My niece is graduating from West Point in May and I want to get her a nice light fixed blade . The Horkos was made for the West Point Combat Weapons Team but she said that her blade needed to be around 4 inches long. The Horkos is a large blade but the Phrike seams more useable. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. I have also considered, ESEE, Falkenieven, Bradford and Bark River models. Thanks.
Spartan Phrike
- Thread starter Litlman
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rcmodel
Member in memoriam
I have one of these with the optional Kydex thumb-lock sheath.
It's a heck of a knife for the money!
http://www2.knifecenter.com/item/BM...o-blade-coyote-aluminum-handles-coyote-sheath
http://www2.knifecenter.com/item/BM981914F/Benchmade-981914F-140141-Molded-Kydex-Hard-Sheath
rc
It's a heck of a knife for the money!
http://www2.knifecenter.com/item/BM...o-blade-coyote-aluminum-handles-coyote-sheath
http://www2.knifecenter.com/item/BM981914F/Benchmade-981914F-140141-Molded-Kydex-Hard-Sheath
rc
Why 4"?
What do you want it to focus on for her? Survival or Weapon?
What do you want it to focus on for her? Survival or Weapon?
rcmodel, thanks for the Bench made suggestion, I usually think of them for folders. HSO, I am not sure why 4 inches, every time I talk to her she says she thinks 4 inches which makes no sense to me. And I am thinking Weapon. I think I may see her for Easter and will confirm blade size.
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
May be a military Regulation's thing??
Without knowing where she is going to be assigned after graduation?
A 4" might be legal, or more easily kept out of sight in uniform on most assignments?
A 6" Fighter might not??
rc
Without knowing where she is going to be assigned after graduation?
A 4" might be legal, or more easily kept out of sight in uniform on most assignments?
A 6" Fighter might not??
rc
Rcmodel, that makes sense now that I think of it. I will talk directly to her and get her input. I did a search here previous to this post and the results were from a while ago. And now I remember that some guys said close to the same thing about what they were aloud to carry and what was and wasn't issued. Mostly issued is a Gerber musty tool. No blade.
Nope. From what JShirley and other active duty soldiers have told us and we see from what is available as issue to troops there's no service wide blade length limit of 4" (and the Horkos certainly isn't 4"). Individual commanders make up their own rules about what they permit their troops to carry in blade type and length.
Litlman, what's her specialty? Is the knife to be primarily symbolic of her achievement?
HSO, I am not sure what her specialty is, the last time I spoke with her was thanksgiving so I need to touch base with her. She has done very well at West Point and I want to get her a blade that will be quality and serve her well. It does not need to be a show pice, just quality and functional. While looking at many posts and Blade Hq and similar sites I found the Horkos. A lot of info on you tube but I do follow a lot of members her and feel comfortable with their advice. I do remember her mentioning 4 inches as a number so I thought the Phrike may be an option. I will try to get in touch with her or my family to get more info. I appreciate your input.
There usually IS a limit of 4" blade length that can be kept in a Soldier's quarters in the US. Longer blades have to be stored in the arms room.
This is just one of several reasons why I have repeatedly given 4" as the upper limit on a service member's blade length. Other reasons include:
>modern troops carry too much gear to make longer blades practical;
>brigade-wide restrictions by some commanders on carrying "conspicuous large blades".
4" is a very sensible length. The Phryke may even be a bit too long (it actually is too long). There are several companies making good options in the 3.5-4" blade length. Something like the Ontario Rat-3 or ESEE 3 should be perfect, and not dramatically different from the knife Sam and I designed for deploying troops.
John
This is just one of several reasons why I have repeatedly given 4" as the upper limit on a service member's blade length. Other reasons include:
>modern troops carry too much gear to make longer blades practical;
>brigade-wide restrictions by some commanders on carrying "conspicuous large blades".
4" is a very sensible length. The Phryke may even be a bit too long (it actually is too long). There are several companies making good options in the 3.5-4" blade length. Something like the Ontario Rat-3 or ESEE 3 should be perfect, and not dramatically different from the knife Sam and I designed for deploying troops.
John
Ahhh Ha! That's what I was missing! Was there a similar restriction when you were overseas?
herrwalther
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rcmodel said:
Nope. I never served in any country in any capacity that had a mandated blade length for knives. I do know of some commands that issued small, cheap Gerber pocket knives to dissuade soldiers from carrying larger knives. Four inches is about the extent I go for a comfortable pocket knife in and out of uniform. But my field and jump knives were all over 4" and up to 7" blade lengths.
My typical pocket carry knife is a Benchmade Adamas. And they make a fixed blade version at 4.2".
http://www.benchmade.com/fixedbladeknives/fixed-adamas-family.html
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...uLEYzU2qRg2kJrh_Q&sig2=RuMu7f5XPinqTuqLc3VSGA
(This is specifically for recruiting command, but the weapons part is pretty standard. Also, every US military flight I took while in Afghanistan in 2011-2012 was preceded by a brief that included stating that knives with over 4" blades could not be carried on the flight.)
(This is specifically for recruiting command, but the weapons part is pretty standard. Also, every US military flight I took while in Afghanistan in 2011-2012 was preceded by a brief that included stating that knives with over 4" blades could not be carried on the flight.)
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
Perhaps the new young officer is merely relying on what her instructors at West Point told her?
Seems reasonable & prudent to start out with a 4" blade she might not get confiscated & reported for, getting to her first duty assignment!
rc
Seems reasonable & prudent to start out with a 4" blade she might not get confiscated & reported for, getting to her first duty assignment!
rc
Nah, RC, why use common sense. Send her a sword, I'm sure that'll make everything think she knows what she's doing...! 
I remember, on my 2006-2007 deployment, seeing an officer at Camp Phoenix carrying around a bayonet, and laughing. Hell, I took some guff from my sgts for carrying a 5" blade.
This was me after a fire mission during which I used my knife to pry frozen 120mm mortar rounds out of their carriers:
https://m.flickr.com/photos/46538089@N00/5366157329/?xajax=1
I remember, on my 2006-2007 deployment, seeing an officer at Camp Phoenix carrying around a bayonet, and laughing. Hell, I took some guff from my sgts for carrying a 5" blade.
This was me after a fire mission during which I used my knife to pry frozen 120mm mortar rounds out of their carriers:
https://m.flickr.com/photos/46538089@N00/5366157329/?xajax=1
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
This whole thing reminds me of Basic Training in 1964.
They took my little Case 2" pocket knife away from me the first day.
Then issued me an E-Tool and a mess kit with with a reasonably sharp 3 3/4" fixed blade knife in it the next day.
And an M-14 and a 6 3/4" M6 Bayonet the day after that!
Never did get the little Case pocket knife my dad gave me back!!
rc
They took my little Case 2" pocket knife away from me the first day.
Then issued me an E-Tool and a mess kit with with a reasonably sharp 3 3/4" fixed blade knife in it the next day.
And an M-14 and a 6 3/4" M6 Bayonet the day after that!
Never did get the little Case pocket knife my dad gave me back!!
rc
herrwalther
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JShirley said:
Recruiters are often so disarmed it would not surprise me if one got in trouble for having staples of the wrong length in a desk stapler. The only time I didn't fly with knives was on civilian birds, but hand carrying my M4 and M9 seemed logical when I couldn't have a 1" knife.
Barry the Bear
Member
Basic training in 1964!!!! Thanks for your service RC! Did my Basic at Ft. Benning in 2010, Home of the infantry. When I got to AIT at Ft.Gordon we were given the multi tool gerber.
kBob
Member
not yet a decade later from rc's experience they took everyone's little folders. We were stood in front of tables with dividers like voting booths on them and told to empty out pockets and any luggage on them.
When a sleepy grizzled old E7 came to my position he looked at my stuff, I picked up my Satinless GI Demo Kit knife showed it too him and slipped it into my pocket and he nodded and walked on.
The only other guy in my platoon that kept his pocket knife was prior service and they let him keep the knife from his TL59 linemans kit.... he was not carrying the plyers/wire cutters or sheath.
On our first trip to the PX annex about ten days in I bought something like an Uncle Mike's or Old timer with two blades.....and had it stolen the same night.
Interestingly I was pitching a pup tent a week later and in clearing the ground found a cute little Tree three blade maybe two inches long on the "big" blade of the three.
At Tigerland at Fort Polk Lousy-anna they tolerated the Buck folders in leather pouches on the web trouser belt for Infantry trainees and so I got one of those and carried it or a replacement (broke the tip using it improperly, shower sump removal tool it was not) until my first ETS.
However I feel I should mention that I made E3 THE SECOND TIME when our then new CO discovered my German Kampfmesser fixed blade under my pillow on a walk through one morning. One of my NCOs referred to a single Article 15 as seasoning for a potential NCO. Still going from E4 on the E5 promotable list back to E3 was a pain to be avoided. The 7 and 7 and one third fine for three months was no fun either. Though it did cause me to get out and go back to school and get Commissioned. BTW I met the NCO that made the Seasoning comment some years later at Graff and he said he was sure the Article 15 made me a better Officer as well.
Still best to stay out of trouble.
-kBob
When a sleepy grizzled old E7 came to my position he looked at my stuff, I picked up my Satinless GI Demo Kit knife showed it too him and slipped it into my pocket and he nodded and walked on.
The only other guy in my platoon that kept his pocket knife was prior service and they let him keep the knife from his TL59 linemans kit.... he was not carrying the plyers/wire cutters or sheath.
On our first trip to the PX annex about ten days in I bought something like an Uncle Mike's or Old timer with two blades.....and had it stolen the same night.
Interestingly I was pitching a pup tent a week later and in clearing the ground found a cute little Tree three blade maybe two inches long on the "big" blade of the three.
At Tigerland at Fort Polk Lousy-anna they tolerated the Buck folders in leather pouches on the web trouser belt for Infantry trainees and so I got one of those and carried it or a replacement (broke the tip using it improperly, shower sump removal tool it was not) until my first ETS.
However I feel I should mention that I made E3 THE SECOND TIME when our then new CO discovered my German Kampfmesser fixed blade under my pillow on a walk through one morning. One of my NCOs referred to a single Article 15 as seasoning for a potential NCO. Still going from E4 on the E5 promotable list back to E3 was a pain to be avoided. The 7 and 7 and one third fine for three months was no fun either. Though it did cause me to get out and go back to school and get Commissioned. BTW I met the NCO that made the Seasoning comment some years later at Graff and he said he was sure the Article 15 made me a better Officer as well.
Still best to stay out of trouble.
-kBob
When I was at Fort Polk the order was nothing more than 3" but it wasn't enforced. They didn't come through the barracks looking for knives. Right when I was processing out a guy in 105th MI Battalion was stabbed with a pretty long blade, 8 or so inches from what I was told. He was stabbed because another soldier was jealous over the girl he was dating.
At Fort Huachuca we weren't allowed to have anything over 3" but again, they didn't turn the barracks upside down looking for contra-band and there was a pretty brutal murder of a soldier committed there in 1983 and the killer used a very big Rambo-type knife.
At Fort Huachuca we weren't allowed to have anything over 3" but again, they didn't turn the barracks upside down looking for contra-band and there was a pretty brutal murder of a soldier committed there in 1983 and the killer used a very big Rambo-type knife.
Ohen Cepel
Member
I would look at Randall Knives, some options there and lots of history.
Will have to go to the secondary market on them though since the wait is years. Or, you should be able to get one from Randall quickly if she is shipping out to Afghanistan.
The #15 with the shorter blade is a very good option in my mind if you want to go Randall.
Will have to go to the secondary market on them though since the wait is years. Or, you should be able to get one from Randall quickly if she is shipping out to Afghanistan.
The #15 with the shorter blade is a very good option in my mind if you want to go Randall.
kBob
Member
Given recent history, you may want to get her something small she can wear on a neck chain in the shower.
That comment should get some responses from some around here........
Honestly if I were a twenty something going back in with a commission I might want something like a Randall Guardian (#24?) small, discreet, and nasty that I could conceal but get too when needed. An always knife that could be maybe be pressed into service as a utility knife if one was real careful, but always a nasty little sting for folks that need one.
-kBob
That comment should get some responses from some around here........
Honestly if I were a twenty something going back in with a commission I might want something like a Randall Guardian (#24?) small, discreet, and nasty that I could conceal but get too when needed. An always knife that could be maybe be pressed into service as a utility knife if one was real careful, but always a nasty little sting for folks that need one.
-kBob
Any deploying Soldier especially is subject to sexual assault.
In the US, women are raped more, but overseas in Afghanistan, that situation is reversed. Sure, there are more male troops deployed, but in Afghanistan (and some other areas), rape of males is extremely common. Add in other risk factors like:
>largely transient workforce on base and transient service members (lack of time to build bonds between the local and military communities)
>local and third country national workers coming from backgrounds where rape is common
>most shower/latrine facilities located outside the troops' quarters.
Add all those in, and our SMs in Afghanistan especially are very vulnerable to sexual assault.
Bento Box Shop has a program where they allow customers to buy an ARK to donate to a deploying service member. BBS then gets the shipping information for that SM from me. 9 deploying SMs have received ARKs from BBS so far, but considering the total number of ARKs sold (which was all of the initial production run), it's a surprisingly high percentage. If anyone here has a relative or friend who is deployed or in the process of deploying soon, please contact me.
Also, if you want to donate an ARK to be gifted to a deploying SM through this program, the website is here.
John
In the US, women are raped more, but overseas in Afghanistan, that situation is reversed. Sure, there are more male troops deployed, but in Afghanistan (and some other areas), rape of males is extremely common. Add in other risk factors like:
>largely transient workforce on base and transient service members (lack of time to build bonds between the local and military communities)
>local and third country national workers coming from backgrounds where rape is common
>most shower/latrine facilities located outside the troops' quarters.
Add all those in, and our SMs in Afghanistan especially are very vulnerable to sexual assault.
Bento Box Shop has a program where they allow customers to buy an ARK to donate to a deploying service member. BBS then gets the shipping information for that SM from me. 9 deploying SMs have received ARKs from BBS so far, but considering the total number of ARKs sold (which was all of the initial production run), it's a surprisingly high percentage. If anyone here has a relative or friend who is deployed or in the process of deploying soon, please contact me.
Also, if you want to donate an ARK to be gifted to a deploying SM through this program, the website is here.
John
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