Recommended mill tooling

[MattTheHat]

I've been looking at getting a mill for some pistolsmithing chores I'd like to do, primarily 1911s. I think I'm finally ready to pull the trigger on order a mill in the morning. Been looking at one of the 2 HP 9x30 Grizzly mills that looks like it should do the trick.

I've got basic measuring stuff already, as well as some setup blocks, micrometer, calipers, squares, rules, indicators, indicator holders and stuff like that. The mill comes with a decent looking vise and a set of collets and I'll be ordering what appears to be a very accurate machinists level for setup. I'll also be ordering a clamp kit and some extra t-nuts, degreaser for getting the machine ready to use, as well as some way lubricant and anti-rust spray for the tables.

I've got a rotary table with divider plates on my list, as well as an angle table, a small toolmakers vise, some carbide end mills and carbide ball end mills, a 2-1/2" face mill, and a slotting arbor and saw.

Anything obvious that I'm overlooking here?

The mill has a built-in cooling pump system. Any recommendation on what type of coolant to run?

Any advice is greatly appreciated.

-Matt

 

[WNTFW]

I have had good results from the Rustlick coolants
http://www.itwfpg.com/rustlick/rustlick.html
It was pretty good on a variety of metals. Stainless, brass & aluminum mainly is what I did with it.

Another thing I found was a lube that was in a bar or stick. Consistency of deodorant. It melts and runs when heated. Worked well in some applications where flood coolant was not possible.

It may come down to what you can get from your local supplier or pay shipping. I got tired of the flavor of the month every time I went to buy coolant. Some coolants can get nasty in the sump, but that may be a thing of the past to a degree.

Not to confuse you but,
Industrial hobbies makes a nice mill: (not cheap)
http://www.ihcnc.com/index.php

Lathe Master:
http://www.lathemaster.com/MILLINGPRODUCTS.htm

 

[RedAlert]

I suggest a good quality drill chuck. A keyless chuck would be best as they are usually precision units. You need a wiggler and an edgefinder too as they are essential for dialing in a component or finding the center of a hole. A set or two of parallels will be extremely useful in set-up. Even when used with a vise to hold components.

Perhaps as you save up more money, you might consider power feed units for the X and Y axis. Mititoyo makes a fine digital scale for the quill so you can do precision depths. Something I found to be great was a spring loaded center to use in conjunction with a tap handle and taps for making sure the threads are true to the drilled hole.

You might want to get a copy of the Machinists Handbook as it is filled with information on materials, tooling and feeds and speeds.

Have fun!

 

[MetalHead]

I'm with WMTFW in that I really like the wax based cutting lubes, mostly because they don't make much mess and are not machine specific, but they only help keep heat down right at where the cutting is happening, some heavy jobs need a high flow of coolent to remove heat from the whole work piece, like cutting stainless steel.
I use them on drill press, electric drills, PortaBand, metal lathe and Sawzall.

 

[MattTheHat]

Thanks for the input guys. I've got a wiggler on my list (sounds rude), but I'd forgotten about a parallel set.

I've already got the Machinists Handbook. Lots of good info in there for sure.

The mill I'm looking at has a power feed on the x axis. Hadn't thought about one for the y axis, though.

I hadn't thought about a chuck as I'm not sure how much drilling I'm going to be doing. Now that I think of it, though, if I don't get one, that's going to the first thing I'll probably need.

Thanks for the input guys!


-Matt

 

[BADUNAME27]

Cimtech makes very good coolant.

Two "skoolz" of thought on coolant. Either flood it or run it dry. Carbide experiences what's called "thermal shock" Especially when its coated. All that money you spend on coatings goes down the chip tray if you run mist coolant because the rapid heating/cooling cycle causes the cutting surfaces to erode very rapidly. If you can't flood it, just run it dry. The tooling will last longer.

Notice I said "coolant" and not "cutting fluid". Two very different components.

As far as a pwr feed for the Y. Why would a person do that? At most a manual vertical mill is going to have about 12-18 inches of Y axis travel. It's really not needed. Definitely get one for the Knee and a good quality DRO. Also buy a Pnuematic drawbar/tool changer! The good ones run about 700 bucks but the time saved changing tools pays for itself in about 6 months. I had to do a time study on it once to justify the cost to fit a dozen machines with em at a job shop I worked at once.

It's a buyer's market these days for equipment so don't feel obligated to go with a Grizzly, Harbor Freight, Enco, or MSC brands. Locate a dealer in your region, chances are they'll have american made machines stacked ten deep and very reasonable compared to years past.

Sandvik supplies the bulk of my tooling and I've had great success. If you go inserts, pay the money for good chit. Nothing sucks worse than using an Ebay brand insert and having it go "chernobyl" on you in the middle of a tool path.

You can never have too much invested in good work holding.

FWIW I have a Big Bridgeport rotary index table that I no longer use/need (I now have two 4 axis CNC mills) along with a few other odds/ends that I don't use/need.

I'd sell it reasonable to someone lookin to do gun work.

Just a thought.

Chad

www.longriflesinc.com

 

[MattTheHat]

Thanks for the input, Chad!

The coolant system is indeed a flood type. Interesting info on running dry vs. mist.

Good info on the drawbar setup too. Are you using electric or air? I'm not sure I can justify the cost, but it sure looks like a good idea.

I too, wondered about the need to power the y axis. Seems like it would generally be easier to set up to use the power feed on the x axis. As for the knee, I could see that being handy, primarily for setup. Nobody in their right mind would PAY me to hack up their gun, so my time is pretty cheap.

I can't seem to find a dealer here in the Dallas area. I haven't had great luck with anything from HF that uses an electric motor. The mills are probably a different story and I assume all comparable sized mills are all coming out of the same factory no matter what color they end up. I like Grizzly because they seem to have a very good track record with being able to supply parts. The owner like guns and guitars. And, I have an account.

I will indeed shy away from eBay tooling. Doesn't make much sense to go that route to me. Grizzly has some tooling that looks pretty decent, and they swear up and down it's good. For convenience, I'm going to try some of their cutters and other tooling. I see they have a pretty extensive selection of insert type tools and all kinds of inserts in differing grades.

I'll PM you about your BP table.

-Matt

 

[MattTheHat]

Trigger pulled. Mill on order. They didn't have the model I wanted in stock, so I ended up ordering the next smaller side which I was looking at to start with.

I've got a feeling I'm going to have a flood of questions here in about a week.


-Matt

 

[MattTheHat]

oops.

 

[SSN Vet]

Your going to have some fun... hobby machining is a lot of fun.

Check out CNCzone.com for a LOT of really good info. and helpful people.

There's a lot about general machining, not just CNC stuff

 

[MattTheHat]

^ CNCzone.com

Will do, thanks.


-Matt

 

[schmeky]

Matt,

I've had my mill for about a year now. Great fun, but there are some limitations. You can pick up some pretty good accessories if you have a Harbor Freight store in your area. Also check out Ebay for some very good accessories (dial indicators, micrometers, etc.), even cutting tools, end mills, etc.

Enjoy and be safe. A mill, like any other power tool, has the potential to be very dangerous.

 

[MattTheHat]

I was wondering if you'd check in Schmeky. I ended up getting a larger mill yet than the one I mentioned to you. Looks like it will arrive tomorrow. I'm opening several boxes of goodies from Grizzly right now.

This doggone rust inhibitor slathered all over everything smells good.


-Matt

 

[MattTheHat]

Went and picked up the mill from the freight terminal this afternoon. I have no idea how I'm going to get this thing off my trailer.


-Matt

 

[44-henry]

A DRO would be high on my list of must have accessories. I worked for years without one and once I got one I can't imagine life without it. Not having to worry about backlash errors is one major advantage, plus mine allows me to do bolt hole patterns that I previously had to use the rotary table to accomplish.

Other things that might have been mentioned above would be a good edge finder (wiggler, laser, electronic, etc) I have a laser and it works really slick with no need to move in the normal .100 to zero the axis. Get a good vise, even if yours comes with one check it out really good before committing to it. Sounds like you have the necessary measuring equipment and already know about the paralllel bars. You might want a boring head and a fly cutter. Having a mill is a lot of fun, but tooling them up can get expensive. I oversee a manufacturing lab at the university where I teach and we have four Bridgeports (3 clones) and a Tormach PCNC1100 mill in the room, tooling these all up gets expensive. I've often thought that companies could give the machines away and still make darn good money on the tooling. Oh well, it is a fun hobby.

 

[MattTheHat]

> DRO

Funny, I was reading about them last night.

The last of my setup goodies should arrive tomorrow afternoon. Can't wait to get my hands dirty.


-Matt

 

[BADUNAME27]

+1 on the vice. IMO Kurt is the ONLY answer here. Yes they cost more, but like a divorce they cost more cause they are WORTH IT. Another tool that's very handy is a coaxial indicator. Very quick for finding center on a hole. It'll get you close enough for most jobs. If you really need something spot on your better to use a best test style indicator by hand as it'll be a little closer since its not going to pick up any runout in the spindle (machine isn't running when you use this style but it takes longer to do.

A good vice and/or table stop is another handy tool that you basically must have. These can be made pretty easy.

Stalk Ebay and you'll find one reasonable soon enough.

Never forget, if it's worth doing twice, it's worth doing right the first time.

Good luck.

C

 

[MattTheHat]

HUMPF, my response got lost in the ether, so I'll try again.

I'd wondered about the value of the Kurt vise. I guess my question has been answered. Turns out the vice I purchased for the mill is a bit too large, so I'm going to have a look to see if I can find a Kurt that's a bit smaller.

Thanks for all the input guys.


-Matt

 

[schmeky]

Matt,

Yea, I saw the mill you wound up getting . . . . . I have mill envy now. Thanks Matt

You're gonna' have a ton of fun

 

[MattTheHat]

^^ mill envy

Well, there's only one cure for that.

Thing is, I originally ordered the G3616, but they were out of stock. Glad I didn't now, I honestly don't think I would have gotten the thing in the garage. Certainly not with my engine hoist, that's for sure.

> loads of fun

I hope so. A few hanks of 4" x 3/8" 6061-T6 bar stock followed me home from work today.

-Matt