Sighting-in deficiency?

[zminer]

I am new to gun ownership, having purchased a Ruger 10/22, and just recently got a scope put onto it. When I had the scope put on, the guy who was doing it put it on backwards at first, and it took another person in the shop to point it out to him. So, I am less than confident that he knew what he was doing when he installed it.

I had further doubts when I took the rifle out today to sight it in and found I couldn't hit a thing with it. I put up two targets - one above the other - and found myself hitting close to bullseyes on the lower target ... while aiming at the one above. I tried to adjust the elevation controls, but found that I "ran out" of clicks for adjustment well before I would have been able to make up the foot or so of distance between the spot where I aimed and the place my shots were hitting.

The problems got worse when I moved the targets from 25 yards to 50 yards. As far as I could tell, I wasn't hitting the target at all, though I later discovered I might have been hitting very low (like, two or three feet low).

Is it possible that the guy just totally screwed up my scope installation, and that's what's causing the problem? Scope and gun are both brand new, so that doesn't seem like it can be the problem.

My plan is to go back to the gun shop tomorrow, with my receipt for the installation, tell them about the problem, and see if they'll take a look at it for free. Does anyone else have any suggestions, or has this sort of thing happened to you before?

 

[cracked butt]

Is it possible that the guy just totally screwed up my scope installation,

Absolutely. If the guy put the scope on backwards to start with, he's not qualified to work on guns.


First check to make sure the scope is mounted in the correst orientation- the elevation turret will be pointing up and the windage will be pointing 90 degrees to the right of the bore axis.

Check the rings- are they identical? It could be possible that the the 'gunsmith' grabbed two different height or different brands of rings off the shelf and installed them- if that's the case, someone else who had a scope installed on the same day is going to be unhappy as well.


Check the way the rings are mounted to the receiver. Most rimfires have a 3/8" rail that the rings attach to. Check that the rings are solidly in the grooves and not installed cockeyed. If all else fails, remove the rings from the mount and make sure that the scope rail screws are in tin all the way, tight and not crossthreaded.

 

[Shawnee]

Been a long time since I had a 10/22 but the rings might need to be different heights. If that is the case, the person who mounted the scope may have just reversed them - that is - putting the one that should be on the front - on the back etc.

Hopefully someone who currently owns a 10/22 can come along and give you the facts. If you got a manual with your rifle it may have some info about scope mounting for you too.

Good luck! And stay tuned... this bunch will get you up and running !

 

[zminer]

First check to make sure the scope is mounted in the correst orientation- the elevation turret will be pointing up and the windage will be pointing 90 degrees to the right of the bore axis.

This seems to be in order.

Check the rings- are they identical?

They are identical - the notation on the side says that they are both 1" Weaver rings.

Most rimfires have a 3/8" rail that the rings attach to.

I actually provided them with the rail that came with the gun when I bought it, so it is installed on a rail.

Check that the rings are solidly in the grooves and not installed cockeyed.

The rings seem to be installed tightly, but what I *did* notice is that the whole scope seems to be slightly off-level, probably because the front end of the scope is resting on the folded-down rear sight. I don't even know if it is supposed to be that way or not, but it looks like it's tilted slightly upwards, which would lead to the low shooting I described.

Some pictures of the current setup:

 

[cracked butt]

You don't want the scope bell contacting the rear sight. You'll probably need to remove the scope and drift the rear sight out of its dovetail.

 

[Titan6]

I am new to gun ownership,

This is wonderful, welcome aboard!

having purchased a Ruger 10/22,

Very good first choice.

When I had the scope put on, the guy who was doing it put it on backwards at first, and it took another person in the shop to point it out to him. So, I am less than confident that he knew what he was doing when he installed it.

This is understandable. It is pretty uncommon for someone who knows what they are doing to make this mistake (although it happens). Just as the guy sold you your car might not know how to change oil, the guy who sold you a gun might not know which end the bullets come out of (although both them probably talked a good game).

I tried to adjust the elevation controls, but found that I "ran out" of clicks for adjustment well before I would have been able to make up the foot or so of distance between the spot where I aimed and the place my shots were hitting.

Is it possible that the guy just totally screwed up my scope installation, and that's what's causing the problem? Scope and gun are both brand new, so that doesn't seem like it can be the problem.

He did. The knife site needs to be removed if the scope is contacting it. Point your hand with your fingers outstretched at a target. Keeping your fingers outstretched and your pointing finger pointing straight at your target shove a pencil in between it an your other fingers. See how your other fingers go down? This is your problem.

My plan is to go back to the gun shop tomorrow, with my receipt for the installation, tell them about the problem, and see if they'll take a look at it for free. Does anyone else have any suggestions, or has this sort of thing happened to you before?

Sounds like a great idea. You need to also make sure your scope is small enough that it is not contacting any other part of the gun other than the rings. If contacts anything other than the rings it is not installed correctly or is not the right size.

Alternatively you could get taller rings, but this would raise the profile of the rifle. If you don't mind for what purpose did you buy the rifle?

 

[zminer]

You don't want the scope bell contacting the rear sight. You'll probably need to remove the scope and drift the rear sight out of its dovetail.

You need to also make sure your scope is small enough that it is not contacting any other part of the gun other than the rings. If contacts anything other than the rings it is not installed correctly or is not the right size.

Thanks for this advice - I'll see what can be done about this. I'll probably head back to the shop in a little while. It'll be slow during the day, I bet, so they probably won't have a problem with my asking for some free help (since it's in regards to fixing a problem they created initially!).

If you don't mind for what purpose did you buy the rifle?

I bought it as a way to try out shooting as a sport without having to spend a lot of money up front, in case it turned out that I don't like it. No worries, though - even with the scope problem, I had a lot of fun at the range yesterday.

 

[rcmodel]

but what I *did* notice is that the whole scope seems to be slightly off-level, probably because the front end of the scope is resting on the folded-down rear sight.

If the scope tube bell is contacting the rear sight hard enough to flex the scope tube you may have bigger problems then just not being able to sight it in.

In all likelyhood, the scope itself has now been damaged internally and will fail at some point in the future.

I would ask for a new replacement scope if it were my new scope & rifle!

rcmodel

 

[Titan6]

In all likelyhood, the scope itself has now been damaged internally and will fail at some point in the future.

It is possible. The rifle is a .22 so I think it is unlikely. I don't think you will be able to convince the shop owner of this unless the scope actually fails. But I would certainly make a point of it when I went back there.

I bought it as a way to try out shooting as a sport without having to spend a lot of money up front, in case it turned out that I don't like it. No worries, though - even with the scope problem, I had a lot of fun at the range yesterday.

10/22 are fun to shoot and easy to build on. These are good guns to learn on and work up to something larger if you grow into the sport.

 

[foghornl]

I like big optics too, but that one seems ahhhhh well a bit "Large" for a 10/22. Your rifle, though, so install what YOU like.

I have a fixed 4X32 scope on my 10/22,and that is certainly big enough for what I want. As others have mentioned, the front 'bell' of the scope should not be touching the sights. That could be distoring the tube of the scope, throwing things off.

I can't tell from your pix, but if that is say a 3-9X40 scope, you may need to 'downsize' just a bit, or go to taller rings.

Just My Humble Opinion here, but the shop should not have sent that rifle out with the scope touching the sight.

 

[hksw]

Oh cripes.



Welcome aboard.

Installing the scope base onto a 10/22 and mounting the scope and rings is realtively easy. Might I suggest you give it a try yourself. You certainly cannot do worse than the installer you employed.

 

[Art Eatman]

From the pictures, and the "shooting low" commentary, I'd guess the scope is tilted a bit upward by the front sight. It doesn't take much. A higher base would be needed if I'm correct in my guess.

If a thicker single-base isn't available, two individual bases of taller height certainly would be.

 

[cracked butt]

I can't tell from your pix, but if that is say a 3-9X40 scope, you may need to 'downsize' just a bit, or go to taller rings

I have to agree about the scope a bit. Unless the scope was designed for rimfires, you might end up with some nagging parallex problems- the cross hairs might move about on a target as you shift your head, with most scopes, this problem diminishes past 200 yards, but rimfire scopes ar edesigned to be parallex-free at much shorter ranges.

 

[zminer]

Thanks for all the replies - the information is helpful.

The gun:

I took it back to the gun shop today and the gentleman there (different from the guy who installed it wrong) expressed the view that the person who installed it had done a poor job. He offered to fix it for me by removing the rear sight, but he found that the shop had no tools that he could use to do so. He said he doesn't normally work at that store, and he was annoyed that there was nothing he could use, even after looking through various cabinets, work areas, and asking another employee. So, he told me how to do it myself, and also recommended another shop in the area that could do it for me. I'm kind of annoyed, and I don't think I'll be going back there for any future purchases. It isn't that guy's fault that management is incompetent, but it doesn't make me want to spend any more money there either.

The scope:

I purchased the scope on the recommendation of yet another gun shop employee, after telling him what I planned to use it for (10/22, target shooting, usually at about 50 - 100 yards). He recommended the one that I bought because it was on special and came with a spotting scope. At the time I simply trusted him, since he knew what I wanted it for and recommended this one in particular. I hope he wasn't leading me astray and giving me something too "big" - I guess we'll see once I finally get it so that it can hit anything at all.

 

[zminer]

Final update (I hope):

Initially I tried tapping out the dovetailed rear sight with a small brass hammer I have, but I could tell the sight wasn't moving and it looked like it was starting to damage the finish on the sight, even though I was tapping relatively lightly. So, I switched to the other tactic the gun store employee mentioned today - tapping out the pin that holds the sight on, rather than the whole sight.

And it worked! I used a nail to push out the pin partway, then pulled it out the rest of the way with needle-nosed pliers, keeping the pin and the sight together for later, in case I want to put it back on for any reason. I remounted the scope - ensuring that it was tightly locked into the rail - and it sits only a few millimeters above the base of the sight, but it does clear it, and that's all I need. Now the problem is how to find time to go to the range to see if it actually works any better.

 

[tnieto2004]

Lets us know how she shoots now .. Hope everything works better than before!

 

[WNTFW]

ZMiner,
Go back to rcmodel's post & take heed, he has given spot on advice in every post I've seen by him.
I would leave the Iron sight there & get the proper rings. Read the scope directions - I hear a lot of misinformation handed out on scopes. The range & gunstore can be a bad place for info sometimes. Height over bore is not the worst thing in the world.
I would center up the crosshairs, square it to gun & boresight it, then make the final adjustments after shooting. It depends on if the rings are adjustable for windages also. Millet makes some affordable rings for a .22 that I had good luck with that are windage adjustable & come in several heights. Also focus the scope on the blue sky til you see the crosshairs the best. This may require to look at the crosshairs then look away, then look back, etc. otherwise you eye will compensate causing fatigue in the long run . . .
Don't take my word though - read the directions.

Basically do it yourself - you will want to know sooner or later so might as well start now.
At least .22 is cheap so a few more shots to zero won't break you.
I hope you have as much as I do with the .22
Later,
WNTFW