Rifle dies

[wolfe]

I have been metallic reloading for about a year now. Started out doing mostly pistol and have decided that I want to do some rifle shells, specifically 223 and 308.

The 223 are for my AR-15 and teh 308 for my remington 700

My dies are Lee dies with full length Case sizing, collet neck sizing die and bullet seating die.

I have read that I don't want to to use the collect neck sizing die on the 223 rounds for the AR-15..

I have also seen a ffactory crimp die.

Needs help. Do I need the crimp die? If so for AR-15 rounds, or remington 700 rounds?

Do I use collet next die on the 223? the 308?

Sorry to be so dumb but I don't find alot of written info.

Thanks in advance for the help.

 

[Sport45]

Autoloading rifles can be hard on brass, so I think it's a good idea to always full length size for them. I also run brass for my M1 and AR's through case gauges after sizing and again when the cartridge is complete.

I don't crimp for any rifle I shoot now. I would crimp for lever guns with tubular magazines, but that's about it.

 

[kingmt]

You use the collet die for the bolt rifle. I don't load autos.

 

[gamestalker]

Don't feel dumb for asking questions, especially when the subject matter is related to reloading.
For the .308, the colet die is a real jewel and also extends brass life by quite a bit. But there is no need to crimp either of those cartridges, the normal neck tension is plenty sufficient to prevent set back or the opposit. And crimping bottle neck cartridges can create hair pulling issues for someone new to bottle neck loading for a step that is totally unnecessary anyway. For the AR use the FL die. And to reiterate, don't crimp that cartridge either.

 

[cfullgraf]

For the AR-15, you must full length size the cases.

You can neck size the cases for your bolt rifle. In theory, neck sizing extends the life of the case and improves accuracy as the case is fire formed for that rifle's chamber. Not everyone sees benefits from neck sizing.

Note, neck sized cases should only be used in the rifle it was originally fired in.

It is not necessary to crimp the bullets used in your AR-15 or your bolt rifle. I do not crimp ammunition used in any of my AR-15s or M1 Garands. No crimps either in my bolt rifles. The Lee FCD is not needed, save the money for other reloading goodies.

As a note, rifle cases gauges give useful information but the vast majority on the market are not chamber gauges. (JP Enterprises markets a chamber gauge for 223 Rem, I don't know of any other besides custom made gauges) The majority of the rifle gauges measure only over all length and neck position. Read the manufacturer's fine print.

In my opinion, measuring tools such as the RCBS Precision Mic or Sinclair's Bump Gauge and a set of calipers gives more useful information on over all length and shoulder position.

 

[Walkalong]

For your AR size to fit a case gauge, or screw the die all the way down and hope everyone got the specs right.

For your 700, size to fit the chamber, or size to fit a gauge.

 

[ranger335v]

"....but I don't find alot of written info."

That's because your answers are largely opinion, not critical. Of course everyone's sure his opinion is correct but your opinion is as good as anyone else's. You have the gun and make the ammo; try what you want to know and see what happens. Even if you guess wrong it won't blow you up.

 

[Walkalong]

That's right.

 

[wolfe]

OK. Full length size for the AR. Got that...

Now on the 308 rounds. Do I full length size the first time I fire it through the rifle and the only neck size after that?

Thanks for all the opinions...

 

[cfullgraf]

Now on the 308 rounds. Do I full length size the first time I fire it through the rifle and the only neck size after that?

Thanks for all the opinions...

If you have brass fired in another rifle, then you need to full length size it before firing it in your rifle. After that, you can neck size.

If you are starting with new cases, you may not need to the size the cases. There are differing opinions on the need.

 

[89blazin]

One additional piece of data, when using military brass, it is recommended to use less powder due to the wall thickness of the brass. I use 1.5 grains less (H4895) when reloading LC 7.62x51 w/168gr bullet as compared to reloading my commercial brass.

 

[Canuck-IL]

when using military brass, it is recommended to use less powder due to the wall thickness of the brass.

Don't blindly assume ... weigh the cases. LC 223 are among the lighter cases you'll find.
/Bryan

 

[PreMod70]

If you use the Lee collect die you never have to fool with lube or cleaning and the brass will last a long long time if you keep the pressures reasonable. I neck sized thousands of 7.62 Nato rounds with the collect die and fired them in my match M1-A for years and managed to keep the same 800 rounds of brass throughout that time. As long as you fire the brass in your chamber and keep the loads at normal pressures there is no reason to full length size which adds greatly to the longivity of the brass.

 

[Sport45]

when using military brass, it is recommended to use less powder due to the wall thickness of the brass.

This is always good advice when loading 7.62x51. Canuck was correct on specifying this.

Of course, starting at minimum load and working to max for your rifle will sort this type of thing out for you anyway. If you shoot mixed brass (as I do) don't mix military with commercial brass in .308 / 7.62x51.

 

[wolfe]

great information. I love this site. I wouldn't be able to do anything right without all the opinions.. Great stuff...

I'll do full resize of the 308 rounds and then only resize the neck after I fire them.. Thanks

I HATE lubricating brass

 

[loadedround]

Great information and video! I just orderd an RCBS Lockout Die for my Dillon 650. It's half the price of the Dillon and seems much easier to set up also.