-6 MG sports a S&W rounded Dymondwood Combat grip, while the 625-7 MG sports Ahrends cocobolo square-conversion stocks.
Stainz
I love SS - and my first-ever S&W was a 4" 625 Mountain Gun in .45 Colt - bought new for me as a gift from my wife 8/02. The .45 Colt was my favorite for many years - and I found a '96 LN version I use as a plinker now, trying not to wear out my sentimental favorite. I highly endorse the 625 MG in .45 Colt - gripped in wood. Great plinker!
The 625-6 MG sports a S&W rounded Dymondwood Combat grip, while the 625-7 MG sports Ahrends cocobolo square-conversion stocks.
Stainz
VINTAGE-SLOTCARS
member
I own a m-29 44mag 4" and a 25-5 in 45 colt 4". Both are 1980's guns. I love both and enjoy them alot. They look identical side by side. My sons now shoot them and they will last well past their sons. Get which ever you can and enjoy the big bullets it puts down range. I prefer w/o the loc but to each their own.
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