Shotgun blasts into the air... threat to others?

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This seems to me to open up another line of questioning: I'm not a hunter, but I know good hunters are aware of what is behind their intended targets. How does this apply to squirrel hunters? Don't they shoot at targets in trees? Where do the misses go? How do squirrel hunters know what is downrange?

- - - Yoda
 
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Posted by Yoda: This seems to me to open up another line of questioning: I'm not a hunter, but I know good hunters are aware of what is behind their intended targets. How does this apply to squirrel hunter? Don't they shoot at targets in trees? Where do the misses go? How do squirrel hunters know what is downrange?
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for people using small shot on quail and so forth, or relatively small shot on squirrels in trees, the very low population density of the woods and fields--and a modicum of care--are key.

For people shooting rifles (or shotgun slugs, for that matter), they had better be aware of what is beyond the target.

And both need to know how close they are to roadways and occupied structures.

The same thing is true when using a firearm for self defense.
 
What goes up, must come down, and it will be accelerating as it does until it reaches terminal velocity, so the potential for serious damage is there
 
The sptizer bullet starts wit ha given amount of kinetic energy; part of it is dissipated by drag, but the greater part is converted into potential energy. On the way back down, and it will drop point first, the potential energy is converted back into kinetic energy, again limited somewhat by drag. And it will be very dangerous.

Whether is is fired straight up and stops or at a slight angle from the vertical and continues in a ballistic trajectory will make little difference.
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I disagree... if stabilized, in a ballistic arc, a spitzer is certainly dangerous and potentially lethal. Straight up, loss of stability, and falling unstabilized at its terminal velocity? Dangerous, but probably not lethal.

I hate to cite mythbusters as a source for scientific data, but they did a pretty good job on that one. YOu might want to look it up, if only for a fun watch.

For the record, birdshot is not dangerous (unless it hits you in the eye, as noted above) if fired up into the air. I've been peppered a few times. At close range? My grandfather lost an eye and his hearing to an ill-aimed birdshot blast at about 30 yards.
 
It´s amazing how much a difference it seems to make to physics
wether the birdshot is fired at birds or at the air. :confused:


If it´s ok to discharge a shotgun during birdhunting, then it is in any other scenario.

(Wether a warning shot is legal or makes sense, is a local or individual question.)
 
Only if you were looking up & it hit you in the eye................Used to hunt Ducks & Geese on a field with several guys on all four sides, would get shot rained on us all the time, never seen any one get hurt...............
 
Posted by Mp7: If it´s ok to discharge a shotgun during birdhunting, then it is in any other scenario.
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Come now!

It is lawful to discharge a shotgun during bird hunting in many areas, during the season, and usually with a license.

It is lawful to discharge a shotgun during the hunting of other game during the season, with a license, in proper areas.

It is lawful to discharge a shotgun in proper facilites or areas for skeet, trap, sporting clays, or patterning the gun--regardless of season.

It is lawful to discharge a shotgun in lawful self defense, anywhere, regardless of season.

It is not lawful to discharge a firearm for any purpose other than lawful self defense in many areas.

It is not lawful to discharge a shotgun in the commission of a felony.

It is not lawful to discharge a shotgun to warn other people unless deadly force is justified.

(Wether a warning shot is legal or makes sense, is a local or individual question.)
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Well, no, the use of force laws are not local.

Nor is compliance an individual option.
 
Depends on the load.

Slugs are one of the more dangerous rounds that can be fired into the air.
Shotguns also being very common make them one of the bigger risks.
Even more dangerous than many high power rifles. This is because of the mass of the projectile, and also the fact that they are made to fly mass forward so won't tumble unstabilized on the way down.
They come down with a lot more energy even at just the velocity imparted by gravity.
While a light weight rifle projectiles depend primarily on velocity for energy, and then don't return with very much velocity behind the light weight projectile, and typicall tumble back down slowing them even further if fired straight up.
Most projectiles are dangerous fired in an arc but even a slug is dangerous fired straight up because just the speed of gravity with that dense chunk of lead can pose a danger.



Buckshot poses less risk but is still not safe. Warning shots fired are also often in the direction of the individual. Even at a 45 degree angle into the air in the direction of the looters being warned means that shot was not fired straight up, and will be coming down someplace in that direction with a good amount of retained velocity and energy.
That would be even more true of pistol or rifle rounds fired at an angle. Into the air is not the same as straight up, and into the air at an angle means they hit something down range with force.



Small birdshot poses little risk, losing velocity very fast. However it still poses a risk to eyes. That should not be too readily dismissed considering many of the times people choose to go out and fire into the air are during celebrations like New Year's and the 4th of July when many are outside with thier eyes to the sky watching fireworks or the stars. Someone looking up that gets birdshot at a couple hundred feet per second in the eye could have a serious injury.

People mention hunting with birdshot being fired in the air. This is true, but typically in very sparse areas a minimum legal distance from roads and structures, and due to the low mass and unaerodynamic shape the shot does not go that far from the shooter. This means it is primarily people at close ranges that know they are out in the woods with shooters or at a shooting range and who either shield thier eyes or are wearing eye protection who are exposed.
That is very different from say a neighbor in a suburb firing up in the air with shot raining down randomly several hundred yards around them.



Finally a big risk goes beyond the actual risk the shooter themselves poses in situations like celebratory gunfire.
While some may choose to go research the safest projectile to be shooting in the air, the ignorant individual or multiple individuals down the street you inspire to get thier gun and join you or participate next time who otherwise would not have can be much more dangerous.
To them someone else is shooting in the air, it seems like fun, they want to do it too. They see you not getting into trouble for it, and they are emboldened to do it then or next time.
So when they go out and start firing thier 230 grain .45s into the air, making even less noise and boom than your 12 gauge with birdshot, they think they are doing even less than you are.
Additionally the slight angle difference between straight up and at an arc that retains a good portion of original energy can be slight. Especially when talking about someone intoxicated rapid firing with recoil changing the angle the gun is being fired at from shot to shot.
They may also not even know the major difference between firing straight up and at an angle and the significantly different dangers posed.

Now sure you can claim to have no responsibility for thier actions, but indirectly you may have just helped someone get injured or killed that would not have by inspiring multiple ignorant people to join you in the fun of shooting into the air.
 
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One Other Thing...

By the way, we had a thread not too long ago about someone who was charged criminally after firing a warning shot into the ground.

It was deemed unlawful, but it is also very dangerous, though I had not been ware of that. had never been really aware of the danger.

Hoever, at my range, high powered rifle bullets that impact the gound ahead of the berm have been known to emerge and leave the property.
 
Hoever, at my range, high powered rifle bullets that impact the gound ahead of the berm have been known to emerge and leave the property.
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Not just rifle, pistol as well. I was shooting and some shots were angled a little downward as my targets were on a realtor sign. Some were skipping over the berm - which was only a few yards behind the targets and 12 feet high; and I was shooting into soft sand to boot
 
I read an article on the dangers of shooting into the air in a gun magazine a while back. Apparently the safest place to get hit is near where the shot is fired because when a bullet is falling straight down it will not surpass terminal velocity. The only remaining factor is the weight of the bullet. Birdshot is harmless but something like a 500 grain musket ball could really hurt. People who get killed by falling bullets are almost always far enough away that the bullet is traveling in an arc and still has some of its forward momentum. Ever notice that in stories where people are killed by stray bullets that no one ever hears the shot? This is because it was lobbed in from a mile or more away. Mythbusters did an episode on this subject. It should be on YouTube.
 
Back to the original question: if bird shot fired into the air were very dangerous, bird hunting would have been outlawed in most places years ago.
 
Getting peppered/rained on can be a startling experience when getting hit in the teeth.. lips.. ears or eyes.

Wear a good pair of shooting glasses.
 
"Falling" anything still must obey Newton's Laws ! I.e. a free falling object accelerates at 32 ft/sec/sec until it reaches its terminal velocity- a speed at which atmospheric drag equals acceleration.

Impact energy from any projected/falling object is defined as 1/2 M X V squared . Individual shot - being both of low mass and spherical, hence "high drag" configuration - terminal velocity is low as, ( due to its low mass) its impact energy. In practical application this means small shot quickly loses its velocity and becomes essentially harmless beyond a calculable point.

OTOH shaped projectiles, like rifle bullets, exhibit different behaviors while obeying the same laws . >MW
 
back in the 60's-70's it was no big deal to shoot straight up in the air and see how close you could make the shot come down around you. We had all had guns all our lives and the idea of danger never came into it. Too much worry about nothing.
 
So you knowingly shot into an area where there are people? I don't care if they're crashing your party or not, that is so incredibly irresponsible and dangerous, you should be ashamed of yourself. Karma is a bitch my friend, and you'll meet her bad side one day.
 
Since folk in the vicinity of the mentioned warning shot aren't likely to be wearing hats and safety glasses I'd say yes, it's a threat to others.
 
@Kleanbore

my post was concerning the OP Q. It's only
about physics and common sense. Not law.
 
While shooting into the air as a warning shot may not be dangerous if using birdshot. It is still stupid. The persons fleeing, don't know it was fired into the air and not at them. You can, and probably will be charged just the same as if you did fire at them and missed.

If the person fleeing is in a car and have an accident while fleeing after being shot at then you will be partially responsable for any damages or injuries because of that accident. If not legally, certainly in a civil suit.

I wouldn't advise it.
 
About the squirrel hunting thing. I often use a .22 rifle to hunt them. I simply move so any misses go into the tree around the squirrel. No shooting squirrels hanging on the side of a tree. Move so the trunk is your backstop.
 
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