Revolvers & Bullseye shooting?

[MrBorland]

I understand bullseye shooting is dominated by semi-autos, and I understand why, but I also read that some still compete with revolvers. Beyond this, it's hard to find more info. For instance:

Do they compete in a separate class? I've seen reference to a Distinguished Revolver Class. Do all events include a Revolver Class?

I imagine revolver competitors shoot in single action, but does this present problems in the timed event? I also it presents problems in having to re-adjust grip between shots.

Shooting double action would get around both the timing and grip issues, but is it a pipe dream to think one could be competitive shooting DA, even if it's with a highly tuned trigger and within a revolver class? Do any revolver competitors shoot double action? Even more basic, do revolver competitors universally shoot DA or SA revolvers, or both? Would it matter?

 

[zxcvbob]

In the Bullseye league where I shoot, there are separate classes for .22 and center-fire. Almost everybody shoots a semiauto .22, and the center fires are probably 2/3 revolvers and 1/3 semiauto. I've never seen anyone shooting their revolver DA in competition.

I can shoot my S&W model 15 (shooting SA) almost as accurately as I can my .22 target pistol but I don't compete in that class yet. I've been focused this season on qualifying at the next level with the .22 and haven't been shooting center-fire much at all. I'm gonna take my .45LC Blackhawk and some kind-of-hot ammo tonight just for fun but not turn in a score card.

The time it takes to cock the hammer actually helps you get a rhythm going. 10 seconds is plenty of time if you're not shooting really heavy-recoiling ammo. (I may have a little trouble with that tonight; if so I'll only get off 4 shots instead of 5)

 

[TEDDY]

revol/auto

I shoot a mod 10 heavy 4" with Bomar rib.I never had trouble with speed.timed is 30 seconds 5 shots/rapid is 10 sec 5 shots.course you shoot lite target loads 2.8 700x or bullseye and lead wc.Thats my gun for center fire.AMT long slide in 45 class.

 

[MrBorland]

Thanks. Very interesting.

So, you can shoot in different classes in a single match, e.g. .22 semi-auto & cf revolver? If revolvers are frequently used in centerfire, why don't more use a .22LR revolver? They wouldn't be competing with the semi-auto guys anyway, would they? There are numerous examples of centerfire revolvers that have a rimfire counterpart, it seems there'd be some advantage in not having to adjust to a new grip & platform.

Also, if the revolver were chambered in .45ACP or .45LC, one could get away with 2 guns, rather than 3, just like those who shoot a S&W M41 & a 1911?

Thanks for your patience!

 

[Canuck-IL]

You're getting confused. There are 2 common forums for Bullseye shooting....full scale, outdoors, 2700 matches and an indoor, reduced course that is usually shot as 60 rounds. This latter is termed a National Match course (30 rounds) and one is shot for 22 and one for centerfire. Different clubs may offer events with more or fewer rounds but the basics will be the same.

In a 2700, you have 90 shots of 22, 90 shots of centerfire and 90 shots of 45. Many folks use the same 45 for centerfire as for the final round of mandatory 45. Some will use a 32 or a 38, the latter often a modified 1911 tuned for 38Spc wadcutters.

In each of the 90 round matches, you shoot:
10 rounds in 10 minutes - twice (Slowfire) = 20 shots
a Nat'l Match Course of
....10 rounds in 10 minutes
......2 strings of 5 rounds in 20 secs (Timed Fire)
......2 string of 5 rounds in 10 secs (Rapid Fire) = 30 shots
Then, 2 rounds of Timed Fire, 2 strings each round = 20 shots
Then, 2 rounds of Rapid Fire, 2 strings each round = 20 shots

And that's the 90 shots for a full, single caliber slate. Now repeat the above for Centerfire and then again for 45. That makes 270 shots for a full course of 2700 possible points.

You can use a revolver for any of the 90 shot matches...I believe there are still records at Camp Perry for various parts of the match that were set with revolvers. But they compete on an even footing with the semi-autos. Some do shoot Rapid in doube-action, most cock it for every shot. Depends a lot on the size of your hand (thumb reach), the style of the hammer and the quality of the DA trigger job.

Our indoor winter league shoots 60 rounds per match - 30 of 22 and 30 of centerfire - so, 2 Nat'l Match courses. All 22s compete against each other as do all centerfires. Bullseye is more about improving your own scores rather than a head-to-head match against whoever shows up on a particular night. Team scores are determined by selecting the 4 highest team members' scores from each string....4 highest 22 Slow, 4 highest 22 Timed, 4 highest 22 Rapid, then repeat again for centerfire. Add each set of 4 up and you have a winning team for 22 and a winning team for centerfire for that night.

DR, or Distinguished Revolver, is a wholly separate affair - CMP sponsors matches that use the National Match 30 shot course but mandate a largely unmodified, at least visually stock, revolver ... ie. sights that were actually offered as part of a production run, symmetric left-right grip panels, etc. Trigger jobs, forcing cone tuning, recrowning the barrel are allowed.

You can find more detailed rules on parts and courses of fire both at the NRA and CMP sites.

PS: Some shoot revolver just because - they like'em! Some because the recoil impulse (no slide movement, ejection, feeding froma mag) is so different.
Others choose them because they're tired of dealing with FTF, FTRB, FTE, etc. You only get 1 alibi (reshoot) per round in a match - after that, it's points lost.

/Bryan

 

[lil ski]

It's all in what you are comfortable in shooting. I shoot indoor Bullseye and I shoot both semi and revolver depending on my mood. I does take practice to get off your 5 shots in 10 seconds for rapid but its not that hard to do. I don't know to many people that shoot double action with a stock gun, I have seen guns that were modifed to allow you to shoot that way. Most time it's much more accurate to shoot single action. A Smith Mod 10 is a good gun to use most people can get to the hammer with out changing your grip. Just remember shoot for the fun of it and to better your self I don't think to many people make their living shooting (I wish I could I would enjoy work alot more). As Canuck said there is no seprate class for revolvers in the NRA rules but check with your local club some do seporate them for awards I know mine club does. Good luck.

 

[cdrt]

I don't know to many people that shoot double action with a stock gun, I have seen guns that were modifed to allow you to shoot that way. Most time it's much more accurate to shoot single action.

Trigger pulls on revolvers are weighed in the single action mode, since for the .22 it has to be at least two pounds and for a .38 or .45 at least 2 and a half pounds. To get a revolver to work at those weights in double action is not feasible since the single action weight would be down to ounces and therefore not legal for competition, since it would not pass the trigger weight test.

 

[SX1guy]

Do any of you guys shoot a S&W 627...? if so how do you rate it for accuracy...if not... what is the most accurate and popular revolver for centerfire 38 cal...?
How dores the Colt Diamondback in 38cal do....
Thanks for any info...

 

[earplug]

My indoor club has a modified 15 yard Bullseye league. I use a S&W M14 .38 spl with a 8 3/8 barrel. Its fine for slow fire, can be a real chore in rapid fire.
The better scores are shot with accurate 1911 pattern pistols. Bigger holes, no thumb cocking, grip stays the same for each shot.
I enjoy shooting revolvers, its just more work to do it right.

 

[bdutton]

cdrt:
Trigger pulls on revolvers are weighed in the single action mode, since for the .22 it has to be at least two pounds and for a .38 or .45 at least 2 and a half pounds. To get a revolver to work at those weights in double action is not feasible since the single action weight would be down to ounces and therefore not legal for competition, since it would not pass the trigger weight test.

In bullseye pistol, triggers on the .22 must be at least 2lbs, CF must be at least 2.5lbs, the .45 must be at least 3.5lbs.

http://www.nrahq.org/compete/RuleBooks/Pistol/pst-w03.pdf

There is a new distinguished revolver program started by the NRA that follows the same basic rules of hte CMP's distinguished pistol program. The distinguished revolver rules are here:

http://www.nrahq.org/compete/RuleBooks/Pistol/pst-w23.pdf

 

[cdrt]

In bullseye pistol, triggers on the .22 must be at least 2lbs, CF must be at least 2.5lbs, the .45 must be at least 3.5lbs.

I was talking about revolvers. The .45 autoloader has to be 3.5 pounds. A .45 revolver only has to be 2.5 pounds just like it's .38 cousin. It's Rule 3.3 on page 9 of the NRA Pistol Rule Book.

 

[Canuck-IL]

what is the most accurate and popular revolver for centerfire 38 cal

Just based on a lot of local BE matches, I'd wager the S&W 6 inch Model 14 is the most common centerfire revolver. Probably 586/686 next most common.

Most accurate? ... I dunno, the guys who take it really seriously are not shooting stock guns. They've all had work done on the timing, springs and forcing cone. I'd say you can however advance your classification with a stock 14.
/B

 

[cdrt]

The Model 14 works just fine in it's original factory configuration. I shot a 261 in the last Distinguished Revolver match at OKC with a stock Model 14, which is more than acceptable since I don't practice with it very much. It will do much better with my target loads, but the DR match requires factory ammo. My 14 likes American Eagle 158 round nose ammo the best of what I've tried so far.

Some guys will shoot Colt Pythons. I think the Model 14 does a little better since it's not as muzzle heavy as the Python.

 

[Sunray]

Most of the guys I shot ISU Bullseye with and against used a semi-auto .22 and either a .38 Special or .357 revolver (brass loaded to .38 velocities or just .38 Specials). The guys that had the money used semi-auto .32 S&W target pistols.
It was .22 and centrefire. No special revolver class. Know one guy who had no problem competing on our club's 'Team 1' (the really good shooters) with a .38 revolver. However, our 'Team 2' was everybody and anybody who wanted to shoot. We won a lot too.
Shooting bullseye with whatever firearms you have is great fun. The best IPSC/IDPA etc shooters are bullseye shooters too.