Ruger .357 Maximum test gun, US Arms Seville

[Coogs.]

Most of us are well aware of the torrid history of the Ruger .357 Maximum. This is a little known part of that history. When issues of flame cutting and forcing cone erosion started to become and problem and came to light, the project was turned over to Walter Howe, head of special projects. Walter was friends with Jeff Munnell who was one of the principals of US Arms when they were in Arizona. Walter had called Jeff asking basically asking him what issues they had. After the course of conversation, Jeff offered to send Walter a Seville so that they could test it. Jeff walked out on the production line and randomly pulled this gun and sent it to Ruger. This gun has had 1000 "proof" loads through it as well as over 9000 factory rounds.

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AS shipped

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Note the stamp on the inside of the box lid.

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Rockwell testing points on underside of barrel.

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And again on frame above cylinder window.

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On it's own, without the Ruger connection, this Seville is fairly scarce.

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letter from Waler Howe to Jeff Munnel, sorry, not able to rotate it for some reason.

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Letter from Jeff Munnell to me.

 

[Saleen322]

Thank you for the interesting post. I can relate as I was a PA Silhouette shooter in the 80s up into the 90s. While I never owned a Seville, I always heard good things about them. I too shot a 357 Super Mag/Maximum but in a Dan Wesson. Some revolver guys I trusted told me they liked the DW over the Ruger because Ruger used a shorter cylinder and did not handle the 200 grainers well. The same guys said don't go under 180 grain bullets and you will have not flame cutting issues. They were right and I still have that Dan Wesson today and it still shoots very well.

 

[bannockburn]

Coogs

Interesting story and great documentation to go with it! Never saw all that many Sevilles but the ones I did come across seemed to be very well made.

 

[Coogs.]

What killed the Ruger Maximum were guys trying to push 125gr. bullets @ Mach 3.4 and the uniformed and underinformed writers that bashed it so hard. Turned public opinion against it, and Ruger pulled the gun. The shorter cylinder didn't help, but was not the major contributing factor. Flame cutting on the top strap abates after about 1000+ rds or so. The original forcing cone was 5 degrees, Ruger changed it to 11 degrees which helped considerably. If you stay with heavy bullets, 180 gr and heavier, and slow burning powders, you don't have an issue. Coogs.

 

[Coogs.]

Actually this is the only Seville I own, now Ruger Maximums are a different story.

 

[DWFan]

The Dan Wesson M40 SuperMag cylinder isn't just longer than the Ruger's, it's larger in diameter as well. "uninformed and underinformed" writers? Try just one and everyone followed his lead. Bob Milek completely blasted the .357 Maximum in the October '83 issue of Guns and Ammo. Of course S&W didn't help since their .44 Magnum couldn't handle the rigors of silhouette so they ripped Dan Wesson and pointed to Ruger recalling the Maximum Blackhawk as "proof" that they were right.
Mr. Munnell did an excellent article for the May/June 1984 issue of Handloader that addresses the differences between the Blackhawk and the Seville and gives load data for both. I have used his Seville data in my SuperMag.

 

[Desolo]

I saw a .357 Max ruger for sale at a gun show a few months back.... nib. Wish id had 600$.

Also, Hey DWFan! fancy seeing you here!

 

[shootniron]

Cool gun and story...thanks for sharing with us.

Man, I have always LOVED that Seville hammer...it is a thing of beauty, to me.

 

[xxjumbojimboxx]

Coolest. Gun. Ever. Bet it has some kick to it Barely a turn ring though, for having 10000 rounds through.

 

[Coogs.]

Desolo, you didn't say what barrel length, but, at $600.00, a couple months ago, you should have found the money if you want one. NIB 10 1/2 are in the $900.00-$1,100.00 range 7 1/2" guns about a $100.00 to a $150.00 less.
DWFan, I will tell you I am a "doubting" Thomas. For years there have been rumors about a Maximum recall, buyback, trade in and Ruger will keep your Max if you send it in, rumors about that last one persist even today.The only thing I have heard has been rumors. I have "heard" but never been able to document any of the above. I do know Walter Howe was actually fired by Bill Sr., for about two weeks, for supposedly "buying back" Maximums at full retail regardless of what the customer paid for them. I have also "heard" lots of stories like " my brothers neighbor sent a Max in and got a new Super Blackhawk" or, "my cousins 2nd wife's boss sent his in for repair and they sent him a new Blackhawk" All stories, I have talked to lots of people that have said they know someone,, or they themselves have done a "trade in", but no documentation. As far as the recall goes, I probably have about every factory piece of paper, sent to dealers and released to the public. Not one mentions any thing about any type of recall.
As far as the "don't send your Max back in" baloney, that's what it is. Now, maybe back in the 80's that DID happen, still can't document it. Today, it WILL NOT happen. First of all you have to call or e-mail Ruger to get a return authorization. They will tell you they no longer support the Maximum, so you can't send it in, they won't issue you a RA. Now that is for repairs, Now, if you just wanted to send it in for a reblue, you could, and they will not keep it. If you do send it in for reblue and Ruger refuses to do it, say because there is a broken part on it, they WILL send it back to you. Spent a long time on the phone with customer service last year verifying all this.
DWFan, I guess "uninformed and underinformed" was just a polite way of describing some gun writers who had their head up their.......because of Milek.
His article(s) are well known to me and part of my Max paper collection. He is also quoted in Wilson's Book "Ruger and his Guns" saying some not good things.
Now, if anyone can prove me wrong on any of the above, PLEASE DO!!!
But, you have to document it! I learned many years ago that if someone says "Ruger didn't do that" or, "They didn't ever make that", in the immortal words of Sherman T. Potter, "horse hockey" With Ruger you can never say never. Coogs.

 

[steveno]

I also remember that the other thing the gun writers didn't like about it was the Ruger released it to the shooters before the gun writers got their hands had on it.

 

[Coogs.]

Steveno, I believe you are right about that. Coogs.

 

[Desolo]

It appeared to be a 7-1/2" barrel.... didnt really know what it was til later sadly.

You know what they say, hindsight is 20/20.....I like to think that stroke of good luck wasnt for me, maybe it made someone elses day

 

[DWFan]

Coogs, the man you should get in touch with is David Bradshaw. He's a member of singleactions.com and was involved with the development of the Ruger Maximum Blackhawk.

EDIT: Never mind. I just realized who you are and that pics of your Seville are on that site. If we ever meet, the first cup of coffee is on me.

 

[Coogs.]

DWFan, David and I have had many conversations, still need to have a lot more. I have talked to John Taffin and would love to be able to get a hold of Rick Jamison. These guys were around and wrote about the Max and Supermag when they were just coming out. If anyone knows how to get a hold of Rick I would appreciate a heads up. DW, drop me a pm some time, Coogs.