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Remington does it again... Bankruptcy No 2.

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by mcb, Jun 26, 2020.

  1. mcb

    mcb Member

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    https://www.reuters.com/article/rem...e-for-bankruptcy-protection-wsj-idUSL4N2E32P4

    The Navajo Nation is about to go into the gun business. The currently leadership was already going down the FUDD path pretty hard core and this looks like it will accelerate this path even more. Any notion of Bushmaster and/or DPMS coming back probably just evaporate with this news. Oh and throw in some smart guns just make it interesting.
     
  2. jhb

    jhb Member

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    interesting. wasnt aware of this.

    dont know anything about the Navajo group on what theyll do or not do. guess we'll find out.
     
  3. FlSwampRat

    FlSwampRat Member

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    Fully semi automatic scythes?

    Seriously speaking, do the Navajos have casinos? If they do the deep pockets might be able to afford some real R&D
     
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  4. unclenunzie
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    unclenunzie Contributing Member

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    The article says they are preparing to be the lead bidder on Remington's assets... Any cash, accounts receivable, inventory, IP, real-estate, etc after the bankruptcy. No idea what the future holds, but if there are public documents they might shed light.
     
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  5. huntsman

    huntsman Member

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    So the shotgun with detachable mag didn’t put them in the black? Imagine that.
     
  6. Reinz

    Reinz Member

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    Yup, Remington still stuck in the single stack mentality, Mossberg in the double stack.
     
  7. mcb

    mcb Member

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    Not sure if they have casinos, but they appear to have a fairly deep pockets the problem is they want to spend that money on R&D in smart-gun technology. And not cool smart guns the do all the external ballistics math for you or similar helpful stuff but the kind that only goes bang with they think the right person is trying to use them. That is not going to win friend with other manufactures or a large segment of the Pro-2A population.
     
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  8. FlSwampRat

    FlSwampRat Member

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    I so agree with that last.
     
  9. D.B. Cooper

    D.B. Cooper Member

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    The only way to fight that is for millions of gun owners to not spend a penny on anything even remotely connected to the future Remington. No one is going to want to dump all of the casino profits into a money pit of "smart guns" that no one will buy. Problem is, if they find a way to make it work, Congress will legislate it into mandatory existence for everyone.
     
  10. mcb

    mcb Member

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    I believe California and New Jersey and maybe a few other states have various legislation already passed that are sitting there primed to go into effect if a market proven smart-gun becomes available. In some instances this makes the sale of non-smart-guns illegal. Obviously that would be challenged but those "time-bombs" are already out there to some small degree.
     
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  11. mcb

    mcb Member

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  12. jhb

    jhb Member

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    just read up on the Navajos plan in 2018 for Remington when they bid back then. unless they changed their plans it dont look so good for 2a as already said by others.
     
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  13. AlexanderA
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    AlexanderA Member

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    Has anyone thought of a "group buy"? Millions of gun owners, each chipping in a little, could probably outbid the Navajo Nation. This would be a first -- a gun manufacturer owned and controlled by its customers, gun owners themselves. But it would take a genius organizer to make that happen.
     
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  14. jmr40

    jmr40 Member

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    I'm OK with Remington going away. They've been circling the drain since the early 1980's. There are plenty of other options out there making better guns. I can't really think of anything they've done innovative since they introduced the 7mm Rem mag in the 1960's. They sit back and play catch up after everyone else comes up with innovative ideas.

    They were the last manufacturer to offer interchangeable choke tubes in their shotguns and still use the stupid reverse stamped checkering on many of their guns. All other manufacturers stopped doing that in the 1960's. The only thing they make that I'd miss is the 870 and there are millions of them out there.
     
  15. theotherwaldo

    theotherwaldo Member

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    I was somewhat involved in a partnership back in the '90's that was considering designing "smart guns".
    The sister of one of the partners convinced them to dump the idea - "The first time that the fail-safe mechanism fails-null then you will be sued to death. Likewise, the first time the safety mechanism gets disarmed but the gun refuses to fire... ."
    I wonder if the Navajo Nation has considered this.
     
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  16. mcb

    mcb Member

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    They have done a few other good things since the 1960's. Remington did design the DPMS Gen II which IMHO was one of the better if not the best of the 308 size AR platforms going. They also brought us the 450 Bushmaster cartridge and I am sort of fond of that cartridge. They did a lot of other things that had potential but they failed to support like the ACR, the 105 CTI, etc. They also made one of the best chassis rifles going before nearly anyone else was even really making them. The XM2010 and its big brother the PSR were the chassis guns to be judge against for years. You can still see their influences in many of the current chassis guns. But again they never brought it to the civilian market and thus the price never came down to reasonable prices.

    Marlin was actually starting to come around, I wonder how this is going to affect Marlin since they are owned and made at Remington in Ilion NY?

    Sort of sad to see what has happened to the oldest US gun maker but such is life and progress...
     
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  17. jeff-10

    jeff-10 Member

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    The moral of this story is if you are a gun related business or organization (see NRA) located on the eastern seaboard that is north of North Carolina, it is time to relocate. Do not let the fact that your employees don't want to uproot their families keep you in a location that does not want you. It will make business all but impossible. I hope Kimber is listening, I think they are the last major successful one.
     
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  18. mcb

    mcb Member

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    But Remington did, they have relatively new and fairly larger manufacturing facility down here in Huntsville and it did not save them. Remington has had 4 difference CEO's in the past ~5 years. Remington's leadership problems trumped any advantage moving a lot of its manufacturing to Alabama gave them.
     
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  19. Obturation
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    Obturation Contributing Member

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    I wouldn't miss Remington. Can't think of a single gun they produce that's even mildly interesting to me and the QC has been horrible at best. There's no excuse for their handguns , their shotguns have all the controls in the wrong places and their rifles are outdone by just about every other manufacturer . there is only one thing I buy with remingtons name on it- 7 1/2 primers but I would think someone else makes them, but I don't know.hate to see any gun company disappear, especially one with the history of Remington but they've just produced bad guns for several years . with any luck they'll be purchased by someone who can restore former glory, I'm not holding my breath though.
     
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  20. Poper

    Poper Member

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    Yes, I believe the Navajo Nation has 4 casinos.
    They also have uranium mines, and coal, too.
     
  21. troy fairweather

    troy fairweather Member

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    I won't miss Remington, nothing they made in almost 20 years has been good, started going down hill in the 80s. This I from someone who likes the older Remington stuff. Maybe if they closed up and someone bout the name and did things right.
     
  22. mcb

    mcb Member

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    I agree with the QC issues for sure and yet I am going to miss Remington more than I probably should.

    I own several Remington rifles, shotguns and handguns and more Bushmasters, DPMS and AAC stuff too.

    The best group I have ever shot with any gun was with a Remington 700 made in the past two years.
    N3xWgZ4m.jpg
    I have shared that target before but that is a .38 MOA 5-shot group at 200 yards using a factory barreled action and factory ammo.

    I can't defend Remington and yet I can't say I won't miss them either...
     
  23. D.B. Cooper

    D.B. Cooper Member

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    If your goal was to turn the company around and return it to it's former glory, you might be on to something. The old Grumman boat company went through something similar when employees bought it from Grumman Aircraft when they were going to shut it down.

    However...

    If your goal was to simply prevent the Navajo group from developing smart gun technology, you would be wasting your time. They would simply wait for another opportunity to purchase a controlling interest in another gun company, or, depending on the level of their commitment, simply start their own gun company and do all their own R&D.
     
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  24. Bfh_auto

    Bfh_auto Member

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    There is a lot of nostalgia that goes along with Remington for me. The old Remington Peters shot shells are the first ones I remember.
    Remington failed because it kept buying good companies and ruining or discontinuing them.
    I wish every gun company stayed afloat.
     
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  25. reddog81

    reddog81 Member

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    Their business plan from last time around (2018) would have drove the company straight into the ground. They basically said they’d stop selling popular guns and focus on contracts. They’d never sell enough to police departments to stay afloat. There are plenty of manufacturers out there that’ll sell to the police and military for dirt cheap in order to gain brand recognition and bragging rights among the public.

    Do police departments even want smart guns? I can’t see departments paying a premium for something that few officers would want.

    The smartest gun for a company to produce is the one that makes the most money.
     
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