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So what are we telling the anti-gun folks, really?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Old Dog, Nov 19, 2018.

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  1. Old Dog

    Old Dog Member

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    Um, you may be wrong there.

    Again, I made no call to "self-limit" our 1st Amendment rights to protect our 2A rights ... I am truly starting to believe that a lot of you guys here need to get away from your regular choir practice and start associating more -- not just socially -- with those who don't share your beliefs, because I'm seeing statements reflecting (1) many here totally underestimate the capabilities of the gun rights opponents and (2) you don't know how they work at the grassroots level. Get out, participate in the PTA, your district's school board, city/county councils, volunteer for committees ... you'll have your eyes opened for sure.

    And just last night on my local Fox station, lo and behold, a Lynwood (WA) gun shop owner was interviewed on camera for at least five minutes about how her gun sales have "exploded" since the passage of I-1639 ... with two other local gun shop owners quoted as well. At any rate, more than a couple of her remarks were totally cringe-worthy.
     
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  2. NIGHTLORD40K

    NIGHTLORD40K Member

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    No worries, mate, we cool.

    I have no doubt that there are, in fact, anti-gun operatives actng as"moles" here on THR and other RKBA websites. Most likely there are also representatives of more than one one US federal agency looking for subversive/threatening posts, and agents and bots from hostile foreign actors attempting to sow discord.

    But yes, think before you speak is NEVER a bad maxim when online- the entire world may be listening.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2018
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  3. Labguy47

    Labguy47 Member

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    I don't do circular logic. It is a big gap to go from what is available to EDC, to what we actually want. I want to carry the very best to neutralize the threat to me and my family. I carry 16+1 in an FNP-9, does that mean I will shoot all 17? Not if I don't have to, because I know a lawyer comes with every round that leaves the chamber. Will I shoot until the threat is stopped, absolutely. Do I feel confident in my ability to neutralize a threat with a revolver or a LC9s, yes. Does that mean they are the best tool for the job? Who can judge? Do we have a unique obligation to train and shoot with what we carry on a regular basis, of course, because we took it upon ourselves to be watch dogs, not sheep. Most of us have a military or LEO background and know the dangers present in every day life, so we minimize the risk for those we care about. God bless John Connor and little Lizzie!
     
  4. Kaybee

    Kaybee Member

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    I think the original question is flawed, in that it makes an assumption that someone that is antigun has *any* knowledge of all of firearms.

    Many really have no idea at all about capacity or how guns work or anything. So don't worry about what message you are sending by what you are carrying you could have a single stack,double stack, any caliber, old gun, new gun,1911, glock , revolver it really doesn't matter if they see it.. its all just the same thing to them.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2018
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  5. Justin

    Justin Moderator Emeritus

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    Yep. This has always been true. Antis will glom onto anything they can on our side, and the archives here are full of threads discussing such. But I really dislike some of the attempts within the gun rights movement to police the language of other gun owners because the antis will take it out of context and use it against the pro-rights side. Sorry, but they hate you, so there's no reason to self-censor within the community when discussing things that are or should be legal. I've seen this discussion played out a ton of times, and never with debates over capacity of carry pistols. Usually it applies to things with much higher visibility like pistol braces, binary triggers, Punisher logos on grips, or zombie-branded ammunition.

    Guns have been a political issue as long as guns have existed.

    In the case of individuals who own guns but don't get the culture or understand the political implications, the best we can do is try to educate them. Even then, if the antis can't find a Fudd to stump for them, they'll invent one.
     
  6. Texas10mm

    Texas10mm Member

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    Magazine restrictions IMHO are aimed at those evil "assault rifles", that they also cover handguns is just a bonus.
     
  7. Lady Blue Steel

    Lady Blue Steel Member

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    Watching for the reactions of anti-gunners to gun marketing and culture is reactive. How about being proactive? It would seem to me the best way to stop gun-grabbing anti-gun folk is to educate. Contrary to popular belief, not all people who think about gun control are doing it for vapid reasons. I know a lot of people that feel strongly about gun control because of Columbine and Sandy Hook. Instead of demonizing them for voting to pass ineffective gun control laws, try educating them on what could work and what won't and why.

    But calling people names and saying they're incapable of reasoning will get us all nowhere. I would stop listening to someone that talked demeaningly and condescendingly to me. Seriously. Try talking to gun control voters (not the obviously crazy ones, but regular people) and talk to them without being condescending. My niece is a UC Berkeley grad, but she has an open mind. She's also a mother, like me, and mass school shootings are a valid concern for both of us. But she's far from a gun grabber.

    I agree with the other poster who said we should untie gun control/rights from specific parties. There's so much divisiveness, the parties are getting too much far left and far right IMO. Technically, we do have issues a la carte but the politicians that run that way don't get voted in.
     
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  8. huntsman

    huntsman Member

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    If we allow the opposition to define what gun is acceptable to own we are no longer free.
     
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  9. Deanimator

    Deanimator Member

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    Have you talked to supporters of invidiously racist gun controls who they call me a "terrorist"?

    Have you talked to supporters of invidiously racist gun controls who hurl racial slurs at me when I defy their ORDERS to support the new Jim Crow?

    I have.

    Them first.

    The Democrat party ITSELF has inextricably bound itself up with racially invidious gun controls. Maybe you should talk to them.
     
  10. Deanimator

    Deanimator Member

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    I NEVER allow anti-gunners to set the terms of debate. I relentlessly expose every lie. And boy does it make them angry... often angry enough to drive them deep into David Duke territory.
     
  11. SilentStalker

    SilentStalker Member

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    The problem with this is, from my experience, most of them do not have open minds and are far from civil themselves. It’s hard to reason with those people. Not to mention, I think, our side, if one can call it that, have been using your tactics for a very long time. And, what has it got us? Nothing at best and at worst I feel like we’ve actually given up ground. M

    Many of us are fed up with trying to reason with these people. They have to want to have an open mind and understand etc. many of them do not nor do they want to. I’ve been stopped in my tracks before and was told I was wrong and when I tried to correct or teach was told they simply do not care. We are wrong. It’s their way or the highway. As long as they continue that manner of thinking, the polarization will continue to grow. I don’t see a positive outcome to this. It’s almost like they’ve been brought up with hate for us. Hell, it’s clear some of them would rather side with known terrorist groups than law abiding gun owners and we are sick of it.
     
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  12. Sovblocgunfan

    Sovblocgunfan Member

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    I don’t say a damn thing to antis about my CHL choices. They are the ones who draw inferences and make assumptions.
     
  13. Deanimator

    Deanimator Member

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    Why, when they can't even name the three branches of government?
     
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  14. Dibbs

    Dibbs Member

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    This may be true, but somewhat off the point. Gun owners minimal support or willingness to get involved
    was what I was getting at. But it's still hard to argue that if all gun owners joined the NRA we would have
    much better stance, politically, legally, and in the public awareness. It would be impossible to ignore
    or write off half the country's population as "gun nuts".
     
  15. Zerodefect

    Zerodefect Member

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    Anti gunners aren't allowed to talk to me. I've walked away from most than half of my family. No stranger on the street deserves an audience. I think ya'll are wasting your breath.

    My grandfather went liberal when he got senile in old age. Not uncommon, so I was ready to pardon that. My aunts and uncles went full retard to follow him. I haven't seen any of them since the funeral. My uncle called and asked why I'm not visiting for thanks giving (or ever again). I don't want liberals in my life anymore. They just make me angry, and I'm not a good person to be around when I'm angry. Sometimes there's an alpha person in a family that keeps it anchored, without such, I feel it's time to split up and move on.

    I don't want to see 90% of my family ever again, so there's absolutely no way I'm going to let friends or strangers tug on my ear.
     
  16. Texas10mm

    Texas10mm Member

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    Exactly. Right now the NRA has around 5 million members. If they had 50 million the congress critters and local critters would have to listen to them and be careful since that would be a voting block too big to ignore.
     
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  17. AlexanderA
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    AlexanderA Member

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    Maybe we need a doppelganger NRA, that's an arm of the Democratic party. (Ha! As if that would ever happen.) That way, people could join one or the other. The way it stands now, nobody who's not a dyed in the wool Republican will join the NRA. And the number of Republicans in the country is shrinking.
     
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  18. Old Dog

    Old Dog Member

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    Apparently no one here remembers the longest-serving Congressman from Michigan, Dem. Rep. John Dingell Jr., though considered a liberal, he was an NRA board member for years and a passionate advocate of gun rights.
     
  19. Madcap_Magician

    Madcap_Magician Member

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    In fairness, probably much of this is due to increasing party polarization. Now it's nearly impossible to find a pro-gun Democrat legislator or executive, just as hard as it is to find an anti-gun Republican. Because all the pro-gun Democrats became Republicans, and all the anti-gun Republicans became Democrats. So while I agree that the NRA should stay in its lane regarding firearms, party identification is growing ever more reliable as a predictor of positions on basically all of the issues. Yes, that's an oversimplification, but I think it's broadly true.
     
  20. gwpercle

    gwpercle Member

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    I have a right to keep and bear arms. Kinda simple
     
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  21. SilentStalker

    SilentStalker Member

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    Too young, but people like that are far, few and in between these days. I’m not even sure a true pro gun dem political figure exist these days.
     
  22. 460Shooter

    460Shooter Member

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    We already have that. They're called hipster.
     
  23. AlexanderA
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    AlexanderA Member

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    That's right, and let us also remember that JFK was a life member of the NRA. In those days, NRA membership was considered a political asset for politicians of either party.
     
  24. Tommygunn

    Tommygunn Member

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    I remember him. That's history. There have been republicans who have passed gun laws tol; Reagan did as California governor. It remains true that the harshest gun laws are being proposed by democrats.
     
  25. huntsman

    huntsman Member

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    Let us not forget The Greatest Generation and those politicians gave us the GCA of 68, pro gun has become more militant because the antis got the cammel’s nose under the tent.
     
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