Springfield Range Officer or Colt 70 Series

[duns]

Thanks Snowblazer2. Got it out of you at last -- some really useful information. Don't mean to be patronizing, just pulling your leg.

 

[Skylerbone]

You asked if I was positive and I stated my case. I mean no snub to Springfield but I do not find them superior to Colt. My first post suggested to the OP that all of these posts turn into biased accounts by individuals and that he ought to decide what he wants.

Ford and GM are global corporations, and yes I realize they farm out parts production. While every part in a Colt may not be manufactured in house NOTHING at SA Inc. is made there, all of the parts (and most of them in the form of completed firearms) arrive there merely for distribution. If I wanted a 100% foreign 1911 I'd buy an RIA or Citadel and save the extra money.

Again, my bias is showing.

 

[Armed012002]

In my opinion, for a little more money, a Colt is worth it for the quality of materials and country of origin. Other features such as the finish and firing pin safety are personal preferences.

A Colt XSE Government costs about as much as a Series 70. Wouldn't an XSE Government be a better comparison to the Range Officer?

Compared to the older XSE Government model, the new XSE Government will have Novak 3 dot sights and an upswept beavertail safety. Those two changes make the XSE Government very comfortable and easier to shoot accurately

The following is a brief comparison between the Series 70 and XSE Government vs. the Range Officer:

A phone call to Colt customer service will give you the following list of materials used:

MIM
sear
disconnector
magazine catch
magazine catch lock

CAST
Thumb safety
grip safety

FORGED
slide
receiver
barrel
slide stop

MACHINED from bar stock
hammer
all pins
bbl link
bbl bushing
trigger finger piece
ejector
firing pin
firing pin stop
extractor
plunger tube

14 parts in a Colt are either machined from bar stock or forged.

In comparison, the Range Officer and other Springfield models use lower quality materials to decrease cost. Only the slide, receiver, and barrel are forged. Small parts are MIM (metal injection molding) to decrease cost. Furthermore, the barrel is a two-piece design to further decrease cost.

The finish on the Colt Series 70 or XSE Government will have traditional polished flats and matte rounds.

The finish on the Range Officer is all matte.

The Series 70 does not have a firing pin safety. The XSE uses the Series 80 firing pin safety.

The Range Officer and other Springfield models have no firing pin safety.

The Series 70 and XSE are made in USA.

The Range Officer and other Springfield models are made in Brazil to decrease cost.

 

[Cards81fan]

The Range Officer and other Springfield models are made in Brazil to decrease cost.

They are not only made in Brazil, but are made by Brazil. Imbel is a state-owned company. For some, that may matter.

 

[w2fnt]

Makarov was made by state owned companies and they seem to be just fine and very much in demand also. Your point is?

Next you will try to me me believe that only hollow point bullets work, right?

 

[Cards81fan]

Makarov was made by state owned companies and they seem to be just fine and very much in demand also. Your point is?

Next you will try to me me believe that only hollow point bullets work, right?

Well, the JHP comment is a bit of a stretch, but more to my point:

Some people like to exclusively Buy American and some don't (I'm one who doesn't care - heck I owned an XD for several years). Springfield is an interesting company in that they state they are "The First Name in American Firearms." They purport to produce American Firearms when their handguns clearly are produced (XDs and all 1911 frames) in other countries. The Sharing of facts is precisely my point.

The Makarov was produced by state-owned companies that effectively do not exist today . The former-Soviet puppet states are not the same entities they once were during the existence of the USSR. The comparison of a new SA 1911 to the surplus Makarov is not valid. It's different in Brazil. I could care less about the Brazilians, but many here have strong political convictions. Considering the very Socialist leanings of Brazil and their current (Rousseff) and immediate past president (Lula), this may matter to some. Purchasing a Springfield 1911 directly contributes to the current Brazilian political system. Again, it doesn't matter to me but it may to some. I'm just sharing the facts. Everyone can make their own decisions from there.

 

[SnowBlaZeR2]

In my opinion, for a little more money...

Some of your info on the Range Officer is mixed up with other models. Some about Springfield's 1911s in general is also inaccurate, most notably about the barrel. Some models use a two piece barrel. The Range Officer uses the same one piece barrel that the TRP or TM model uses. Also as I stated for around the same price as a nice Colt, you get into the territory of the TRP, which in my opinion is far superior to most of what Colt offers today.

 

[Armed012002]

I was not aware that the barrel is a one-piece.

Other than the barrel, what information did I provide that's inaccurate?

Springfield customer service gave me the following list of MIM parts for the Range Officer:

sear
disconnector
magazine catch
thumb safety
grip safety
slide stop
hammer
barrel link
ejector
firing pin stop
plunger tube

So to correct my previous post, the barrel bushing and extractor do not appear to be MIM.

For less than $200 more, a Colt includes a forged slide stop and machined bar stock hammer, barrel link, ejector, firing pin stop, and plunger tube. Personally, I think that's worth it.

The Springfield TRP costs between $400 to $500 more than a Colt Series 70 or XSE Government. Personally, if I were looking for a hand fitted 1911, I'd buy a Colt Special Combat Government for $350 more than a Springfield TRP

I'm not arguing that Springfield doesn't make a good 1911. I believe they make a very good 1911. However, if you can squeeze a couple hundred extra dollars from your bank account, I believe a Colt is worth it for quality of materials and country of origin

 

[JTQ]

Also as I stated for around the same price as a nice Colt, you get into the territory of the TRP

I'll admit I'm not that familiar with Springfield TRP pricing so I went to Impact guns for reference.

The TRP is a $1,500(ish) pistol at Impact. Two models listed, one just under $1,500 and the other just over $1,500.

Colt only has three pistols listed at Impact above $1,000, I think they are all below $1,100.

 

[SnowBlaZeR2]

I was not aware that the barrel is a one-piece.

Other than the barrel, what information did I provide that's inaccurate?

Springfield customer service gave me the following list of MIM parts for the Range Officer:

sear
disconnector
magazine catch
thumb safety
grip safety
slide stop
hammer
barrel link
ejector
firing pin stop
plunger tube

So to correct my previous post, the barrel bushing and extractor do not appear to be MIM.

For less than $200 more, a Colt includes a forged slide stop and machined bar stock hammer, barrel link, ejector, firing pin stop, and plunger tube. Personally, I think that's worth it.

The Springfield TRP costs between $400 to $500 more than a Colt Series 70 or XSE Government. Personally, if I were looking for a hand fitted 1911, I'd buy a Colt Special Combat Government for $350 more than a Springfield TRP

I'm not arguing that Springfield doesn't make a good 1911. I believe they make a very good 1911. However, if you can squeeze a couple hundred extra dollars from your bank account, I believe a Colt is worth it for quality of materials and country of origin

I'm not going to argue about your assessment of quality between the two. It's a matter of opinion and you are certainly entitled to your own. It looks like you corrected most of the inaccuracies of your first post. The RO isn't made in Brazil either. Made from imported parts maybe, but I wouldn't say it's made there.

Between the TRP and Colt Special, give me the TRP. Better gun for less money in my opinion. Or for even a little more money, you can get the best fighting pistol in the world if you ask me. Guess what? It's not a Colt.

 

[SnowBlaZeR2]

I'll admit I'm not that familiar with Springfield TRP pricing so I went to Impact guns for reference.

The TRP is a $1,500(ish) pistol at Impact. Two models listed, one just under $1,500 and the other just over $1,500.

Colt only has three pistols listed at Impact above $1,000, I think they are all below $1,100.

I don't see them in stock there. Also, I wouldn't buy from there anyways. A TRP will run about $1300 and the Colt at or just above $1000. To be fair, I won't even give the military price on the TRP.

The TRP is significantly better than that model of Colt. As Ragsdale pointed out, you can step up to another Colt, but then you can step up to something else, then something else. It's really all a matter of opinion. I don't expect everyone to agree with mine, but I will still make it known.

 

[wow6599]

Or for even a little more money, you can get the best fighting pistol in the world if you ask me

What gun are you talking about?

 

[Armed012002]

Not to nitpick, but Buds sells the Colt Series 70 for $900 and the XSE Government for $920. The Springfield TRP is $1,390 and the Colt Special Combat Government Carry is $1,626.

So if you fancy the Special Combat Government Carry model, it's $236 more than the TRP

That's what I was basing my pricing on

Of course, this is all a matter of opinion. All 1911s mentioned are very nice

 

[MCMXI]

I don't own a SA Range Officer, but this past Sunday I shot a USPSA match with a new shooter who had recently bought one. I got to "play" with it between stages and was impressed with the slide to frame fit, the barrel fit and the trigger. The shooter had never used it so I was amazed that he'd show up to a match and shoot it for the first time in a stressful environment. He missed quite a few targets so ended up shooting 175+ rounds of 230gr FMJ (don't know brand) without a single issue other than one operator error where he failed to insert the magazine all the way.

My LGS has five TRPs with Armory Kote in stock. OTD pricing with CAC is a little over $1,500 which includes 4.7% sales tax.

 

[SnowBlaZeR2]

Not to nitpick, but Buds sells the Colt Series 70 for $900 and the XSE Government for $920. The Springfield TRP is $1,390 and the Colt Special Combat Government Carry is $1,626.

So if you fancy the Special Combat Government Carry model, it's $236 more than the TRP

That's what I was basing my pricing on

Of course, this is all a matter of opinion. All 1911s mentioned are very nice

I also don't want to nitpick, but Bud's has none of those in stock. Not a lot of good if you can't get it it at that price.

The last time I checked with my dealer, I could get the TRP for $1240 shipped to my current FFL. I don't know about the Colt, but he sells them in his shop for $1050, so I might be able to get one for under $1000. The Special Combat runs just over $1800 there. That is what I base my pricing on. I don't know if Colt offers LE/military pricing, but that's another reason, for me why I would go with a Springfield over a new Colt.

 

[SnowBlaZeR2]

What gun are you talking about?

Take your pick. Once you approach $2k or more, it's really a matter of personal preference even more so than on the cheaper 1911s. I have extensive experience with several of the customs, and I would take most any of them. When my Wilson arrives, I imagine that will probably be the new "best pistol in the world" for me.

 

[Armed012002]

Unlike Springfield and Kimber, Colt has a low volume production, so "out of stock" is a common theme anywhere you go. Unfortunately, you have to wait for one.

Buds prices are pretty stable on Colts

The military/law enforcement pricing on Springfields is nice. As far as I know, Colt does not offer a discount.

I can get a Loaded model for $675 with a military discount. At that price, MIM ain't so bad

 

[Skylerbone]

I don't wish to spoil the discussion but we are now squarely at double the OP's price point and comparing the best of what each maker sells as opposed to the specific models he inquired about.

To the OP, you've chosen two very dissimilar 1911s which makes for an interesting discussion but leaves us with much opinion and some good facts as well. I'm left wondering if you're committed to the purchase for the sake of owning a 1911 (and however you come in to them it's always a good thing in my book).

My take:

Accuracy, I would give a general edge to the RO at 25+ yards, the shooter will be a much bigger factor.
Fit, the RO will almost assuredly be "tighter" for those who feel this makes a significant difference.
Sights, well that's a personal preference, if it's not a duty pistol there's nothing wrong with having an adjustable sight, the Colt will have more replacement options, a wash unless one stands out as a winner.
Style, well that's a big preference and these two are nothing alike in that department. I don't mean to say one has it and the other does not I mean they are nothing alike. One is meant to be a no frills target pistol and the other a reasonably faithful GI style combat pistol. They don't look, feel or point the same and that is why you need to handle them first before considering a purchase that costs nearly as much as my first car.

 

[SwampWolf]

It all comes down to the sights.

If you want a pistol with adjustable sights get the Springfield. The sight cut on the Range Officer will severely limit your after market sight options if you decide down the road you don't like the adjustable sights.

I think JTQ had the best answer early on. The op first should decide on which sights he likes best and which type of sights best suits his needs. Unless I'm planning to carry a pistol in a pocket or in some other "deep cover" location where adjustable sights might impede the draw by them snagging on something, I much prefer adjustable sights on most of my handguns.

 

[duns]

I chose a Colt Series 70 reissue because I wanted something as close to the original 1911 as possible without the expense of buying an original. I have been thrilled with it. I have over a dozen handguns and I like it the best of all of them. I love the way it handles and the way it looks. I have taken two tactical handgun training courses using it. When I bought it, I didn't envisage conceal-carrying it, but I now do so when my attire permits the concealing of a full size pistol.

 

[mrvco]

I'm in a similar situation...

I have the 1911 itch, but I'm a little overwhelmed by the options. I put my hands on the Colt Series 70 as well as the Colt Gold Cup and I'd cherish either one I'm sure. The stainless Series 70 w/ the "100 Years of Service" marking seems almost too pretty to shoot, but I like the nice clean lines of the fixed sites (how often do you need to adjust the sites on a 1911?) and I'm not entirely sold on the Gold Cup's wrap around grips in my average sized hands (easily replaced I know). Then the Sig 1911 Stainless (I love my 9mm P226, but do I really need another Sig? and it feels like I'd be buying a "Sig" rather than a 1911) and the SA Loaded Target (noticeably stronger recoil spring and I wish they would have left off the front cocking serrations) are both staring at me as well.

I found myself in a state of paralysis and had to walk away... for now :banghead:

 

[Armed012002]

If you're a reloader, adjustable sights are nice for different loads. You can adjust the sights so that point of impact (POI) is the same as point of aim (POA).

For instance powder puff 185 gr. SWC and +P 230 gr. JHP will have different POI

 

[Yo Mama]

Not to throw this in, as you want a 1911, but Springfield is coming out with an XD 5.25!