S&W M27-2; what a disappointment

[Onty]

Last night I finally convinced older gentlemen in my club to sell his M27, 8-3/8†barrel. I was looking for such revolver for many moons and was happy like little kid when he suddenly agreed. He opened the case, pulled it from pouch, and I almost grabbed it. Few seconds later I almost dropped revolver; I couldn’t believe my eyes!!! I had seen quite number of revolvers but nothing like this. It was so poorly finished, almost like WWI Webleys. I didn’t see any commercial revolver that could be compared to it. Rounded edge on the bottom of left side frame was so rough and uneven that looks like done by hand grinder. The barrel has deep scores around ejector housing. Front/back cylinder play none, side minimal, but barrel-cylinder gap was on one side .012†and another .010â€. The disappointment was even bigger after having one M27-3, 5â€, that was beautify finished. According to the owner, gun is quite accurate and 1-1/2†group shouldn’t be difficult to get with tailored ammo. I just couldn’t convince myself to take such ugly thing.

Did S&W make M27-5 with 8-3/8†barrel? Thanks, Onty.

 

[Mike Irwin]

You sure he hadn't had it reblued at some point in the past?

 

[Standing Wolf]

Out of the box in 1978, my Smith & Wesson model 27-2 was a dog.

 

[Onty]

Nothing was done on it according to owner. He bought it from his friend and gun has original bill, instructions and wooden case. But, you never know, there is always possibility that an idiot was pretending to be a smith. I just couldn’t imagine that something lake that M27-2 could leave S&W factory, even during Bangor Punta times.

 

[Tamara]

There's 27-2's and then there's 27-2's, if you know what I mean. My '64-vintage (pre-Bangor Punta) 27-2 is the star of my S&W collection. I'd even sell off my four pre-war guns before ditching this gem.

Some later ones might not live up to the hype.

 

[Gordon]

My " Original Magnum" commenrative is a dog close up too. While not quite as bad as you describe it is an insult to the memory of Registered magnums it mimics with it's repro resistration papers ect. I just can't see getting rid of a 5" model 27 (not pinned and recessed) because I only paid $350 new.BTW I have a 3.5 inch 60's mod 27 thats gorgeous!

 

[Brian Williams]

I just got one that is a great gun SN S283xxx, it has a 8 3/8 barrel and Herret grips. I have just shot it once and 165 gr LSWCGC's over 14.5 gr of 2400 is great making a nice group of 3 " at 25 yds.

 

[Lightsped]

Here is the infamous M-27 that I found tucked away in the back of my closet for who knows how many years. My dads gun. Not sure when it was produced, but it does have a nice bluing job and the checkered top strap. I don't know much about older Smiths, but this one does have a VERY sweet factory trigger on it.

 

[Ala Dan]

Greeting's Lightsped,

Give us the first few didgits of the S/N, and we will
try to give you the weapons born on date?

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

 

[Lightsped]

Yeah, I'll pull the gun out tomorrow and post the S/N. If I remember correctly, the original reciept is in the box with the gun. Original price was $140.00 and the reciept was dated 1970 or 71 (print was very faded).

 

[Onty]

Perfessr, “...a nice group of 3 " at 25 ydsâ€. Are you sure that revolver couldn’t do better? As far as I could recall, any half decent handgun will make 3†at 25 yds with any reasonable ammo; from the rest, of course.

 

[Tom C.]

I have a 6" Model 27-2. Very nice. Showing it's age a bit.
I think if you really want a 8 3/8" gun, beat him down on the price, then send it to the S&W Performance center. They can set the barrel back 1 turn, and refinish the thing to better than factory new. Don't know the cost.

 

[Gordon]

"As far as I could recall, any half decent handgun will make 3†at 25 yds with any reasonable ammo; from the rest, of course. " This is a common fantasy of people who have not shot pistols very long. From a RANSOM REST (all mechanical no human element and simulates hand held point of impact) I've not found many in hundred of target grade pistols that will consistanly group less than 2" with top grade match quality ammo. A few all out target .22s, a very few TOP name 1911's, a few bull barrel revolvers with match grade ammo. I have held in formal slow fire bullseye competition a few 3" 'possibles' at 25 yards with Colt officer's model match .22 & .38 revolvers and a Bob Chow Bulls eye .45. in my 20s and 30s when my eyes were sharp and my nerves were steel. Have a PPC bull Barrel Mod 66 and a Goldcup that CAN do it!Now I can do it off hand with a scoped Contender or XP But even rested with the Merit disc in place this is very difficult for me to pull off consistantly and I have my "Distinquished" ticket!

 

[mec]

A while back, I did some shooting with an 8 3/8" 27. Several loads with cast lead bullets were doing 2.5 from a casual bench rest at 25 yards. There were a couple of loads it really liked and they would do just a bit over one inch. I've seen other 27s that were a bit picky about loads but there is room for hope that you will be able to find a combination it will like.

 

[Checkman]

Saxonpig-

One of my M28-2's came with the factory grips (with the same serial number), but I replaced them with Houges. Truth be told I've never fired one of my 28's with the factory grips. How do they handle? I suppose I should just put them on and go to the range one day. But any info would be appreciated - thanks.

 

[Onty]

Gordon,

" 'As far as I could recall, any half decent handgun will make 3†at 25 yds with any reasonable ammo; from the rest, of course. ' This is a common fantasy of people who have not shot pistols very long. "

No flames intended, and I am not very long time pistol shooter. However, I must be spoiled by my shooting gang and their ability to make handguns shoot (I forgot to mention that my comment is for target guns only, with barrel length 5†and above, not for short barrel ones). That is the reason why I joined them (mostly silhouette shooters, half size up to 100 m) to learn more, a lot more because those guys shoot a lot. A few minutes ago, I finished a conversation with R, a senior, long time shooter. After he heard whole internet story, he responded:

“Almost 90 % of all target handguns we tested will go 3†or less at 25 yds, with tailored ammo we are reloading, cast bullets only. The groups should be even smaller with jacketed bullets. If any of my target guns wouldn’t make 3â€, I would not sell it, but rather destroy it because I am not going to cheat somebody and sell them a bad gun. If some of you, by any chance, travel to Southern Ontario, Canada, we will be very glad show you how we do it on the range.â€

And I will tell you his little secret: “If you are looking for accurate revolver, LOOK FOR M19. Stay away from M27 and M28.â€

Well, tomorrow I am going to see another, like NIB M27, 8-3/8â€. I know that he is going to spit on me if I by it, but feel and beauty of long barrel M27 is just overwhelming. Regards, Onty.

 

[Brian Williams]

My groups are a pretty quick DA and they are shot two handed and no rest or sandbag. Not bad for a farsighted old curmudgeon in training

 

[Onty]

"My groups are a pretty quick DA and they are shot two handed and no rest or sandbag. Not bad for a farsighted old curmudgeon in training"

That is something. When I reach that level in SA, I’ll throw a party for all my shooting buddies. Another long time shooter threatened to kick me into beginner’s shooting course for the next few months if I show up with anything but a TC Contender. My only hope is that I could blame my colleague from a previous company for letting me shoot his M27-3, 8-3/8â€...

 

[Tamara]

“If you are looking for accurate revolver, LOOK FOR M19. Stay away from M27 and M28.â€

That doesn't square with my experience at all. There's no reason a 19 should be more accurate than a 27. (And my 4" 19-5 is no more accurate than my 3.5" 27-2... )

 

[BigG]

"As far as I could recall, any half decent handgun will make 3†at 25 yds with any reasonable ammo; from the rest, of course. " This is a common fantasy of people who have not shot pistols very long.

Nothing but the truth, Gordon!

ONTY: A 357 MAGNUM should in no way be construed a TARGET PISTOL. Think about it: all the target models are 38 SPECIAL, even ye olde Colt Python Target. You can look it up. YMMV

 

[Checkman]

Thanks for the info. My other M28 came with rubber grips, but my dad had the coke bottle grips from his old M28 that he bought back in 72. He long ago traded his M28, but he still had the grips. I like the grips (both of my 28's are 6" models), but I've alwasy been curious about the Magna grips.

 

[VonFatman]

I don't have a 27

Onty,
Both of my 28-2's are absolute tack drivers...of course they have wonderful trigger(s) which makes driving tacks much easier!

I have not fired a 19, but how do you inprove on (pretty much) single whole groups? OK, I agree, smaller single whole groups...but question how I could ask for improvement in either of these guns.

I guess I need to try a 19!!

VonFatman

 

[Grump]

My Dad won Bullseye matches with a 4-inch Model 19.

He bought a used K-38 snub with adjustable sights and scored 49-3x with the first five shots at 25 yards, standard target.

The 10-ring at 50 yard slow fire is something like 3 inches. If so few revolvers can shoot less than 2 inches at 25, then why have so many people scored 2700 doing the CF stage with stock revolvers with nothing other than the grips changed out?

Get away from the .38 wadcutters, and 2-inch groups at 50 become far more rare. It's usually a reloading nut with dozens of test loads who finally finds a .357 Mag load that shoots to that level. My best are still only half that good.

 

[Gordon]

Well the truth be known ; I haven't cocked a DA revolver for target work since the 70's when the PPC thing came on . I don't think some of these one holer groups that get bragged about are measured correctly either. Like I said , I have a big nasty PPC revolver that can shoot prolly 1" groups @ 50yds from sand bags all day long if your atheletic prowness is up to it. Mine isn't and never was OFFHAND Standing up on your feet., except with a scoped hand rifle with which I've picked off ground squirrels to 200+ yards. What I'm saying is I'll bet if I clamped a Ruger SRH or a New Mod 29 or what ever new(decent) factory revolver in a Ransom rest, and fed it decent factory fodder, the average would be more like 4" or MORE with only freak exceptions at 25 yards. This is plenty good enough to do what it was intended to do and better than 90% of what anybody can shoot in the real world. Now in target shooting (I only have inserts for a few guns I used to shoot in competition, like ; 1911's , K frame, Colt I frame) the ransom rest lets you quickly develop or buy specific loads that group best in YOUR SPECIFIC gun. This load fits the gun deal is well known and very few combos produce less than 3" at 25yards MECHANICALLY rested, but some are exceptional like your cast bullet friends have developed. BTW : an extremely skilled shot CAN shoot a gun BETTER than a Ransom rest!!! Another weird gunfact!