S&W no 3 44 Russian value question?

[Harve Curry]

I was offered a original nickled S&W no. 3 revolver, , 44 Russian cal., 6 1/2" barrel, ivory stocks, US marked, with S&W letter confirming all signed by Roy Jinks, made and shipped in 1881.
I never owned one of thse or had the good fortune to even handle one. This one is close by to me. What do the experts think of them. Would it be a good investment peice? I think I could get it in the $2k range.

 

[Fisherman_48768]

There is one over on GB:This S&W new model #3 is mechanicly sound and the lock up is good. The inscription on the frame says WF&CO.EX which could mean Wells Fargo & Co. The inscription looks exactly the same as other confirmed Wells Fargo guns. This could be verified through Roy Jinks of S&W. The caliber is .44russian and although not tested could be a good shooter. The gun is solid as a rock. current bid250.00 Reserve Not Met Started at $0.01 buy now for $1,550.00. This is over in Ontario, Canada but you could get it imported for a few bucks and some paper work.

 

[Oro]

The value/price gap is quite wide and depends upon mechanical and finish condition and its originality. You would need to describe the condition much more thoroughly and then try to determine if the nickel is original or refinished, and the grips as well. Also, if the gun has been altered in any way.

A good place to get price comparisons is to go to the Old Town Station auction site and see what Nahas and Supica have sold these for in similar condition over the last few auctions. They will have nicely described and photographed examples and the prices realized. For a gun w/o any particular historical connection (like a Wells Fargo or other connection), $2000 would be fair for a "good" or better condition gun in original (unrefinished, with original stocks) condition.

You also need to know what you are looking at; there are dizzying variations on the "#3." Based on date and caliber, sounds like you have a First Model Russian - but the letter should make all that clear. I would also carefully measure the barrel correctly and compare it to the letter - 6.5" was not a standard production length, and examine it for evidence of alteration (this significantly alters value downward). The letter should also state what stocks it shipped with, wood or ivory. Sometimes this is not known, but usually it is.

I you post a few detailed photos of the gun and the wording of the letter (usually only the last paragraph or two address the gun in particular, the rest is general history of the model), you can get much, much better advice.

I am not an experienced collector of these, but I have been studying them in detail for about two years trying to find the one I want to buy. The one you are talking about could well be a great buy, but doing some homework and verifying everything is wise. You may also want to consider finding an antique gun dealer or expert near you (or within a couple of hours at any rate) and have him give you an opinion before buying - at $2k, $50 or $75 for an hour of appraisal time could be well worth it. The Jinks letter will tell you how it left the factory and where it went 125 years ago, but it takes an experienced eye to tell you what you have in front of you now.

 

[Old Fuff]

I would call Roy Jinks and confirm that letter. A ivory stocked/nickel plated No. 3 New Model with U.S. Markings seems like an odd combination, as this particular revolver was never adopted as a U.S. service pistol except by the Coast Guard. (Revenue Cutter Service) and those were purchased in the 1890's. After you get an answer we can discuss values

 

[Harve Curry]

I will pass on it.
If any of you want to PM me I'll give you the contact of the lawyer who is handling the estate. It belonged to a local man.
I thought it was an odd combination also, it was shipped to a east coast US Armory who's name I forget now.

As I can recall and IMO the nickle is very good,
yellow ivory smooth no chips a little shrinkage.
Mechanical very good. Rifling intact small pitting, not dark. You could use the firearm today.

 

[Old Fuff]

There is a hard and fast rule among Smith & Wesson collectors:

Never say never...

Almost anything is possible, but some things are improbable. If a fair amount of money is involve always be careful.

If the history of this revolver was confirmed, and it was indeed a U.S. government/military purchase, it would easily be worth five times the proposed selling price, but as it is a considerable gamble would be involved. Unless the attorney representing the seller will provide you with a copy of the documentation so that you can confirm what it says, I'd say you are wise in passing this gun up. If he will provide you with a copy(s) then you can determine that the letter did come from Smith & Wesson (in which case I would jump on the gun) or that the letter is a fake, in which case you might be able to stop a fraud.

Last but not least, even if the U.S. marking is faked, but the revolver is otherwise genuine it would still be a good buy at $2,000 or less. However if the letter itself is a fake, somebody is up to something so you'd have to worry about the gun itself.

 

[Harve Curry]

Again as I don't trust my memory, the U.S. was stamped into the heel of the butt.
The insp. initials A.E.? were confirmed/known to Roy Jinks in the letter.
I think it went to Massachusetts Armory. I was looking at a copy of the letter and the original goes with it.
I would have to go look again and it may be gone.

 

[Old Fuff]

Both Colt and Smith & Wesson usually shipped handguns purchased by the Army to its Springfield Armory, located in Springfield MA.

I don't find any government inspector with the stamp AE that was associated with Smith & Wesson. It could be CW (Charles Woodman) who inspected .45 Schofield revolvers, but that was in 1876-77, and the No.3 .44 New Model was introduced in 1878.

The U.S. government did order 280 nickel plated revolvers for the State of Maryland in 1878 within a serial number range running from 7,126 to 7,405. They had 6 1/2" barrels, checkered wood stocks, and were marked on the heel of the butt U.S. However the inspector was H.N. (Henry Nettleton) who is well known to Colt collectors. The revolver in question could be one of these, and if so would be worth 3 to 4 times that of an ordinary revolver of the same kind, and in the same condition. If it was one of these, the ivory stocks would almost be sure to be later replacements.

I think the seller owes potential buyers a lot more information then has been presented so far.