Round ball size for Traditions .54 caliber Hawken muzzleloader

[Doc Rizzi]

.530 round balls roll down the barrel with the help of gravity only....this rather surprised me. I will try the .535 next to see how that goes. Being too small for the barrel the ball was all over the place on the target. The ball never had a chance to contact the rifling and pick up any sort of spin. I just felt funny about the ball rolling down the barrel so loose so I only put about 3 rounds through it. Is there that big a variance in barrel runs at the factory? Perhaps I should take it to a gunsmith and have the caliber measured before I go and buy another box of round balls. Have any of you run into this type of variance in traditions barrels?

 

[arcticap]

Without a patch, I believe that a .530 ball can be expected to roll right right down a .54 barrel.
I've unintentionally rolled a few unpatched .440 balls into the barrel of a Traditions .45 Buck Hunter Pro pistol, and the bare balls still shot on target at 25 yards.
Every gun is unique, but generally the Traditions barrels have good spec.'s.
You were shooting sub-caliber bare balls without a patch and expected them to fill & seal the bore?

 

[icy]

In addition to arcticap:

http://www.hunter-ed.com/sc/course/ch5_loading_a_muzzleloader.htm

 

[DaveP (UK)]

Nice to hear that the Brown Bess loading technique is still with us - drop ball in, bounce ramrod on it, or if the ramrod is already on the other side of nomansland just bounce butt on the ground... and never ever fire downhill! Works a treat if theres enough of you do it at the same time!

The .54 calibre almost certainly refers to the diameter measured between the lands. Do yourself a favour and find out the groove diameter of the barrel. It will probably be something like 20thou bigger! You only need to measure it at the muzzle, and if your working at home you could use a good pair of vernier calipers.

What you need is a ball and patch combination that adds up to just over the groove diameter. To be more exact, the ball diameter and twice the patch thickness shoulds be not more than 5 thou greater than the groove diameter. Any bigger and its just too hard to get the load into the barrel and you risk deforming it with all the hammering!

The precise combination is a matter for experiment, but for example, I have a .50 cal ML rifle in which I have successfully used a .490 ball with 15 thou patches and a .495 ball with 10 thou patches. Yes, the total diameters are different. The thicker patches are squashier! The thinner patches ought to be more accurate, and I'm still testing that point!
HTH

Just noticed I'm not a new member anymore! Is that a clock thing or a number of posts thing?

 

[Aries-]

generaly with round ball you use a patch around the ball not just lose like a mini, maxi or a sabbot shot. you really dont want to be forcing a straight lead ball down the barrel it will deform it change it from a ball to more of an egg shape which will fly wired. the patch is what gets bashed into the rifling, try it you might like your results better using a patch than trying to hammer a ball straight down the barrel. my dad has a mould that isnt quite the right size and makes 535 balls. and it bruses his hand putting them down the barrel with a patch. the 531 balls go nicely with a patch not to tight and not to lose.

 

[Picknlittle]

I've always used a lubed patch with round balls. I did find that patches made from pillow ticking was about as perfect as perfect can get.

If you don't want to hassle with patches, then try maxi-balls. This will require more cleaning between shots though.

 

[Doc Rizzi]

I was using a felt wad over the powder...ball on top

With my .50 caliber I drop the .490 ball after seating the wad and I still need to use the ball starter. When dropping the .530 in there was no resistance at all and she rolled right down to the felt wad. I understand that the patched round ball would fill the space...I guess I was just surprised because of having to use the starter with the .490 in the .50 caliber and not having to do the same with the .530 in the .54 caliber. Thanks for all the input.

 

[Aries-]

then your .49 ball isnt .49 lol.

if 10 thou makes a big difference in 1. it logicaly has to make the same difference in the other. so ether your .49 ball is smaller. or your .53 ball is smaller.

 

[DaveP (UK)]

I can see why you're surprised!
Unless your .50 cal is really ancient the likely explanation is going to be the size of the balls.
Any chance you could measure up and post your findings?

 

[Doc Rizzi]

I will measure the round balls and the barrels of both...

Tomorrow I will measure the round balls, both the .490's and the .530's, and the barrels of both rifles and see what I get. It has been very consistent with the .490's but I am curious now to see how they measure up. I picked up some .535's today too. I will try both the patched ball and the over the wad ball and see what shoots best.

 

[Plink]

Doc, even when using a wad, you still need to patch the ball in order for it to grab the rifling. Good luck to you and enjoy making smoke!

 

[Doc Rizzi]

Gotta respect the patch!

Interesting. My CVA barrel is a tad tight...so that explains why the .490 balls need a little nudge from the ball starter....but the Traditions .54 caliber measured right on. I put a lubed patch on the ball and my first 5 shots formed a tight group 4" high at 50 yards. I moved over to the hundred yard bench and my next 5 were all in the black holding dead on....so...I learned my lesson. I think I was thrown off by the fact that I thought I didn't need a patch because the ball was going in tight..but I was wrong. The patch is an important part of the round ball ballistics. Putting the patch on the already tight .50 required a lot more effort to get the ball started down the barrel, but there again, accuracy was dramatically improved. Thank you all for your input!

 

[DaveP (UK)]

Its a good feeling when something starts to come together isn't it?
Regarding your .50 cal: If the ball was tight without a patch I shudder to think whats going on with one! It shouldnt be a fight to get the ball started.
If your wacking a very tight ball into the barrel it will inevitably be deformed, making it less than predictable. You arent going to hurt anything (except maybe your hand) shooting what you have, but next purchase I would recommend a smaller size and an assortment of patch thicknesses for shooting pleasure!

 

[Plink]

Sounds like you might want to try a smaller ball for your .50. They make a .485. If the gun is new, it might load a bit easier after some breaking in. That smooths out machining marks in the bore. After you fire a couple hundred rounds through it, a patched .490 might fit perfectly. I'm glad it's working out for you now.