Saiga: Can I shoot 5.56 in my.223

[Highland Ranger]

Let me preface the question by saying that I understand the difference between .223 and 5.56 and the SAAMI position.

Since the Saiga receiver is stamped .223, what I am specifically looking for is some statement by the manufacturer that it is ok.

Intuitively, the gun is overbuilt for the 5.56, so although I might have issue with case extraction or the like, I don't think I'd be touching off a grenade . . . . but it doesn't hurt to check.

Note - tried to get the answer from the Saiga board as well but no joy so far, although it seems that a lot of guys are shooting 5.56: http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=31651&hl=

 

[aquapong]

Iirc, you can shoot .223 in 5.56x45, but not 5.56x45 in .223.

 

[wacki]

google for a metric converter. One is bigger than the other. Big things don't fit in small holes.

 

[chriso]

.223 into 5.56 fine 5.56 into .223 NOOO!!!

 

[MikePGS]

I've heard people claim that Saiga's are actually built for 5.56 and stamped .223... but I'd definitely look into it before using 5.56

 

[Vegas Silver]

I'm fairly positive that Saigas are actually 5.56. They're just stamped .223 for import reasonings. If you go to the Russian American Arms website, the Saiga is actually listed as the 5.56 (which uses the .223 cartridge).

Russian American Arms Company Link

 

[Lone_Gunman]

google for a metric converter. One is bigger than the other. Big things don't fit in small holes.

If you are talking about the projectiles, you are wrong.

If you are talking about overall length, or external case dimensions you are also wrong.

Could you please clarify what you mean?

 

[JImbothefiveth]

He may not have known 5.56x45 has the same dimensions as .223. (The difference is that 5.56 has higher pressures, so you can't fire it in a .223 gun)

 

[WardenWolf]

The Saiga .223 SHOULD be able to easily handle a 5.56 round. Everything about this gun is actually designed for the 7.62x39 round. The ONLY difference is that the barrel is bored out to 5.56mm instead of 7.62mm, and the bolt is slightly downsized. The outer diameter of both the barrel and chamber is the same, meaning the barrel actually has an outer wall almost as wide as the .223 bullet's diameter. It's overbuilt to hell.

It really all depends on the quality of the steel used in construction. Frankly, here's what I'd do: I'd try to get pressure ratings for both 5.56 and 7.62x39. If, as I suspect, the 7.62x39 has a significantly HIGHER pressure rating than the 5.56 round, you can assume the Saiga .223 can safely handle 5.56 because the chamber can handle 7.62 with significantly less material. I really don't see how 5.56 could even possibly damage this gun given what I know about it, but it's always better to be safe than sorry.

UPDATE: I just checked Izhmash's website to see if I could glean any information. The information they list regarding muzzle energy and muzzle velocity for the Saiga .223 is entirely consistent with the 5.56 NATO round, and varies significantly from the known statistics for .223. This means the gun is, in fact, designed and tested for the 5.56 round. This makes sense, because the Saiga is basically a civilian AK-101, a military AK designed for export, and chambered in 5.56 NATO. There is no reason Izhmash would change the existing design as it would be expensive and overcomplicate production. I believe we can safely conclude the gun is, in fact, designed for 5.56 NATO.

http://www.izhmash.ru/eng/product/saiga.shtml

 

[Curiousity]

Thanks Mike

 

[Onmilo]

My employer has sold oodles of Saiga rifles in .223
They function quite well with almost all .223/5.56 ammunition.
They are one of the few rifle designs that we have no problem suggesting steel case ammunition for use.

You will find the average Saiga rifle to be more accurate than the average AK/AKM rifle in assault rifle guise too.

 

[bubbaturbo]

Let me preface the question by saying that I understand the difference between .223 and 5.56 and the SAAMI position.

And then all this:

Iirc, you can shoot .223 in 5.56x45, but not 5.56x45 in .223.

google for a metric converter. One is bigger than the other. Big things don't fit in small holes.

HAHA but like everyone else said .223 into 5.56 fine 5.56 into .223 NOOO!!!

He may not have known 5.56x45 has the same dimensions as .223. (The difference is that 5.56 has higher pressures, so you can't fire it in a .223 gun)

Jeez.

 

[WardenWolf]

They are one of the few rifle designs that we have no problem suggesting steel case ammunition for use.

I wouldn't recomend steel case ammo still. I'd say it'll work fine, but I wouldn't recommend it because it'll still cause problems if you try to shoot brass without cleaning the chamber. In an SHTF situation, I want to be able to pick up any ammunition available.

 

[Vegas Silver]

It's a Russian gun. You can use that good old Russian steel cased ammo. It's an AK. Steel case ammo = not a problem. If you want to be able to shoot "any ammo available", then that's why you bought the Saiga/AK in the first place....

 

[Txhillbilly]

I have shot 5.56 & 223 ammo out of my Saiga and it doesn't care which it feeds on. Metal or brass doesn't matter,it just keeps spitting them out.

 

[railroader]

Actually I mainly run steel case ammo in my saiga 223. They tend to dent brass cases and the rifle throws the brass so far it can be hard to find if you are shooting outdoors. Mark

 

[Crosswire3]

My roommate just got a Saiga and it functions flawlessly on 5.56 as well as .223

 

[rangerruck]

In most rifles, say 40 years old or more, this may be a problem, but not in today 's rifles, especially , say, CZ rifles, and certainly not in an AK product. My saiga regularly asks me for more steel products, just to toughen up his teeth a bit more, so I comply.