New guy here. I am looking for a source for 158gr .357 LSWC-HP bullets. I have been reloading for 15 years, but am going to start loading .38/.357 for the first time. I just got a S&W 65-5 3" and I want to come up with a .38+p "FBI" type load suitable for that as well as a number of other handguns I have. So far, I haven't found a good source for such bullets. Any help gratefully appreciated!
Source for 158gr LSWC-HP bullets?
- Thread starter FatChance
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Dynamite Rabbit
Member
Zero Bullets makes them:
http://www.rozedist.com/mm5/merchan...RZD&Product_Code=R122-A&Category_Code=ZSB-38S
http://www.rozedist.com/mm5/merchan...RZD&Product_Code=R122-A&Category_Code=ZSB-38S
Seedtick
Member
If you can get by without the hollow point here is one from Missouri Bullet.
158 Grain SWC
If you haven't tried MBC before you will be pleasantly surprised with how well they take care of their customers. They also offer a discount to THR members.
ST
158 Grain SWC
If you haven't tried MBC before you will be pleasantly surprised with how well they take care of their customers. They also offer a discount to THR members.
ST
griz
Member
Either Hornady or Speer, or maybe both, sells a swaged version. I believe I got mine in bulk from Midway.
jfh
Member.
FatChance: There's been intermittent discussions here about these kind of loads--try searching this forum (use google) on such terms as "FBI800," "38+P 158LSWC-HP," or the like. Several of us have worked on these loads as well--in both 38, 38+P, 38 CIP, 357 Magnum, and even sorted out '357-lite' loads for them.
Other than the Zero bullet (which may be an import, right?), and possibly a cast one from Tennessee Valley Bullets(?), the only 158LSWC-HPs around are those from Speer or Hornady. However, based on my experience, one can readily develop a load using the traditional 158-gr. LSWC bullet. FWIW--the Speer / Hornady bullets are similar; both are swaged. Because of that, they will strip out and lead horrifically if driven much over 900 fps. The ubiquitous 158-gr. LSWC is available in various BHNs (there's another discussion going on about that right now), and probably work as well for barrels beyond 4" as the swaged -HP variants.
A current-pressure / current data 38+P load in factory ammo will run about 800 fps from a 2" barrel. The best velocities in shorter barrels seem to come from not the fastest powders, but from 'medium' powders--in my experience, AA#5 or Ramshot True Blue. Another powder some like is HS-6. With the right powder, that 3" barrel should get you close to 900 fps--which is even a bit faster than the original 'FBI load' did with their two-and-a-half-inch barrel.
Good luck with your interest; I've enjoyed doing it, too.
Jim H.
Other than the Zero bullet (which may be an import, right?), and possibly a cast one from Tennessee Valley Bullets(?), the only 158LSWC-HPs around are those from Speer or Hornady. However, based on my experience, one can readily develop a load using the traditional 158-gr. LSWC bullet. FWIW--the Speer / Hornady bullets are similar; both are swaged. Because of that, they will strip out and lead horrifically if driven much over 900 fps. The ubiquitous 158-gr. LSWC is available in various BHNs (there's another discussion going on about that right now), and probably work as well for barrels beyond 4" as the swaged -HP variants.
A current-pressure / current data 38+P load in factory ammo will run about 800 fps from a 2" barrel. The best velocities in shorter barrels seem to come from not the fastest powders, but from 'medium' powders--in my experience, AA#5 or Ramshot True Blue. Another powder some like is HS-6. With the right powder, that 3" barrel should get you close to 900 fps--which is even a bit faster than the original 'FBI load' did with their two-and-a-half-inch barrel.
Good luck with your interest; I've enjoyed doing it, too.
Jim H.
richkratz
Member
midwayusa.com is where I got my Speer hp's from.
GP100man
Member
my cast 358156 HP
I even had the gas check removed .I cast these with an alloy from isotope containers they check at 10.5 bhn & shoot good up to 1180 fps , after that they strip out a little !
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I even had the gas check removed .I cast these with an alloy from isotope containers they check at 10.5 bhn & shoot good up to 1180 fps , after that they strip out a little !
Thanks for the responses. I was hoping to work up a load with these in maybe the 1000fps range. I was probably going to start with W231 but will research other powders. For this velocity, what sort of hardness should I try to find for these bullets to avoid leading? My only experience loading lead bullets is with .45LC SASS loads and casting some 30:1 500gr bullets for an old Ballard .45-70, so this is new territory for me.
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
The problem is, if you make them hard enough to take 1,000 FPS, then they may be too hard for the HP to expand.
Either they won't expand, or will likely shatter and shed the nose section if they do.
Maybe a softer bullet with a gas check would be the way to go?
rc
Either they won't expand, or will likely shatter and shed the nose section if they do.
Maybe a softer bullet with a gas check would be the way to go?
rc
jfh
Member.
I think rcmodel has identified the problems intrinsic to LSWC-HP bullets, at least for these revolver calibres. What I have read elsewhere, IIRC, brings up the further problem of shipping damage and mfr's decisions about dealing with it by casting harder bullets also comes in to play. Hornady and Speer do seem to have it sorted out fairly well, but I still the odd damaged HP as I reload them.
For the 1000 fps range from a 3" barrel, you'll need to load in 357 Magnum, or you will be building high-overpressure rounds in the 38 Special cases. Point in fact is that subsequent testing of the fabled Speer #8 loads with SR-4756 have found a pressure spike well in to the 40K range, and arguably higher. My own WAG for what I call "FBI-900" loads are based on known pressure-barrel testing of similar rounds by a powder manufacturer--and I think these are in the 24,000-27,000 range.
You can try 231 for this--(older) WIN manuals do list high-end 357 Magnum loads. I have always found it to work best at low or medium pressures, however. For 38 Special cases, the best velocity I got was with CIP pressures (<=21,750 psi) using True Blue, at 911 fps, out of the 60-3".
Power Pistol is a powder to try--that ran up over 1000 fps, as did Ramshot Silhouette. I don't have extensive / statistically-valid chrono data for other powders you might want to consider
Jim H.
For the 1000 fps range from a 3" barrel, you'll need to load in 357 Magnum, or you will be building high-overpressure rounds in the 38 Special cases. Point in fact is that subsequent testing of the fabled Speer #8 loads with SR-4756 have found a pressure spike well in to the 40K range, and arguably higher. My own WAG for what I call "FBI-900" loads are based on known pressure-barrel testing of similar rounds by a powder manufacturer--and I think these are in the 24,000-27,000 range.
You can try 231 for this--(older) WIN manuals do list high-end 357 Magnum loads. I have always found it to work best at low or medium pressures, however. For 38 Special cases, the best velocity I got was with CIP pressures (<=21,750 psi) using True Blue, at 911 fps, out of the 60-3".
Power Pistol is a powder to try--that ran up over 1000 fps, as did Ramshot Silhouette. I don't have extensive / statistically-valid chrono data for other powders you might want to consider
Jim H.
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jfh
Member.
Well, with that--i.e., typically loading for 357 Magnum--in mind, get a current reloading manual or hit the powder manufacturer's sites and do the manual downloads. You've got plenty of options, that way.
Jim H.
Jim H.
Thanks for your kind replies.
Based upon the information I've been getting here and elsewhere, I think I am going to switch my focus from lead to Remington 158gr semi-jacketed hollow points. I think they will fit my goals better than the lead SWC-HPs.
I didn't have any suitable primers (I have a lot of everything else), but I stopped by my local fun store and about all they had in stock were small pistol magnum primers, so I got 1K Winchesters to start my project and am good to go. Seems like a good start.
Based upon the information I've been getting here and elsewhere, I think I am going to switch my focus from lead to Remington 158gr semi-jacketed hollow points. I think they will fit my goals better than the lead SWC-HPs.
I didn't have any suitable primers (I have a lot of everything else), but I stopped by my local fun store and about all they had in stock were small pistol magnum primers, so I got 1K Winchesters to start my project and am good to go. Seems like a good start.
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