spotting scope recommendations?

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docgary

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Looking for a spotting scope for bench rest -

$200-400 range

good optics out to at least 300 yds -

I want to clearly see .223 hits on white and black background at 300 yds..


I have seen:

Konus 20-60 x 80 ($220)
Barska "gladiator" 20-60 x 90 ($320)

Both with OK optics and flimsy tripod

Any suggestions up to $400?

TIA
docgary
 
I want to clearly see .223 hits on white and black background at 300 yds
Click to expand...

Seeing them on white is not so hard, but seeing .223 holes on black is tough for me even at 200 under anything but ideal conditions. I have a Nikon Spotter XLII, 16-48x and have been real pleased with it as far as shooting from the bench and from a hunting perspective. I believe I paid $439 for it about 2 years ago. Will see what others say but seeing .223 holes on black at 300 yards is a tall order for a < $400 spotting scope except under ideal conditions.
 
agree... even 30 cal holes in the black can be tough w/ my nikon spotter.

i am happy w/ my spotter for both hunting and targets and concede there are better out there, and maybe even better for the money, but i am fully satisfied w/ mine.
 
+1 on the Kowa

+1 on the hard to see in the black at 300 yards unless conditions are perfect.

FWIW - I watched Ebay for about 3 months and was able to score a Kowa 660 for $250 . . .look for auctions ending at bad times. :)
 
I got a 20x60 variable power Bushnell from Midway on sale. Don't remember the $$$, but it seemed really reasonable at the time. Probably not greatest, but quite adequate for what I need. At 300 yards, 60x would be equivalent to standing 15 feet from the target.

If you're just trying to sight in or shoot to develop loads, you might try some of the Shoot-N-See targets from Birchwood Casey. They're real easy to see with the spotting scope at 300.
 
I have a Celestron Ultima 80 with a 20-60 eyepiece. The 80 mm objective is great for cloudy days and late evenings. Set to 60x, if you have good light behind the target, you can see .223 holes at 300 pretty easily. I paid about $250 for it about 2 years ago. They're probably less now.

I know a guy who has a $2000 Swarovsky and my Celestron isn't as clear as that, but I didn't pay $2000. I look thru guys Kowas at matches and see no difference from mine.

I have no complaints about it.
 
The Konus is just as bright and clear to MY eye as my Kowa. Its only fault being short eye relief and narrow field of view, but that is pretty much standard with any zoom eyepiece. Pity they don't offer a 25-30X fixed.
Save up and buy a real stand next.

Nothing is going to reliably pick .22s out of the black at 300.
A friend saw a setup that will help.
If there is room behind your target stand, rig up a backer stand to lean a piece of that white corrugated sign board about 45 degrees to cast light back through the bullet holes.
 
At 300 yards, 60x would be equivalent to standing 15 feet from the target.
Click to expand...

Yes but only if all the optical aberrations that reduce resolving power are well corrected. They can not be with inexpensive optics. The technical term is the cheap scopes give "empty magnification" meaning the apparent size of the image is increased but the the amount of detail to be seen is not.

I find my Barska is pretty good out to 200 yards and usable at 300 on a bright day. But seeing holes is not the same as resolving holes -- at 300 yards I can see 30 caliber holes, but its virtually a guess to tell if two nearly touching shots are one shot or two.

I buy targets with orange centers or the various shoot'n'see targets help too.

--wally.
 
I bought a Konus 80mm and they seem to be gaining popularity with Highpower shooters. It is worth $235. The stand isn't great but is usable and better than most cheap stands.

Check out Jim Owens---Highpower teachers web page. He sells both Konus and Kowa.

www.jarheadtop.com

He sells a scope stand that is great for $125. You can set it up for prone, sitting or standing.

I read some guys testimonial for the Konus 100mm scope---he thought it was as good as the high priced spread.
 
If you want some real good value in a spotter, this is the only way you can get the superior "ED" (extra-low dispersion) glass in a sub-$600 piece:

http://www.opticsplanet.net/celestron-ultima-100ed-spotting-scope.html

That's a 100mm objective, and 66x mag - good stuff, maynard.

That's what I'd do if starting over.

Also, Celestron has an 80mm ED unit:

http://www.opticsplanet.net/celestron-ultima-80ed-spotting-scope.html

But for just over $100 extra, you can go from 80mm to 100mm objective, which increases your obj lens surface area by 56.24% over the 80mm.
 
A 100mm spotting scope is getting to be a big piece of equipment to hump around and locate on the firing point. I had one of another name brand that did not live up to its claims and sent it back. I now have a little 60mm Kowa. That is plenty because I am not looking for bullet holes beyond 100 yards. When I shoot at longer ranges it is on steel where the bullet splash shows or on a regulation range where the target tender in the pit is spotting the shot with a large marker disk.

I might buy a Konus yet. The angle eyepiece of my Kowa that is so convenient to the shooter spotting his own shots and watching the mirage is kind of a pain to line up when scoring somebody else's target or spotting for him on silhouettes.
 
Last edited:
It's double what you're willing to spend, but worth it - Leupold 12-40x60

http://www.leupold.com/observation/products/spotting-scopes/golden-ring-spotting-scopes/golden-ring-12-40x60mm/

This is a waterproof spotting scope equal in quality to Leupold's top of the line rifle scopes. Opticsplanet has them on sale for $800.

These scopes have the same resolving numbers as heavier, larger scopes. Because they are a little lighter, you might actually carry it in a pack. Most spotting scopes are so heavy they never make it very far from your truck. :)
 
Thanks for the replies!


One important piece of information left out....

I ALWAYS use Cauldwell's or Casey's "Shoot N See" high contrast targets...
Usually 3 inch round targets, 2 per page.

I imagine that fact allows for the inclusion of a lot more scopes!

I figure I'm going to settle on a cheaper scope (+/- $200) for now and
consider the higher end when my abilities carry over to 500+yd precision shooting.

I've got good feedback on the Konus 20-60 x 80 ($220 from MidwayUSA)

I guess visualizing bullet placement at 300+ yards
using the 'Shoot and See' targets should be a 'no brainer'.

Correct?

TIA
docgary
 
docgary, the trick is contrast. for instance, if the sun is behind the target and comes through the bullet holes, it's very easy to see .224 holes on a black target from 200 yrds. the shoot n see stuff generally makes a big enough spot with high contrast that i can see them out to 900 yrds, which is as far as i've ever used a shoot n see.

the problem is... can you hit them? a half-minute wind will push you off the circle and you won't be able to tell where you hit w/o walking downrange. that'll get old fast.

i have the kowa 821M which I can highly recommend. i don't have any experience with the konus (in fact, I'm not sure I've ever heard of them.) celestron is fairly well known for there telescopes. I haven't seen their spotting scopes though.

if your range allows it... my recommendation would be to skip the scope and skip the shoot n sees.

instead, buy a couple of 8" or 10" steel plates. You'll pay maybe $50 or so for a plate, and another $20 buying some rebar at lowes to build a stand for it. then buy a can of spray paint and hose it down. by the time you've walked back to the firing point, it will be dry. it's easy to hit. it makes a loud gong and moves when you hit it so you know you hit it. the impact knocks about an inch of paint off so it's easy to see where you hit.

btw... in a typical year of shooting, you'll go through a lot more than $50 worth of shoot n sees. the steel pays for itself big time in the long run.
 
agree with everyone else. well most everyone. save up and buy the best you can. I have a couple the 50.00 one really sucks. good for spotting animals maybe good if your shooting at steel. but lousy if your trying to see where a bullet hit on paper.
 
Today 09:54 PM
scrat
...the problem is... can you hit them? a half-minute wind will push you off the circle and you won't be able to tell where you hit w/o walking downrange. that'll get old fast.
Click to expand...

Well said...

For the most part, between compensating for bullet drop and making
corrections from the 100 yd line to 300 yds, I get on target quick.

But you hit the nail on the head!

If I'm slightly off on the windage, or perhaps a couple of inches hi or low,
I've got to see the bullet hole to make the corrections!

Hence, the scope must have the abilty to give me location on the cardboard.
What I have been doing is stapling the targets on a backsheet of white copy paper.
According to most here, holes will be easier to see on white than black background.

Last week, I went to my newly joined rifle club with 2 ranges out to 300 yds.
(Old clubs' longest range is 100yds.)

I built my AR for medium to long distance shooting:
  • Krieger barrel, 26 inch SS, match chamber, 1:9, fluted
  • on a DPMS Lo-Pro upper -no FA, no port cover -
  • RRA lower, 2 stage houge trigger -
  • Ace skeletal stock to be replaced with Magpul PRS next week. -
  • Nikon 6.5-20x45 scope - JP/VTAC FF tube
The rifle is strictly for bench rest - either bipod or Sinclair front rest.
Way to front heavy for off hand.

Recently, I was shooting target at 250 yards -
Very first attempt at any distance over 100 yds. and prone (first time on my belly as well!)
I just couldnt get on the 'shoot N See target although I knew I was within inches.
After 10 shots, I got extremely fustrated, packed it up and retrieved my target stand.

Well, I had a very nice 10 shot group around 2 inches center to center!
Sub MOA the first time out without any corrections!

Man, I KNOW if I had a spotter or a good spotting scope, I couild have nailed that target!!

And that's what shootin' is all about!
Just like fishin', its about nailing the next one!


Thanks for the feedback,
docgary
 
Hey doc, look at these threads:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=342601

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=344402

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=318002

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=290023

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=281469

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=283051

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=240383

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=228321

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=193617

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=216908

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=289599


Basically, if you have a veritable buttload to spend, get a Kowa, high-end Brunton, Swarovski, Leica, or Zeiss. If you have a mini-buttload to spend, get a high-end Leupold or high-end Nikon. If you have $600, I'd get the ED Celestron 22-66x10mm. If you have less than $200, get the Celestron C90 Maksutov-Cassegrain. IMO, Celestron is where's it's it in the non-rich-man's world.
 
The ability to see .223 holes in black targets at 300 yards has more to do with mirage conditions, and brightness of the impact area, than any special feature of of the scope.

The Konus is a plenty-good scope for highpower shooting.

Spend as much money as you have to if the scope is to be used for commecial photography.

Even a $5000.00 scope won't allow you to see the holes in the black target if there is heavy mirage, and the area behind the target is dark.

The thing that helps the MOST in spotting holes at 300 yards is the ability to know EXACTLY where on the target to look, in order to see the little smudge that should be two snake-eyes looking back at you. An expensive scope won't buy you snake-eyes at 300 either.
 
That Kronus sure looks a lot like my Barska, including the stand. I wonder who really makes them?

--wally.
 
The Konus scope is good, but the mount is shakey. I made my own, using 5/8 rod and a very good window mount. It is not the most portable around,but it is very steady. And rugged too. DSC00753.jpg
 
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