Repro Jack Hinson's Rifle?

[LoneGoose]

Jack Hinson was a southern farmer who, after two of his children were killed by union soldiers, took up a personal vendetta against the union army. He had a special rifle made and used it to kill many union soldiers.

I'm from near the area where Jack Hinson lived. I own two books written about him. His rifle still exists. I've been wondering.......has anyone thought about making a reproduction of the Jack Hinson rifle? It would be nice to see one. Or, if affordable, own one.

 

[Jim Watson]

Never heard of a repro, the market for a 18 lb c&b must be small to start with and the connection to somebody like Hinson not attractive to many.
I am sure a custom builder could do it, but it would not be cheap.

 

[Panzerschwein]

I looked it up, and it looks like a big Hawken to me. Any more details on this rifle?

 

[AJumbo]

The Hinson rifle has all the earmarks of a Tennessee-style "poor boy'' rifle, aside from the massive barrel, which appears to be at least 1 1/2" across the flats. The Hawken brothers were influenced by the Tennessee style, but I doubt this is one of their pieces.

I suppose if you were dedicated to getting a repro made (by which I mean "willing to part with $$$$$$$$$$"), the barrel would be the toughest single component to produce. It shouldn't be impossible, though; there are BP benchrest rifles with tubes thta heavy, so that would be a good place to start. Reproducing the lock and triggers shouldn't be too tricky, either. Seems to me one could modify an L&R Hawken lock to look like the one on the Hinson rifle.

One wonders if the judge who currently owns the original would allow a builder to take detailed pics and dimensions....

 

[expat_alaska]

Well, when it comes to Civil War history, I'm all eyes and ears and this piece of history is one I never heard of until now. Thank you for bringing it to the fore insofar as my ignorance. I am now obliged to search for and purchase an affordable copy of LtCol McKenney's treatise about Hinson. You folks have just got to quit making me spend money on books that my wife just rolls her eyes at.

Thank you for the thread!

Jim

 

[4v50 Gary]

I always wondered about the twist in his rifle.

 

[Deltaboy1984]

50 cal 41 inches long but no mention of the twist other than in the Kentucky rifle tradition.

 

[kudu]

I'll have to dig that book out and read it again. I have it somewhere in my library of stacked books.

 

[Deltaboy1984]

Page 167 describes the rifle in detail but nothing about the rate of twist. It was 1.5 inches in diameter and full stocked Tiger Maple. Page 176. It weighted 18 pounds, custom bullet mould for Minie ball.

 

[Jim Watson]

If it is a regular round ball rifle or even an early picket ball design, half mile range is considerably improving the tale, no matter how heavy the barrel.
Note that the museum rifle has only hunting rifle type fixed blade sights.
I have shot black powder breechloaders at 600 yards (1/3 mile) and good sights are essential.

 

[Deltaboy1984]

It was made to shoot the Minie ball
http://www.historynet.com/minie-ball
Per the book.

 

[Jim Watson]

I have not seen anything about use of the Minie ball in commercial civilian rifles.
I will credit that story when I see Mr Hinson's bullet mould.

If I wanted a Minie ball rifle, wouldn't I order it for standard .58 Springfield or .577 Enfield or maybe .54 Mississippi ammo?

 

[AJumbo]

OM "Wah-To-Yah and the Taos Trail," there's a reference to "Long" Louie Hatcher's use of "long, pinty (pointy) slugs" in his Hawken rifle; the book chronicles mountain men during the waning days of the fur trade, around 1840. Slugs in civilian hands were not unknown before the Civil War, and not not every CW-era slug was a Minie' ball. Hinson was a fairly wealthy guy, and I just can't discount the idea that he knew what he wanted, could afford it, and knew a 'smith who could deliver it.

 

[Deltaboy1984]

I have not seen anything about use of the Minie ball in commercial civilian rifles.
I will credit that story when I see Mr Hinson's bullet mould.

If I wanted a Minie ball rifle, wouldn't I order it for standard .58 Springfield or .577 Enfield or maybe .54 Mississippi ammo?

It was a custom build gun that Hinson paid a Gun Smith to build.

 

[4v50 Gary]

Is Hinson's gun a minie gun? Does anyone have images of the bullet or the mould?

The only manufacturer of minie gun in America that I'm aware of were Springfield Armory or Harper's Ferry, both the military armories. I'm aware of books like Hans Busk's The Rifle and How To Use It were in print, but how available were they outside of England? Would a rural gunsmith have access to them to know about minie balls and how to make a mould. Harper Ferry's James Burton perfected the design here in America but an individual gunsmith would have to experiment to figure out how thick/thin to make the skirt for reliable expansion.

 

[swathdiver]

Some of you fellas interested in long range shootin' would be interested in Ned Roberts' The Muzzleloading Caplock Rifle.

 

[Jim Watson]

I used to have it. Very interesting. No mention of Minie balls that I recall, but lots of picket balls and slugs.

 

[4v50 Gary]

Ned Roberts' book is a classic and is a must read for anyone interested in that genre of firearm.

My own research (published in England) showed that virtually no one in America including our military understood the necessity for training for long distance shooting with the minie rifle. Capt. Henry Heth (later Confederate Major General) was sent an article by his friend, Hancock, on British experiments in long range shooting at the Hythe. Heth duplicated it and wrote it up. However, it wasn't published and distributed in the Army in the ante-bellum period. It was crucial to know distance estimation and then sight adjustment. Up to then, Americans did Kentucky windage with fixed sights (buckhorn sights allowed you to get greater elevation for longer range shots).

It is possible that Hinson's rifle had a conical bullet. That was very much within the possibility of an American gunsmith. Can someone contact the family?

 

[kBob]

Jim W.

The .54 Mississippi was originally a round ball and patch gun. There were attempts to make a Minie Ball for it but the ones the federal government tried did not stabilize in the round ball pitch AND the type of rifling was not correct for the Minie style bullets. Troops complained that the Minie was less accurate at all ranges than the round ball in that rifle.

This was another reason for some states having them reamed out to .58 cal and re rifled.

The .69 caliber smooth bore muskets that were rifled later FOR a 750 or so grain Minie did work and were more accurate than .54 Mississippi rifles with Minie ball loads......but recoil was supposedly brutal and the sights somewhat lacking.

As to whether a civilian could have had a Minie ball shooting gun by 1862....... Hmm USA adopted a Minie shooting rifle 1855 so seven years later.......Let us see the US Army adopted the M-16A1 in 1967 as standard and is it unreasonable to think a civilian could not have had a Colt SP1 by 1974?

I got no problem believeing he might have had a Mine bullet shooting rifle..... I just have no idea as to whether he did or not.

BTW one of our marching songs in the Army started out with "Hey, hey, Captain Jack....." and one NCO said it was a reference to the "Captain Jack" that owned the rifle in question.

-kBob

 

[Jim Watson]

I know the 1841 started out as a patched ball rifle and that .54 Minies were supplied during the War and that many were rebored .58. I did not know the .54 Minies were so bad.

Which still does not say anything about Mr Hinson and his supposed .50 custom Minie rifle.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Actually the barrel shouldn't run you more than about $250 - $300. If Colerain can make a 42" barrels in .50 that are 1" across the flats, and 1 and 1/8" across the flat barrels in .54 and .58 in 36" for $200... they should be able to make a 41" to 42" barrel in a .50 that's 1½" across the flats for not much more. If not them then another company.

The lock and hardware are available, it's only getting a stock large enough to that that wide a barrel that may cause some problems, but it shouldn't be more than say $200-400 over what a similar rifle with a barrel 1" across the flats would cost.

That's for a visual replica...

NOW I don't know, but I'd venture to guess that he was using that thick a barrel so he could use a heavy powder charge, as the breech would hold the pressure and the weight would help to tame recoil...I'd also bet money the barrel had a gain twist to handle those high pressure charges and give him the best accuracy so he could reach out 1000 yards and ding Yankees "at half a mile".

Having a custom rifled barrel to give you a gain-twist..., and to do it right it would probably also have a tapered bore,..., now that would cost you.

And..., at that distance by the time the folks heard the shot, the smoke would've been dissipated, and the shooter would probably have already begun moving from that position... no chance of locating him and returning accurate fire

LD

 

[Jim Watson]

It all depends on a hands-on inspection of Mr Hinson's rifle by an expert in the field.
What is the actual caliber and rifling plan and twist?
The book describes the mould as "...made the conical Minie ball projectile with a banded concave base that would expand into the grooves upon being fired."
http://www.amazon.com/Jack-Hinsons-One-Man-Civil-Sniper/dp/1589806409#reader_1589806409
OK, that sure sounds like a Minie ball, but has any modern authority SEEN the mold or a bullet cast from it?

The plain finish and extra heavy barrel fit the description of the "chunk gun", a rustic target rifle meant to be shot at a mark when rested across a log, box, or other chunk of wood.
Not terribly uncommon.

 

[swathdiver]

Whomever is interested, why not just contact the present owner of the rifle? I'm sure they'd be more than happy to share this information or get it, just as they were when it came to the book.

 

[Sunray]

http://www.guns.com/2012/02/09/jack-hinson-the-civil-war-sniper/
Reproducing "a very special rifle" would be a custom build. Quite likely that any custom Kentucky rifle builder could do it, but it'd be expensive and wouldn't be built quickly.

 

[Jim Watson]

Search finds:

John Archer is a name seen on a percussion lockplate, nothing known about him.

W.E.G on the barrel flat might be William Gibson, a Tennessee gunsmith of the period, one of a family in business from the colonial era until the 1940s. Hard to find much, Google wants to tell you all about the modern author of the name.