RO's.....should the public be ALLOWED to have guns?

[Mad Man]

But I don't like being told how or when to shoot when I'm having a little quality time.

Key phrase is "little time." I don't know about the rest of the country, but with the amount of new development in the Denver area over the past 15 years, it's getting harder and harder to find a place to shoot.

What's sad is someone in thier mid 20's with no clue when it comes to firearms.

What's more sad is someone of any age with no clue who wants to learn, but has to deal with arrogant instructors and club officers who are more interested in making themselves feel important than making a serious effort to welcome new shooters. The result is someone who's invested a lot of time and money but is really frustrated and confused. I'm seeing this right now.

And as I've noted in another thread here, it's not just with new shooters. After 15 years, I've gotten to that point where I'm thinking about getting rid of my guns (I can put $25,000 to better uses). Putting up with anti-s is bad enough; putting up with petty people on power trips has turned shooting from an enjoyable hobby into a chore.

It's not a coincidence that this started after I stopped shooting on public land (for various reasons) and started shooting at organized clubs.

 

[Ben Shepherd]

Why is it we need RO's for ranges if we don't need knife sentrys when we're eating steaks?

Fill in the _____________.

 

[armoredman]

I worked for a year and a half as RSO at an indoor range, part and full time, and about 6 months at an outdoor range. I agree with all the above storie, and I have a few hairraising ones, too. The worst was not when I was there - a guy rented a SP101, and then committed suicide right there in bay two. Yes, that gun is still on the rental shelf.....

 

[keyhole]

With our range, members, there is no RO, except during matches. I know of numerous members, who will pack up and leave when another shooter shows up. I guess that they rather enjoy shooting alone, and without the company.
The last time we had an AD, we figured out the guy had a problem with his 1911, as when he dropped the slide, it "went off". At least it was downrange, and witnessed by another RO, and several members.

Those who have had, and those who will.

 

[Mad Man]

With our range, members, there is no RO, except during matches. I know of numerous members, who will pack up and leave when another shooter shows up. I guess that they rather enjoy shooting alone, and without the company.

I'm one of those people. Yes, I like to be alone, but it's not the thought of company that makes me leave when other people show up.

At most ranges, there is a single firing line. As soon as there are two or more groups, it means everybody must stop shooting at the same time, check and set targets at the same time, etc. This can be a hassle if you're waiting to check/change your target while the other guy is shooting.

It some cases, it also means that everybody must shoot from the same distance -- which is another hassle if somebody wants to shoot from 10 yards, and another wants to shoot from 20. (One range I'm a member of doesn't allow the use of target stands).

Add 3 or more groups of shooters, and it becomes either wasted time waiting for other people to stop shooting, or feeling self-concious while other people are waiting for you.

Simply put: I don't like to wait for other people, and I don't want other people to make other people wait for me.

I've also had problems with other members getting on my case about violating some (always unwritten) rule (in one case, some guy didn't like the fact that I was shooting ten rounds at a steady pace, because "in standard target shooting, only five rounds are fired at a time").

For a group that prides ourselves on individuality, I've learned that shooting involves doing a lot of things in lockstep with other people around you.

As places to shoot become more scarce, I only see this problem getting worse.

 

[Gewehr98]

Having risked my life at a public property, unsupervised range...

It's not a coincidence that this started after I stopped shooting on public land (for various reasons) and started shooting at organized clubs.

One near Vassar Lake in Placer County, California. It's a miracle people aren't found dead there.

And I'd be real curious why you left the relative safety of shooting on public land and started shooting at organized clubs.

I was present, as a patron, at the Sacramento Valley Shooting Center when a couple fellows were trying to figure out how their new SKS functioned. If you don't know the rest of the story, it ends with one guy shooting the top of his head off as the muzzle passed under his chin. I knew the range officer there, and I'll wager to this day he asks himself what he could have done differently to prevent that accidental death.

You folks who think range officers are there to satisfy some internal control freak obsession, you're missing the boat by a wide margin. Range officers are hired by the facility, or volunteer their time to the facility, to provide a safe environment for folks of all types to enjoy shooting. It's not because the management of the facility gets a kick out of folks getting yelled at. It's because they can't afford the cost of firearm accidents. Ever check out how much insurance costs are on a typical indoor or outdoor shooting facility? I've witnessed more than one close because they couldn't afford the premiums, and that's before somebody gets shot there, either by suicide or negligence.

I volunteered to RO at a couple facilities to help out the club. They couldn't afford to pay their RO's a real wage, but if there were no RO's, there was no open range, period. So we volunteer a day or two out of the month, and keep the range safe, and keep it open.

It's a type of risk-management, really. As long as people show up at a range open to the public, with very little in the way of training or muzzle discipline, then you're asking for an accident, not if, but when. You may be the safest gun owner that ever walked the planet, but do you know what the other guy's up to? Neither do the owners of the range, so they keep RO's on staff.

If you have trouble with listening to an RO, fine. Buy some secluded property where the neighbors won't whine about the noise, fence it off, plow a berm or three into a suitable backstop, and have at it. Unfortunately, that's not always an option, as urban sprawl continues it's course.

I'm not keen on RO's jumping down people's throats who don't deserve the admonishment. But if you do something that would either get you hurt, looking silly, killed, or a combination of all three, then the dressing-down, as administered in a professional manner by the attendant RO, will probably be foremost in that person's mind, even if he never goes to that particular range again. And that's how I feel about it. If I jump somebody for muzzle sweeping the clientel or putting a bullet into the ceiling, he may take it personally and never come back to my range, but that's fine, because there's a good chance he won't do the same thing at a different facility, either.

 

[Beetle Bailey]

I've gone out into the California desert to shoot a few times (hope to go again soon. . . ) and it's a great experience. But the 1 1/2 hour drive makes it kinda tough to do regularly so most of my shooting is at the local public ranges.

At one of the ranges, they have two friendly easy-going RO's who are good at watching things and politely explaining to people what they are doing wrong. The other RO's are okay, I guess.

At another range, the main RO is very strict about the rules (they are simple rules, mind you, but he does raise his voice to enforce them). If someone points a muzzle accidentally at another person or approaches the benches during a line-break, he raises his voice, but he's not rude, just loud.

The third range I go to has good supervision when the owner is there. However, when he's not there, rapid-fire shooting (which normally is not allowed) is suddenly okay. It's an indoor range and the last time I was there, these guys were emptying their pistol mags ASAP (and barely getting on paper at 21 feet ). The RO is in another room watching thru protective glass and when my buddy asks the RO about the rapid fire, his reply was "They are kinda borderline. . ." They were pulling the trigger as fast as they could but the RO was too lazy/indifferent to do anything about it.

Guess which ranges I feel safe at and which one is "I wonder what I'll get today. . ."

 

[artherd]

The combination of idoits and nervous power-trippers has made public ranges by and large not-fun-places.


I actually perfer un-regulated ranges. I simply bring my rifle to string up targets.

That said, I had a similar expierence at Los Altos. 4 guys were GREAT, chatting about cartridges and barrel legenths, and the like. Let one shoot my G-34.

Then there was the dill-hole who chewed me out for 'leaving brass on the ground". The range was bloody hot! I had cleaned it after the last cease-fire ended ! I WAS IN THE PROCESS of shooting!

I asked another RO if I could sweep up brass during the cease-fire. His reply "Heck, Sure! Just don't pick up the bloody rifle and you can do whatever you want."