Smith and Wesson Model 19 or Colt Python

[rs525]

Is it better to get an old 4 inch Smith and Wesson Model 19 or an old 4 inch Colt Python, or get both? Will be shooting gun at a range, not for locking up in a safe. I do LOVE the looks of the Python but think the 19 may be more practical. I should also stress funds are an issue.

 

[Targa]

If get both is an option I don’t see the dilemma…

 

[earlthegoat2]

Maybe consider a 686 in there as well….and that would be my vote.

If that is cheating then I’d go with the 19.

 

[UncleEd]

Different handgun categories.

Question should be Smith & Wesson
Models 586 or 686 vs Colt Python.

And if you mean pre-1980 it should
be Model 27/28 vs Python.

 

[Rodfac]

If you're a shooter, I'd go with a Model 19, just for parts availability etc. vs. one of the Colt Pythons as produced a decade or two ago. Parts and even gunsmiths who can work on those old Colt classics are scarce. While I've never owned a Python, I did have one on loan from a friend for the better part of six months and came to like it, but never found it to be better than my 1970 vintage 6" M-19 Smith. The Colt had as good a SA trigger, but came out 2nd best in DA fire. Accuracy was about equal, both being 6" bbl'd guns.

The full lugged barrels do make for a muzzle heavy gun, and add add'l weight on the gun belt...both attributes that don't appeal to me. But the "L" frame Smiths do stand up to full house magnum firing better than the "K" series M-19 or M-66's. I carry mine a lot (M-19 & M-66), and the weight factor is a deal breaker for me with 4" bbl's. For range use, the full lugs might make more sense however.

The new Pythons are a better shooting gun, I think, tho the asking prices are out of sight IMHO. Again, I think a M-19 is a better value, especially one of the pre-lock variations. HTH's Rod

 

[J-Bar]

I have owned both. I still have the 19.

 

[DM~]

I have owned both. I still have the 19.

ME too.

DM

 

[Paul7]

I do have to comment on those who say the Python is delicate and can't handle too many .357s, yes that can happen but the exact same is true of the Model 19. I recently bought one on GB and immediately had to take it to my local gunsmith to be retimed, etc., the seller paid for the repair. The 19 is very nice, but it is no Python.

 

[Lnf Crzr]

ME too.

DM

Same - benched and smith was more accurate at 25 yards off sandbags. I still have S&W, and more

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

The M19 is better thought of as a .38 with the capability to be carried and shot with .357s in a pinch. Cracked forcing cones were a thing when the guns were subjected to lots of 110 and 125gr Magnum loads.

A vintage Python is, of course, 2-4 times the $$ of a clean 19, but is a beefier gun better suited to Magnums, however high-mileage examples can have timing issues due to normal wear and tear. . At this point, they are probably better kept as safe queens taken out occasionally for a few light plinking loads.

The correct answer is-

S&W 686. All the good looks of the Python at half the price and built to handle large volumes of hot .357s.

Of course, there is a current production Python that was supposedly designed to have better wear properties than the old model, and a "new and improved" M19 without the barrel cracking issues- though neither of these has the gorgeous finish of their classic forbearers......

 

[Lnf Crzr]

I Believe the Python was Designed to be a 38spl and was changed to 357 just prior to production. Delicate in my experience. A 686 far superior in my opinion. For whatever that’s worth.

 

[rs525]

Thanks for all the replies so far. Right now, it seems I'll have to forgo the Python since I'm not made of money. It is a beauty of a gun, but damn those prices. Also I do not intend to carry either one, both too big. If I had to carry a .357, it would probably be a S&W Model 13 3 inch, but those things have become scarcer then hen's teeth.

 

[Lnf Crzr]

Yep, Carried mine today and took it to the range.

 

[rs525]

Yep, Carried mine today and took it to the range.View attachment 1045046

Sweet! Those old Smiths are just badass looking.

 

[AzShooter1]

Good decision. If you have the case buy both but if not you'd be better off with the Smith. The 19 will last forever, just don't run 124 - 5 grain bullets out of it. The forcing cone is not meant for the pressure of these heavy loaded light bullets.

If you are going to shoot light weight bullets at magnum pressures go with an L-frame.

The 13 is a great gun and if that's what you settled on you did great.

 

[Lnf Crzr]

I’m cautious with the 13. No need to shoot full house Mags all the time. Hot 38 equivalent shoot fine and is fun. Occasionally some hotter 357s.

There is a reason the K frame 357 is considered one of the best Handguns ever made. Just don’t shoot the Hot 125s out of it and ita last ya.

 

[rs525]

I actually intend to eventually acquire a Model 10, a Model 15, a Model 13 and a Model 19 because I've always wanted the old K frames.

 

[rs525]

I’m cautious with the 13. No need to shoot full house Mags all the time. Hot 38 equivalent shoot fine and is fun. Occasionally some hotter 357s.

There is a reason the K frame 357 is considered one of the best Handguns ever made. Just don’t shoot the Hot 125s out of it and ita last ya.

I have no intention to do so. Never shot .357 (only .38) but I would assume 125 grains are also more snappy with recoil.

 

[Lnf Crzr]

Have a 10, Had a 15, Got the 13 and had a 66.

They are Very nice. I would take my old Model 10-6 Hb Up against a Python any Day of the Week and twice on Sunday. Old Design that was improved on over a very very long time. Sold the Python - Wasn’t that great, In my opinion.

 

[entropy]

The M19 is better thought of as a .38 with the capability to be carried and shot with .357s in a pinch. Cracked forcing cones were a thing when the guns were subjected to lots of 110 and 125gr Magnum loads.

A vintage Python is, of course, 2-4 times the $$ of a clean 19, but is a beefier gun better suited to Magnums, however high-mileage examples can have timing issues due to normal wear and tear. . At this point, they are probably better kept as safe queens taken out occasionally for a few light plinking loads.

The correct answer is-
View attachment 1045040
S&W 686. All the good looks of the Python at half the price and built to handle large volumes of hot .357s.

Of course, there is a current production Python that was supposedly designed to have better wear properties than the old model, and a "new and improved" M19 without the barrel cracking issues- though neither of these has the gorgeous finish of their classic forbearers......

I've owned both, (and love both models to this day) but if I was buying a Shooter Vs. BBQ gun, the question should be; 586 or Trooper? Can't go wrong either way.

 

[P5 Guy]

Does S&W still make blued firearms ?

 

[wcwhitey]

Does S&W still make blued firearms ?

They make the 19 and 29 in their Classic line, they do have the “lock” however.

I guess it all depends on what you plan to do with the revolver. For a dedicated range and carry gun it’s hard to justify a Pythons price, for a BBQ gun maybe. A great gun but Colt has had quality issues same as any company. I have seen quite a few Pythons needing attention. Try to find a a good Gunsmith to work on it for ya, not easy or cheap, dying breed.

The 19 the perfect example of a working gun. Not too large, not too heavy. Accurate, was common to see 19’s shooting Bullseye Competition. Best trigger in a revolver period. Yes there were some forcing cone issues with a steady diet of super fast light bullets .357’s in the holsters of Lawman. I have never seen (doesn’t mean that it hasn’t happened) a split forcing cone on a gun that was bought by a civilian and used as a target carry gun, most all have either been dedicated or former LE guns. That’s why the 586 and 686 were created. If you can find a really nice 19 do it. If not check out the 66. But like some said the 586/686 are worth a look as well. Good luck!

You mentioned the Model 15. Still a bunch around. By far my most favorite revolver. If .357 is not really required, grab a nice example. You will smile every time you shoot it. A bit cheaper than a 19 also!

 

[cfullgraf]

Does S&W still make blued firearms ?

Yes, but not all Models are available in blued. Most are in the Classic line.

The current Classic Model 19 is blued and has been redesigned to be stronger in the forcing cone area.

The current bluing is not as pretty as in years past.

Side note, a steady diet of full power 357 Magnum ammunition loaded with 158 grain bullets will crack a forcing cone in an original Model 19. Don't get lulled in to the opinion that it only happens with full power 125 grain or 110 grain loads and you can blast away with the heavier bullet loads.

Fortunately, S&W replaced the barrel on my Model 19 back in 1980 on their dime after the forcing cone cracked after a steady diet of 158 grain loads.

New replacement barrels are not available from S&W any more for the Model 19 so if you crack the forcing cone on an original, it becomes a paper weight.

 

[Ethan Verity]

I favor the classic S&W revolvers over the Colt revolvers simply because I prefer the ergonomics of the push cylinder latch, over the pull.

I do hate what S&W has done to their modern production models with that frame lock though... but if you're looking at older production models that won't matter anyway.

 

[Slamfire]

A two time NRA Bullseye Pistol Champ, and 10 times PPC National Champ told me his K frame 38 Special has around 600,000 rounds through the shilen barrel and still prints 2 inches at 50 yards. I did not ask if it was a 38 Special or 357 cylinder, probably a 38 Special. He fired a 148 LWC with 2.7 grains Bullseye as his competition round. Bud says he had a firing pin break, the cylinder ratchet wore out. He sent it back to S&W for retiming. You shoot light loads in a S&W and they will last an incredible amount of time. Bud says when shooting in competition that required "major" loads, he had a forcing cone crack. I think that is the primary reason for the M686 introduction, shooters were firing a lot of full power 357 loads. He also said that he saw only one individual shooting a Colt, because Colts got out of time faster than S&W's. The Colt locks up just as the hammer falls. A little wear in the cylinder hand or ratchet, and it is out of time. The S&W locks up prior to hammer fall. Colts barrels were tighter, and more accurate than the S&W's, so bud said that some competitors had Colt barrels installed on their K frames, and the pistols were called Smolts.

When the M19 or M66 was designed, it was built on the standard 38 Special frame and extensive practice firing was understood to be 38 Special loads. Full power loads were more or less reserved for occasional use. Few shooters back then had the crazy round counts of recent shooters. Bill Jordan was the main proponent of the pistol. Bill was a Border Patrol Officer and I am certain out in the hot, dry, of the Southwest, he wanted something somewhat smaller than a bowling ball on his Sam Browne belt! I assume there were differences in the heat treatment of the receivers, but, don't know. Might have been differences in forcing cone angles, cylinder mouths, don't know.

My Python is a safe Queen. When prices got too high, I stopped shooting it.



I do have a Colt MKIII which shoots way too high, and I can't find a drop in taller front sight. That is one of the problems with these out of production pistols. Parts are non existent.



I shot a M66-1 to where it was slighly out of time on one or two cylinders, and traded it in, with some boot, for this



As I have gotten older, I don't care for the blast or recoil anymore. It takes too long to get rid of the flinch, so I have been downloading my cartridges. I do not like cleaning out the lead ring that developed in the cylinder from shooting 38 Specials, so I went out and developed 38 Special equivalent loads in the M66 and MKIII. The pistols ought to last forever with these loads.