Reloaded ammo for lead

[tyeo098]

Ok, I have a quick puzzling question.

In my never ending search for lead wheel weights I came across a tire shop owner who is also an avid shooter. In talking with him he agreed to give me all(!!!) of his wheel weights since he pays by the pound to have them taken away, the more I take the less he has to pay.

I asked him if I could compensate him in any way for such a generous offer, cash, beer, etc.

He asked me if I could make some loads for him for 9mm/223 plinking, since he cannot find ammo anywhere.

I know without an FFL/06/ITAR registration, I cannot be 'engaged in the business of manufacturing defense articles/ammunition' but would such a trade (lead for reloaded ammo) be legal?

This would not be any source of income, since no money is exchanging hands. I already have a full time job which is my primary source of income.

 

[Art Eatman]

Occasional deals of this sort are commonplace and are not considered as "business".

 

[jstein650]

For that kind of a source of 'free' lead, I would absolutely make him up some rounds. Be extra vigilant in every way. If you feel the least bit uneasy, test a few for yourself, and find a way to go with him on his next range outing. You'll both feel better.

 

[tyeo098]

I understand the common practices of reloading, extra care and such.

I just wanted to make sure that I was not violating federal law in any way with regard to this.

Guy has 10 stores. 2 months gives me a 30 gallon drum of WW from EACH store. I'm stoked.

 

[Hacker15E]

I would have no qualms about it -- sounds like it could be a good deal, depending on if you can find components to make him what he needs!

 

[rcmodel]

Yes, but I would be very diligent of supplying reloads to anyone.

If he has an accident, or a gun breakage of any kind?

You will be on the hook for the civil liability damages.

Regardless of how good a friend he is?
His lawyer isn't going to be your friend.
And neither is he when the lawyer starts whispering damage numbers in his ear.

rc

 

[jstein650]

tyeo098:

Holy Cow... I gotta find a guy paying to get rid of WW's! Jeesh...

rc: I know, I know... Aint it great to live in such litigious times?...

 

[MErl]

I would stick to 9mm of the two offered choices since it is more forgiving.

 

[rcmodel]

9mm is not, and has never been more forgiving then .223.

It's impossible to double charge a .223 case with too fast powder.

Stick to medium to slow burn rate power in any manual and it's pretty hard to get in trouble.

On the other hand?

I would not do it on a bet with either caliber.

rc

 

[Reefinmike]

3 55 gal drums each MONTH Im super jealous. I managed to get a single 5 gallon bucket for $20 after visiting 20 stores earlier this month. 223 yeah, lots of prep work but impossible to double charge with pretty much every common powder= pretty safe bet. heck, load em with varget so you know there wont be a kb. 9mm? Id visually inspect each and every case for double charges and load with a plated or fmj bullet only. Of course, warn the guy that same as factory ammo, if he pulls the trigger and hears a click or pop to hold the gun downrange for 30 seconds, eject round and inspect bore for a stuck boolit.

As far as im aware, its only illegal to sell reloads for monetary gain. ie. you give him a few boxes and he gives ya $40, you give him a box and he gives you a gas gift card etc etc. you are giving him ammo and in return you are getting wheel weights to cast all those "fishing weights" that us mid-westerners just keep loosing out on our coast

I give away reloads every so often, but I wont just pull a box out of my ammo cans and hand it off. you bet your butt that they are made special order under extreme scrutiny for the person.

I cannot express how jealous I am via text. Feel free to shoot me your number so I can vocally express how jealous I am

 

[MErl]

Stick to medium to slow burn rate power in any manual and it's pretty hard to get in trouble.

I do this so see next part. I much prefer using powders that will overflow if I screw up.

9mm is much more forgiving of case prep and easier to load. If going down this path I still recommend 9mm. Debatably cheaper as well.

as for:

It's impossible to double charge a .223 case with too fast powder.

Maybe from a manual powder, have not checked. I'm quite sure you could make small grenades with a mistaken fast pistol powder.

 

[rcmodel]

I'm quite sure you could make small grenades with a mistaken fast pistol powder.

Lets hope the OP is a more accomplished reloader then that before he starts trading his reloads for wheel weights!!

rc

 

[Speedo66]

Other possibility is just to buy some ammo. Even at inflated prices, still seems like a good deal.

And tell him to save his empties.

 

[AlexanderA]

But are wheel weights a good source of lead for bullets? Don't they have impurities that would cause extra wear in a bore? It seems to me that used wheel weights would have grit, just like bullets recovered from a backstop.

 

[rcmodel]

No.

Any 'Grit' all floats to the top of the melt and is skimmed off the molten lead.

There are no impurities left in the alloy after that.

rc

 

[Hacker15E]

But are wheel weights a good source of lead for bullets?

Just about the best source, most casters believe (since the linotype printers are decades gone...).

 

[tyeo098]

This is just from what I gathered from his one store the other day:

 

[blindhari]

Teach the man to cast and reload his own. Sell enough lead to buy equipment you both can use.
Seems to solve your problem.

blindhari

 

[Jolly Rogers]

Show him how to reload and cast him some boolits.
Let him use your stuff. Don't reload for him. Liability don't cha know.
Joe

 

[1911Tuner]

Don't reload for him. Liability don't cha know.

There are also legal issues and licensing involved with manufacturing ammunition for reasons other than your own use...even if it's "only" for bartering purposes.

 

[tyeo098]

There are also legal issues and licensing involved with manufacturing ammunition for reasons other than your own use...even if it's "only" for bartering purposes.

Yes, but like all conditions for an FFL you must 'be in the business of' manufacturing ammo for other purposes.

As Art said:

Occasional deals of this sort are commonplace and are not considered as "business"

Lets hope the OP is a more accomplished reloader then that before he starts trading his reloads for wheel weights!!

I can only use the 20gr ones that fit in the shells, some are too big and I throw them out

But I only use ball/extruded powder for rifle loads and flake powder for pistol loads. Veeeeery easy to tell if I goof'd somewhere.

 

[Colonel]

Isn't an unjacketed lead bullet too soft for a high-pressure, high-velocity cartridge like 223?

I imagine the barrel leading would be horrendous...

 

[tyeo098]

Isn't an unjacketed lead bullet too soft for a high-pressure, high-velocity cartridge like 223?

I imagine the barrel leading would be horrendous...

You would be wrong.

With careful temperature control and gas checking you can easily make 223 cast boolets work.

But I'm trading jacketed ammo built from separate components