I am considering buying a shotgun for trap & skeet shooting and have been looking at the Remington 11-87 and the Beretta A391. The range I go to is "pushing" the Beretta. Does anyone have any thoughts about the pros and cons of each shotgun to help me decide? I went to a shotgun site and they recommended the Beretta in thie reviews. Thanks.
Skeet & Trap Shooting
- Thread starter giles
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Dave McCracken
Moderator In Memoriam
By and large, the new Berettas are considered the most durable autos out there. The stock wedges and so on are nice accessories also, and they're standard on 391s.
Some downsides, tho. Beretta triggers are heavy and not clean. The stocks are off spec for US shooters, IOW they're not what we're used to. To me, they feel a bit clubby. Lots of folks may differ, I see lots of Berettas in the hands of high volume shooters and not so many Remington gas guns....
Note, trap guns shoot trap well and the other sports not so well. Skeet and Sporting clay shooters like a pattern oft hitting half above and half below POA,. Trap shooters like their patterns hitting higher, up to all of it over POA.
I do OK with a 60-40 for everything, including wingshooting, but YMMV.
HTH....
Some downsides, tho. Beretta triggers are heavy and not clean. The stocks are off spec for US shooters, IOW they're not what we're used to. To me, they feel a bit clubby. Lots of folks may differ, I see lots of Berettas in the hands of high volume shooters and not so many Remington gas guns....
Note, trap guns shoot trap well and the other sports not so well. Skeet and Sporting clay shooters like a pattern oft hitting half above and half below POA,. Trap shooters like their patterns hitting higher, up to all of it over POA.
I do OK with a 60-40 for everything, including wingshooting, but YMMV.
HTH....
The Beretta is far and away a better gun. I, like Dave, prefer a gun that shoots a little high for everything I do with a shotgun so a trap model or stock shimmed for a high shooting gun would be preferred by me. Another gun to consider is the Winchester SuperX2, if it fits you they are great guns. I have owned 11-87's in the past and do not own any now, they just did not work well.
bamf
Member
A friend of mine has a 1187, he said it never had problem with it when he went hunting with it, he had for almost 10 year...but after we started doing some intense clay shooting after few weeks of that it started to have some serious reliability problems and eventually it started jam really badly. To the point it was unusable and he had to have it sent to the smith.
The guys I see routinely at the clay fields with auto's are either Browning Golds or Berettas. On occasion, though there will be a Rem 1100.
My advice is to see if you can try them out at your range and find which you like best.
The guys I see routinely at the clay fields with auto's are either Browning Golds or Berettas. On occasion, though there will be a Rem 1100.
My advice is to see if you can try them out at your range and find which you like best.
Remington's Reading Room has links at the bottom to pages on Skeet and Trap Shooting Fundamentals. It's a good place to start, complete with pictures.
Dave McCracken
Moderator In Memoriam
Thanks, Riverdog.
Steve, besides that resource friend Riverdog posted, the Clay Target Handbook by Jerry Meyer will answer most questions about ANY clay game. That'll save me 30 minutes of typing...
Steve, besides that resource friend Riverdog posted, the Clay Target Handbook by Jerry Meyer will answer most questions about ANY clay game. That'll save me 30 minutes of typing...
ysr_racer
Member
>>What is the difference between Trap and Skeet? (and Clays)
That's easy. Trap is for OLD men, skeet is for OLD ladies and sporting clays is for real men that want to shoot a fun and challenging course that's always changing.
That's easy. Trap is for OLD men, skeet is for OLD ladies and sporting clays is for real men that want to shoot a fun and challenging course that's always changing.
Dave McCracken
Moderator In Memoriam
Actually, real men shoot any #$%^&* thing they want to, including trap,skeet,SC, wobble, bunker, chinese trap,Practical, 3 gun, and landfill rats.
There is darn little done with a shotgun that isn't fun. Do it all....
There is darn little done with a shotgun that isn't fun. Do it all....
"Golf with a shotgun."
Under the California Sporting Clays Association their motto seems to be "Golf with a shotgun."
That just about says it all
Under the California Sporting Clays Association their motto seems to be "Golf with a shotgun."
That just about says it all
Giles
I would wholeheartedly recommend the Beretta over the remington. Beretta's focus and experience in this area is much greater than Remington's. I in no way mean Remington any disrespect, it would be their weapon had you asked about a HD weapon. However they cannot compete with Beretta in the clay games dept. Good luck Craig
PS. ysr-racer... when your card reads AA27AA get back to me with your opinions, until then hide in the bushes of the sporting clays range.
I would wholeheartedly recommend the Beretta over the remington. Beretta's focus and experience in this area is much greater than Remington's. I in no way mean Remington any disrespect, it would be their weapon had you asked about a HD weapon. However they cannot compete with Beretta in the clay games dept. Good luck Craig
PS. ysr-racer... when your card reads AA27AA get back to me with your opinions, until then hide in the bushes of the sporting clays range.
bamf
Member
Yeah I've done that...in my dreams!
50,000 dollars and 50,000 rounds later, I'll get there, maybe
jonesjj
Member
I have just recently bought a Win super X2 and have little over 400 rounds through it the 2 times I have been out shooting trap with it and I like it.
Not one flaw yet and I reload for trap so my rounds are not hot at all. I like the fit and feel of the X2 over the Rem 11-87 and the Beretta 391 sporting.
I have had a chance to shoot trap with each one of them, the price was right too. Gander montain had them on clearance for $599.00 then they took off another $50.00 and there was a rebate from Win for another $50.00 so for $499.00 couldnt go wrong.
I wouldn't trade my X2 for either one of them now, If I did it would be to sell it, make some money and go buy another X2.
Just my .02
Jeff
Not one flaw yet and I reload for trap so my rounds are not hot at all. I like the fit and feel of the X2 over the Rem 11-87 and the Beretta 391 sporting.
I have had a chance to shoot trap with each one of them, the price was right too. Gander montain had them on clearance for $599.00 then they took off another $50.00 and there was a rebate from Win for another $50.00 so for $499.00 couldnt go wrong.
I wouldn't trade my X2 for either one of them now, If I did it would be to sell it, make some money and go buy another X2.
Just my .02
Jeff
sm
member
I recommend a shotgun that fits the shooter first off. I would try various makes , even others not mentioned first. Club members should be happy to let you try.
Though 1100's and 11-87's were popular at my club at one time...they don't fit me. The Beretta were closer...and eventually proved more dependable( model 303' s and go forward from there). Me I shot/shoot a Win Super X model 1 mfg in 1974. Fit me to a Tee, had Nu-Line install chokes, and this is still my "all around go-to gun".
Yep caught flap for not being trendy...however for many years I put over 12K rds a year through it, took trophies, $ and game from doves, ducks and deer.
Never really been one to conform I guess, gun fit and hitting more priority to ME.
Though 1100's and 11-87's were popular at my club at one time...they don't fit me. The Beretta were closer...and eventually proved more dependable( model 303' s and go forward from there). Me I shot/shoot a Win Super X model 1 mfg in 1974. Fit me to a Tee, had Nu-Line install chokes, and this is still my "all around go-to gun".
Yep caught flap for not being trendy...however for many years I put over 12K rds a year through it, took trophies, $ and game from doves, ducks and deer.
Never really been one to conform I guess, gun fit and hitting more priority to ME.
jonesjj
Member
Howard,
contact me off forum at [email protected] I lost yours to and would like to chat with you also.
Jeff
contact me off forum at [email protected] I lost yours to and would like to chat with you also.
Jeff
jonesjj
Member
re1973,
you said it all right there "gun fit and hitting more priority to ME"
one more thing also, what ever you chose be able to function reliably with what ever load/loads you will be using.
you said it all right there "gun fit and hitting more priority to ME"
one more thing also, what ever you chose be able to function reliably with what ever load/loads you will be using.
sm
member
I think what killed the SX 1 was the fact it was/is a machined gun.
The 1100 was stamped and sold for less. SX1 became a victim of money and marketing. Can't recall the fellows name that designed it, but he DID NOT want to use the "O" ring. Powers that be said "the boys in green are , we want one to" --perception of the buyer. Same fellow didthe Browning Gold and SX2 , designer basically said why re-invent the wheel...used the positive attributes from Win, and Browning.
Weight, I actually like the weight...the way it is distributed...for me it swings very well. Besides I need all the help I can get...you know the 5 things your supposed to do at the same time ...I was REAL good at stopping a swing
The 1100 was stamped and sold for less. SX1 became a victim of money and marketing. Can't recall the fellows name that designed it, but he DID NOT want to use the "O" ring. Powers that be said "the boys in green are , we want one to" --perception of the buyer. Same fellow didthe Browning Gold and SX2 , designer basically said why re-invent the wheel...used the positive attributes from Win, and Browning.
Weight, I actually like the weight...the way it is distributed...for me it swings very well. Besides I need all the help I can get...you know the 5 things your supposed to do at the same time ...I was REAL good at stopping a swing
ArMa
Member
I bought a Winchester Super X2 last year and its soo reliable I cant believe it, its perfect for my trap shooting, skeet shooting, and its a universal bird gun since its chambered in 31/2 you can shoot just about anything... great gun if I could do it over I'd still get the X2
ArMa, I have been singing that song for 3 years!!! Truly a great gun.
1973, if you would be so kind as to allow me, I will stick with weight as the thing that kept the SuperX1 from ruling the shotgun world. Most will pay a little more for a machined and fitted shotgun of higher quality, and the X1 was definately that. The dove and pheasant hunters, and hardcore target shooters not wanting the weight is my theory.
I agree that the SX1 moves REALLY well, I shoot them well for sure.
1973, if you would be so kind as to allow me, I will stick with weight as the thing that kept the SuperX1 from ruling the shotgun world. Most will pay a little more for a machined and fitted shotgun of higher quality, and the X1 was definately that. The dove and pheasant hunters, and hardcore target shooters not wanting the weight is my theory.
I agree that the SX1 moves REALLY well, I shoot them well for sure.
sm
member
HSMITH
Not offended at all. I in fact learn from everyone.
I think we agree and both make a valid point often overlooked. Weight is important, more important perhaps is where is that weight . We, and others have stressed gun fit, to me this includes the 'balance' --is the weight b/t hands, a bit forward...etc.
In my case my particular SX1(field version) with 28" bbl fit me and the balance/weight a bit forward( I preferred ). My partner OTOH had the 2 bbl set SX1 (trap skeet) respectfully 26" and 30" bbls. His gun had beautiful wood and fit...however the balance was a bit more between the hands...even when I put my28" bbl on his gun. With the trap bbl it did swing better. Noted this on comparison of what few of these two versions of SX1's being used at the time.
Differences in balance and weight, density of wood...etc. b/t same makes and models. Just sometimes "it feels right and fits right".
SX2's are very very nice, fit me well, and I shoot them well...If going to buy a new semi--definitley go with the SX2.
the old Beretta 303 was another I liked and if the SX1 wasn't avail at that time I would have probably gone with. SX1 just a better fit to ME. Something about blue, wood and machined tho'.
Not offended at all. I in fact learn from everyone.
I think we agree and both make a valid point often overlooked. Weight is important, more important perhaps is where is that weight . We, and others have stressed gun fit, to me this includes the 'balance' --is the weight b/t hands, a bit forward...etc.
In my case my particular SX1(field version) with 28" bbl fit me and the balance/weight a bit forward( I preferred ). My partner OTOH had the 2 bbl set SX1 (trap skeet) respectfully 26" and 30" bbls. His gun had beautiful wood and fit...however the balance was a bit more between the hands...even when I put my28" bbl on his gun. With the trap bbl it did swing better. Noted this on comparison of what few of these two versions of SX1's being used at the time.
Differences in balance and weight, density of wood...etc. b/t same makes and models. Just sometimes "it feels right and fits right".
SX2's are very very nice, fit me well, and I shoot them well...If going to buy a new semi--definitley go with the SX2.
the old Beretta 303 was another I liked and if the SX1 wasn't avail at that time I would have probably gone with. SX1 just a better fit to ME. Something about blue, wood and machined tho'.
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