Questions about rifled barrel shotguns

[gunnutery]

For the record in case this has been beat to death, the search function would not work for me multiple times today on this subject.

I'm not new to smooth bore shotguns, but have never owned a shotgun barrel that was rifled. I'm wondering what all the rifled barrel can be fed. Can it also take buckshot and birdshot, or does the rifling throw it off? Is it stuck with just taking sabot shells or is a rifled slug allowed? Any and all help is much appreciated.

 

[viking499]

With a rifled barrel, I would only use the sabots. Any lead the would contact the rifling, would probably start to fill the rifling up.

 

[ReloaderFred]

I run rifled slugs through my rifled barrel, but I cast my own and they're loaded into regular shot wads, which means they have the plastic of the wad between the slug and the barrel. No leading at all, but plastic fouling is about like with regular shot loads.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[Fred Fuller]

Slugs, and mostly sabots at that. They almost always throw donut patterns with shot- patterns that open really fast and have a hole in the center.

I passed up a decent deal on a nice 20 ga. Youth model 870 this weekend because it had a rifled barrel- had it been a smoothbore, I'd have snapped it up and never looked back. But it wasn't a good enough deal to buy the gun and then buy another barrel too, even if I could have sold the rifled barrel.

lpl

 

[Jack2427]

Simple solution: In a rifled barrel use only sabot rounds, they are designed for a rifled bore. Using "rifled" slugs in a rifled bore is a waste if time and slugs.

Using sabot rounds in a smooth bore is a big waste of time and money.

Using any shot load in a rifled bore is both mof the above.

 

[DPris]

I wouldn't consider rifled slugs in a rifled bore to be a waste of time and slugs.
You'll improve accuracy over using the slugs in a smoothbore and it'll be cheaper than sabots.
Denis

 

[gunnutery]

Thanks for everyone's input. My buddy just bought a Mossberg 500 with a rifled barrel. I told him to use sabots but that I'd check into other versatile rounds. I'll advise him he'll probably need to buy a smooth bore barrel to go with it. He was thinking about upgrading it a bit anyway.

Thanks again.

 

[Jon_Snow]

I run rifled slugs through my rifled barrel, but I cast my own and they're loaded into regular shot wads, which means they have the plastic of the wad between the slug and the barrel. No leading at all, but plastic fouling is about like with regular shot loads.

Hope this helps.

Fred

Umm, Fred, those ARE sabots. Is you're using something that encloses the sides and base of the slug, you're shooting sabot loads. But now you're got me curious. How much do you undersize the slugs for this, or no you at all? I'd be interested in knowing if you're getting really good engagement on the rifling with this set-up.

 

[ReloaderFred]

Jon Snow,
I fully understand that encasing a slug into a regular shotgun wad makes it a form of sabot round, but not in the sense that it's encased in a thick plastic sabot, like the commercial loads are.

I load the slugs exactly as they fall from my Lyman hollowbase mold. They're going a little over 1,400 fps with a healthy dose of Blue dot, and will keep 3 shots into about 2" at 50 yards, and about 5" at 100 yards. The only deer I ever shot with one was dropped on the spot from a little over 80 yards.

These are fired through the rifled barrel of my Remington 870 Express, with Simmons Turkey Scope, and through my 20" smooth barrel with rifled sights on my older Remington 870 Police gun.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[T.A.Sharps]

They are meant to impart spin onto a projectile to stabilize it in flight.

So the only thing that would really benefit from being put through a rifled barrel shotgun is a slug, either a sabot slug, or other slugs. Though slugs without a sabot will lead foul the bore, so you would need to be prepared to clean out lead.

You can shoot things like buck shot, or bird shot through the rifled bore, but it would have to be encased in a plastic shot cup so it won't ruin the bore.

Though, there is not much good in shooting shot through a rifled barrel since the shot cup will be spinning, and all the shot will be sprayed out in a wide pattern at a very short range.

Rifled barrels are purley meant for those of us that are legally forced to only use shotguns for hunting deer. At $3 a shot, and heavy recoil, you would have to be crazy to like to shoot them for target shooting.

Mine shoots fairly well, I think I could get it better with some money. Right now the best I can get is an 8" group at 200 yards. Enough to be able to take a calm broadside shot on a deer at that range.

With their high arch ballistic path, and inconsistent groupings, depending on brand of ammo, they are very frustrating to work with.

I still like mine, and I know if gives me an edge hunting.

 

[Jon_Snow]

Fred, have you ever recovered one of the wads fired that way? I'd like to know if there are deep marks from the rifling. I know that rifled slugs are usually undersized slightly and that the hollow base expands to seal the bore, I just don't know what the diameters are exactly.

Since you cast your own, why use the rifled slugs instead of one meant for a sabot. I believe Lyman makes a molds for a sabot slug meant to be dropped in a standard wad just like you do. I'm not trying to knock what you're doing, I'm genuinely interested.

 

[DPris]

TA,
So-called rifling on a rifled slug is there to allow the slug walls to swage down as the slug passes through a smoothbore's choke. It is not for imparting spin to the slug.
As such, using a rifled slug in a rifled bore, as thousands of people did before the sabot-clad jacketed handgun bullets now commonly referred to generically as "sabots", improves accuracy & is hardly a waste of time.

As you note, since most older Foster type rifled slugs are relatively soft, they can leave leading in the rifling of a rifled bore. Harder rifled slugs like the Brennekes and Remington's HammerHeads leave less lead behind.
This may be fairly irrelevant anyway since most of us are not inclined to fire many on a hunting trip. Just clean the bore when you get home, before lead has much chance to accumulate.

Shot, as you noted, will spread rapidly because the shot column is spinning when it exits the rifled bore, unlike when it exits a smoothbore.
They won't ruin a bore if not encased in a shot cup, you'll just see some lead left behind & how much depends on how much you shoot shot through a rifled bore & what shape the rifling is in that bore.

Denis

 

[ReloaderFred]

Jon Snow,

The mold I use is the Lyman Wasp Waist slug intended for shot wads. I really doubt if the hollow base obturates to fill the bore, since the whole wad column is between the pressure from the burning powder and base of the slug. I believe it's intended to fly more like a badmitten shuttlecock, rather than fill the bore and have the slug actually ride the rifling.

The rifling in a shotgun barrel (at least mine) isn't that deep to start with, so it probably doesn't leave deep grooving in the wad. I never looked for one to find out, since I was more interested in what the slugs were doing on target. I know mine kick like a mule and are pretty accurate up to 100 yards. Since my last post, I looked in my reloading log and found the page where I chronographed the load. It was 1,474 fps @ 30'. I had to move the chronograph out because of the blast and wads.

I was surprised at what the same load would do from my smoothbore 870. At 35 yards, with rifle sights, I could consistantly hit a clay bird resting on the berm.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[Jason_W]

I really doubt if the hollow base obturates to fill the bore, since the whole wad column is between the pressure from the burning powder and base of the slug. I believe it's intended to fly more like a badmitten shuttlecock, rather than fill the bore and have the slug actually ride the rifling.

It may be similar to what happens with the Lee slug where the base of the projectile gets locked into the wad, and it's actually the wad that engages the rifling.

So far, my best luck with slugs has been the impact discarding type like those used by lightfield. For handloading, I found the Blue Force sabots amazingly accurate.

I live in a rifle legal state and I still prefer slug guns. The terrain where I hunt is pretty thick ruling out long shots.

 

[T.A.Sharps]

TA,
So-called rifling on a rifled slug is there to allow the slug walls to swage down as the slug passes through a smoothbore's choke. It is not for imparting spin to the slug.
As such, using a rifled slug in a rifled bore, as thousands of people did before the sabot-clad jacketed handgun bullets now commonly referred to generically as "sabots", improves accuracy & is hardly a waste of time.

You are right, though when I mentioned rifling imparting spin I was talking about the rifling of the barrel on a projectile.

I should of posted "To the OP".

I'm aware of the popular Foster slug misconception about the grooves making the slug spin.

 

[DPris]

OK, pardon me, I read it wrong.
It's a very common misconception that refuses to die & I thought that's what you were saying.

Denis