Roundballs vs. conicals?

[stevekl]

I own only a smoothbore and a revolver, so I don't know much at all about rifle bullets. I am trying to sort it all out in my head but it's a little confusing. I know that roundballs just load with a patch, and I know that Minie-type bullets load without a patch and rely on the 'skirt' to expand in order to engage the rifling. But what other kinds of bullets are there?

My smoothbore is a T/C renegade and I am kinda half-thinking about getting a rifled barrel. I don't think I want to shoot roundballs; I want to shoot conical bullets. But other than the Minie types, I have no idea how conicals work.

So I guess my basic question is, how do non-Minie conical bullets work? Do they load without a patch, or what?

 

[Voodoochile]

All muzzleloading conical bullets load without any patch material.

The Mini Bullets do have the hollow base which the intention is to have the bullet load easily even after several shots but apaun firing will expand the base to engrave the rifling onto the bullet & thus stabilize the bullet in flight.

Most other conical types that I've seen engraves the rifling apaun loading thus they do tend to be a little harder for consecutive shots but since they are allready engraved with the rifling & thus spun in flight because of the fact they are also stabilized.

 

[arcticap]

All muzzleloading conical bullets load without any patch material.

Only bore size conical bullets load without a patch or sabot.
There's a large variety of conical bullets which are designed to be used in combination with plastic sabots. There's a specific sabot for each caliber of bullet fired as well as the bore that it will be shot out of.
For instance, there's a .50 sabot for .44 magnum bullets (.429 - .430 inch), and another .50 sabot for .45 bullets (~.451).
The bore requires swabbing often, usually after about 1-3 shots to maintain accuracy and make loading easier, because they are tougher to load to begin with. But they are very accurate out of fast twist barrels and will also work with medium twist barrels.
Then there are the plastic skirted Powerbelt conicals, which are easier to load and have a plastic skirt that expands when fired. These are usually more expensive than regular lead conical bullets.
Hornady had a new "slip fit" jacketed muzzle loading bullet that works without any plastic sabot or a skirt. It has a hollow base like a Minie. They are made very precisely close to bore diameter so that they aren't a bear to start and ram.
Look at some of the conical bullets and sabot combinations that Cabela's sells:

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/t...at20712&parentType=category&parentId=cat20712

 

[Dinelli.0614]

if you plan on shooting conicals, sabot or whatever you are gonna want a fast to medium twist. like a 1:30 to no more than 1:48

 

[Voodoochile]

Only bore size conical bullets load without a patch or sabot.
There's a large variety of conical bullets which are designed to be used in combination with plastic sabots. There's a specific sabot for each caliber of bullet fired as well as the bore that it will be shot out of.
For instance, there a .50 sabot for .44 magnum bullets (.429 - .430 inch), and another .50 sabot for .45 bullets (~.451).
The bores require swabbing after about 1-3 shots to maintain accuracy and make loading easier, because they are tougher to load. But they are very accurate out of fast twist barrels and also work with medium twist barrels.
Then there are the plastic skirted Powerbelt conicals, which are easier to load and have a plastic skirt that expands when fired. They are all usually more expensive than regular lead bullets.
Hornady had a new jacketed muzzle loading bullet that works without a plastic sabot or a skirt.
Look at some of the conical bullets and sabot combinations that Cabela's sells:

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/te...entId=cat20712

Ops.
Forgot about the Sabots, sorry about that.

 

[stevekl]

So, if I want to shoot something that is easy to load, it would have to be hollow-base?

Edit- oh, almost forgot to ask this: I want to cast the bullets I shoot. Would these bullets require swaging?

 

[Ifishsum]

So, if I want to shoot something that is easy to load, it would have to be hollow-base?

I cast and load the solid base Lee 320 gr R.E.A.L. conicals in my TC Hawken and they are not hard to load, in fact I start them with my thumb. the driving bands get progressively larger from back to front so they start easy. They do get more difficult as the bore fouls, but a quick swab takes care of that.

I use them as-cast, just cast with pure lead, not an alloy. You want them as soft as possible. I got a supply of scrap roof vent pipe and flashing for casting my muzzleloader balls and bullets. Wheel weight lead will not work well for these.

 

[scrat]

The lee R.E.A.L bullets are the way to go. When i first got my .50 cal i started shooting different types of bullets. 1 to test how strong each were. but how accurate and easy to load. I bought all sorts of bullets from conicals to sabots to the plain sabot plastic cover using .45 cal bullets then using all types of bullets. I found a couple different things. Sabots using TC Shock waves are very very accurate they are rated #1 in my book. Next is a tie between Powerbelt and the Lee R.E.A.L bullet next is the cva acura load. Almost on the bottom of the list was Hornady great plains bullet. the Various plain conicals i used with .45 and .44 bullets seemed to always fall behind TC Shock Waves, Powerbelts, R.E.A.L bullets. Now a days i pretty much just shoot the R.E.A.L bullets i found that they are most accurate with 85 grains of 777 or about 65-70 grains of goex. Any more powder just seemed to be a waiste.

 

[Pancho]

The only problem i've experienced with REAL bullet molds is inconsistency in size. Some will start with my thumb others must be started with a wooden mallet. I feel it is operator error. Due to temperatue control. I've bought from lee minie ball molds for .45,50, and .58 caliber. It remains to be seen the results. I've got a 15 long guns to try them in.

 

[davecampperry]

Pancho, Lee blocks are extremely sensitive to debris between the block faces. Just a smidgen can cause the blocks to remain apart, however slightly, causing that bullet to be larger. That's why most of use a Minie sizer, more as a go/no-go gauge than for sizing.

 

[Pancho]

Dave, do you have a source or did you make your own sizer?

 

[frontiergander]

If you have a smoothbore, stick with patched round balls.

 

[sharps59]

panch
northeast trader co. makes sizers that fit a std 7/8th reloading press
if you want one to fit a lubersizer. the is a gentalman that makes thous but i do not have his name and # handy go to the N-SSA site some one there will have it.
not sure a minnie will work in anything that dose not have shallow rifleing. like CW stile .

 

[arcticap]

I have 2 of these inexpensive CVA sizers.
IIRC, their diameters average about .503 - .505 or so since they're not perfectly round or factory labeled.
I've never used them so if someone thinks that they have a use for one, let me know.
Also, these might give someone an idea about how to proceed to make one on their own.