I am about to embark on hand loading. As usual I am going into things backwards. I have a few die sets a bunch of brass and one book. I think I need to get the press before I get anymore equipment. A friend has suggested one of the Lee starter kits that can be had for @ $120. For comparison, a new Rockchucker I can find for @ $140. But that is the press only and I am a rank beginner. All that money could go to powder and bullets and not the rest of a beginner's set up Any of you more experienced folks have any input to add before I jump in with both feet?
Starter kits
- Thread starter Attila
- Start date
- Status
adcoch1
Member
The rockchucker is an amazing press that would never be a wrong choice, but the lee classic reloading starter set is the way to go. I have the cheaper four hole economy lee press and its fine, but the classic is better and I am upgrading to the classic shortly.
The best part about the turret presses from lee is that you only need to set up dies once, and changing cartridges is as easy as grabbing the next turret and shell holder. I commonly will load 3-4 different cartridges in a session at the bench, and the lee makes it easy. I run mine without the indexing rod and just turn the turret by hand. Lee makes some great stuff, not all of it is perfect, but the presses are awesome. I do prime off press with an rcbs hand primer though, seems easier to me...
The best part about the turret presses from lee is that you only need to set up dies once, and changing cartridges is as easy as grabbing the next turret and shell holder. I commonly will load 3-4 different cartridges in a session at the bench, and the lee makes it easy. I run mine without the indexing rod and just turn the turret by hand. Lee makes some great stuff, not all of it is perfect, but the presses are awesome. I do prime off press with an rcbs hand primer though, seems easier to me...
Before you buy any more stuff, get a copy of The ABCs of Reloading. After a detailed description of all components it will walk you through the process step by step. Also there is a large section devoted to the equipment needed. I personally don't care for kits as I will research each tool I need and buy what is best for my reloading needs, regardless of manufacturer, not what a salesman figgered I'd need (and many kits include unnecessary tools you may never need). A hint for new reloaders; find a load (bullet, primer, powder) in your reloading manual(s) before you buy any components. Many fewer headaches and waits this way.
Go slow, double check everything, be safe and most important, have fun...
Go slow, double check everything, be safe and most important, have fun...
Sunray
Member
A new Rockchucker press only for $140 maybe, but not the RCBS Rockchucker Supreme Master Reloading Kit. Currently on sale at Cabela's for $299 with all the stuff you'll need less dies and shell holder. It runs $512.86 buying all the stuff separately. Comes with a Nosler manual, but buy a Lyman book too. It's far more versatile than any bullet or powder makers book.
You buy RCBS for the warrantee. Have any issues even if you cause it, and they'll fix it no questions asked. Forever(Lee's is 1 or 2 years only and doesn't cover used kit.). RCBS' applies if you buy anything of their's, like dies, used. 'Used' is not an ugly word either. You really have to work at damaging modern reloading kit.
The ABCs of Reloading is a how-to. Runs about $30 on Amazon or your local gun shop.
Read the book before you do anything. And do not hesitate to ask any questions you have, here.
You buy RCBS for the warrantee. Have any issues even if you cause it, and they'll fix it no questions asked. Forever(Lee's is 1 or 2 years only and doesn't cover used kit.). RCBS' applies if you buy anything of their's, like dies, used. 'Used' is not an ugly word either. You really have to work at damaging modern reloading kit.
The ABCs of Reloading is a how-to. Runs about $30 on Amazon or your local gun shop.
Read the book before you do anything. And do not hesitate to ask any questions you have, here.
Varminterror
Member
- Joined
- Jul 17, 2016
- Messages
- 15,203
Most of the "kits" folks talk about are the Lee kits, and although many, many of us started on an "anniversary kit" many, many years ago, they sucked back then and they still suck today. I'd contend the Lee Turret press kit is no better. The Lee Safety Powder Scale (balance) is really poor quality, and the Perfect Powder Measure which comes with the Anniversary kit is terrible, and the Auto-drum which comes with the turret kit is only marginally better. The Lee Cutter & Lock Stud, to be used with Lee Case Length Gauges (spindles) and the debur and chamfer tool are ridiculously tedious to use, and painful on the hands (doesn't matter what age - I remember using them as a kid and they exhausted my fingers holding these small tools even for a moderate batch of brass).
The Rockchucker kit has better quality gear, I prefer the 505 over the M500 it comes with, but the Uniflow is good. There's a lot less gear in the RCBS kit than the Lee kit, but it's a better overall kit. A guy would have to do the math on whether it's a better deal than parting everything out. The Rockchucker Supreme Master kit is on sale at Midway right now for $280. Oddly, this comes with a Nosler reloading manual, which is great if you're loading nosler bullets, but not really great otherwise ($23 value). The neck brush and lube pad are good in this kit, but not necessarily needed, and the debur and chamfer tool is worse than the Lee tool, as it doesn't include a lock stud to be used with a power drill.
Personally, I'm not a fan of single stage presses, nor of kits, so I recommend piecing and parting the kits together to all of the firearms/reloading student's, friends, and family I've helped get geared up.
Comparatively, to the RCBS Rockchucker kit: a Lee Classic 4 hole Turret can be bought for $115 and the mounted Safety Prime set for $24, a Uniflow for $80, Lyman 500 for $55, reloading tray for $5. That gets us to $280, which is the sale price of the RCBS Rockchucker kit, but for a much faster turret press. Comparatively, the Lee Turret Kit is $215, but personally, I'd rather pay $65 extra to get a much better powder measure and better powder scale (balance).
The hand trimming, deburring, and chamfering tools in these kits are junk, so I assign no value, and only cost to those items.
The Rockchucker kit has better quality gear, I prefer the 505 over the M500 it comes with, but the Uniflow is good. There's a lot less gear in the RCBS kit than the Lee kit, but it's a better overall kit. A guy would have to do the math on whether it's a better deal than parting everything out. The Rockchucker Supreme Master kit is on sale at Midway right now for $280. Oddly, this comes with a Nosler reloading manual, which is great if you're loading nosler bullets, but not really great otherwise ($23 value). The neck brush and lube pad are good in this kit, but not necessarily needed, and the debur and chamfer tool is worse than the Lee tool, as it doesn't include a lock stud to be used with a power drill.
Personally, I'm not a fan of single stage presses, nor of kits, so I recommend piecing and parting the kits together to all of the firearms/reloading student's, friends, and family I've helped get geared up.
Comparatively, to the RCBS Rockchucker kit: a Lee Classic 4 hole Turret can be bought for $115 and the mounted Safety Prime set for $24, a Uniflow for $80, Lyman 500 for $55, reloading tray for $5. That gets us to $280, which is the sale price of the RCBS Rockchucker kit, but for a much faster turret press. Comparatively, the Lee Turret Kit is $215, but personally, I'd rather pay $65 extra to get a much better powder measure and better powder scale (balance).
The hand trimming, deburring, and chamfering tools in these kits are junk, so I assign no value, and only cost to those items.
Reloadron
Contributing Member
I believe you will find that starter kits have their good and not so good points. One key downside I know you will hear is you get stuff you really don't need and a few things you do need are not in the kit. Calipers come to mind. While this is true you do get a bunch of stuff you will need. Several years ago my brother a late bloomer to reloading and 10 years my junior wanted to get started. Christmas was looming and I figured rather than sit down and piece part things to get him started it was easier to just get him a kit, yes, I am that lazy. Got a sale deal at Cabela's (plus my Cabela's points) on a RockChucker Supreme kit and never looked back. My brother loved it and we discussed what he still needed not in the kit. Overall the kit on sale offered a great price at the time and most of the stuff was needed. Not to say run out and buy a RCBS RockChucker Supreme kit.
I suggest you look at different kits and prices. When you catch a good kit on sale it can be a good deal. Look carefully and note what each kit includes and the quality of what is included, especially the scale. All the manufacturers market the kits so you have plenty of choice. Ask questions on anything you don't understand. Anyway, overall across the board I see a kit as a good way to start.
Ron
I suggest you look at different kits and prices. When you catch a good kit on sale it can be a good deal. Look carefully and note what each kit includes and the quality of what is included, especially the scale. All the manufacturers market the kits so you have plenty of choice. Ask questions on anything you don't understand. Anyway, overall across the board I see a kit as a good way to start.
Ron
Cheesemaker
Member
FWIW - Amazon has the Rockchucker Supreme kit for $237 - their Prime day special (gotta be an Amazon Prime member). That is a very good buy.
Probably today only.
Probably today only.
thomas15
Member
Everyone is telling the OP where to throw his money without knowing what his expectations are with respect to the hobby. No one has asked him what caliber(s) he intends to load and what his approx. monthly ammo needs are.
Everyone is telling the OP what book to buy without knowing what book he already has. In their haste to make sure another beginner purchases the outdated and overrated ABC book, their saying stop the presses and get this one particular book. A book he will look at once or twice, put on his bookshelf and never open again.
Everyone is telling the OP to buy the least expensive "kit" on the market. No one is asking what his budget is or if he wants to replace entry level tools in a very short period of time. No one is saying that "you get what you pay for".
Everyone is telling the OP to buy something. No one is asking the OP if he has a suitable place to set up his reloading gear and to store his supplies.
Cart/Horse.
Everyone is telling the OP what book to buy without knowing what book he already has. In their haste to make sure another beginner purchases the outdated and overrated ABC book, their saying stop the presses and get this one particular book. A book he will look at once or twice, put on his bookshelf and never open again.
Everyone is telling the OP to buy the least expensive "kit" on the market. No one is asking what his budget is or if he wants to replace entry level tools in a very short period of time. No one is saying that "you get what you pay for".
Everyone is telling the OP to buy something. No one is asking the OP if he has a suitable place to set up his reloading gear and to store his supplies.
Cart/Horse.
Last edited:
I have loaded solely with a single stage press for nearly 40 years. The single stage press suits my pace of reloading. And a single stage press makes a new reloader stop and think what he is doing at each stage of the process. i recommend that people get a kit. Yes, some of the stuff included with the kit may be less than optimal, but it will all be serviceable and it will spare you the time and effort of trying to figure out which powder measure, scale, lubricant pad, etc. are "the best".
Like Sunray said, if you choose to buy RCBS, you do it for the fact you can call them up after you've been using your press for 38 years and it all worn out and they'll send you the parts to rebuild it for free. When you consider price difference between equipment, consider that if you keep loading, you will be your press, your dies, powder measure and scale for the rest of your life, so saving pennies per year can turn out to be a false economy.
But, following on with what mdi said, you need one, preferably two, reloading manuals. And then you need to read the first part - the chapters on "how to reload" - thoroughly BEFORE you take the plastic wrap off anything you bought.
Then read those chapters again.
Seriously.
And once you think you understand the process, sit down at your computer and write out a set of reloading procedures. Print a copy out each time you go to the reloading bench and check off each step as you complete it. Yeah, I know I just introduced bean counting into reloading, but I'm sure others will tell you that the first time that checklist saves you from loading a squib - or worse a double charge - you will cherish it. Reloading can be fun, economical, and safe, but remember you are essentially building little pipe bombs, so not respecting the process and being cavalier is the path to being known as "lefty", "one eye" or having a permanent wave in your face.
Once you know enough to draft your own reloading procedures you'll also know enough to critically evalaute the advice you get on this forum.
Like Sunray said, if you choose to buy RCBS, you do it for the fact you can call them up after you've been using your press for 38 years and it all worn out and they'll send you the parts to rebuild it for free. When you consider price difference between equipment, consider that if you keep loading, you will be your press, your dies, powder measure and scale for the rest of your life, so saving pennies per year can turn out to be a false economy.
But, following on with what mdi said, you need one, preferably two, reloading manuals. And then you need to read the first part - the chapters on "how to reload" - thoroughly BEFORE you take the plastic wrap off anything you bought.
Then read those chapters again.
Seriously.
And once you think you understand the process, sit down at your computer and write out a set of reloading procedures. Print a copy out each time you go to the reloading bench and check off each step as you complete it. Yeah, I know I just introduced bean counting into reloading, but I'm sure others will tell you that the first time that checklist saves you from loading a squib - or worse a double charge - you will cherish it. Reloading can be fun, economical, and safe, but remember you are essentially building little pipe bombs, so not respecting the process and being cavalier is the path to being known as "lefty", "one eye" or having a permanent wave in your face.
Once you know enough to draft your own reloading procedures you'll also know enough to critically evalaute the advice you get on this forum.
Last edited:
thomas15
Member
Any of the handloading manuals have limits on what bullet (specific brands) are included in the data section. The Nosler manual is just as good a place to start as any for instruction on how to handload and what things to buy. One might say that the Lee manual is an exception because of the load data however with the Lee manual the trade off is the "how to" section of the book is confusing for no good reason. The Lee manual doesn't have much in the way of brand specific bullet listings. And a lot of that data is old. Is there any real difference between the load data for a Nosler .223 55g fmj and a Hornady .223 55g fmj or a generic .223 55g fmj? The answer is of course , no.
If the beginner needs to supplement his load data because their manual doesn't list lead RN (for example), the simple solution is to ask their local powder dealer for a free copy of the Hodgdon Basic Handloaders Manual or go to Alliant's website and order their free load manual and in a few weeks the mailman will deliver.
thomas15
Member
If you read the OP you will notice in the fine print that he already purchased or otherwise obtained a book.
CptnAwesome
Member
If anybody has already asked I missed it but
What do you plan on loading for?
Pistol?
Large rifle?
Small rifle?
All of the above?
And how much do you shoot, or,,, are you planning to load in large or small batches?
What do you plan on loading for?
Pistol?
Large rifle?
Small rifle?
All of the above?
And how much do you shoot, or,,, are you planning to load in large or small batches?
splattergun
Member
Lots of people use Lee equipment, even those items that we have been assured all "suck", with great success and even pleasure. As a beginner you will need to take such statements with a grain of salt, do your own research, and make your own decisions without the hyperbole.
You will find a very wide range of prices in equipment to meet the needs of most any new reloading victim.. err ... aficionado.
Begin reading, read some more and then start to study.
You will find a very wide range of prices in equipment to meet the needs of most any new reloading victim.. err ... aficionado.
Begin reading, read some more and then start to study.
Dudedog
Contributing Member
Welcome to THR Attila. Lots of great people here.
If you gave us some info on what you were planning on loading and the expected volume it would be a help.
The Lee classic turret would be a good press to start off with if you plan on doing a lot of pistol. It will also work fine for rifle needs.
I the kits save you a little money but I would be more tempted to build. my own set.
I have the Lee Auto drum and am happy with it. I also have a Hornady LNL progressive that I like as well.
Even with the progressive I stiill load small batches on my okld 3 hole Lee turret. *The new Classic 4 hokes are much nicer, than my old "Deluxe" 3 hole)
Reloading is like cars in a way, speed costs so you need an idea of how fast you want.
The other way reloading is like cars is you run in to the Ford/Chevy type thing... alll fords are junk and chevys are great or visa versa.
Most of the equipment on the market works well. So of it not so well but we can give you more ides one we know what you plan on loaing.
If you gave us some info on what you were planning on loading and the expected volume it would be a help.
The Lee classic turret would be a good press to start off with if you plan on doing a lot of pistol. It will also work fine for rifle needs.
I the kits save you a little money but I would be more tempted to build. my own set.
I have the Lee Auto drum and am happy with it. I also have a Hornady LNL progressive that I like as well.
Even with the progressive I stiill load small batches on my okld 3 hole Lee turret. *The new Classic 4 hokes are much nicer, than my old "Deluxe" 3 hole)
Reloading is like cars in a way, speed costs so you need an idea of how fast you want.
The other way reloading is like cars is you run in to the Ford/Chevy type thing... alll fords are junk and chevys are great or visa versa.
Most of the equipment on the market works well. So of it not so well but we can give you more ides one we know what you plan on loaing.
Hondo 60
Member
I started with a "Starter Kit".
It was cheap & I made ammo.
After about 3 or 4 months, I found that the only piece left was the press itself & the reloading manual.
If you're OK with that, the starters will teach you the basics & what's good & bad in 'em.
I didn't have a mentor, I didn't know anyone who reloaded.
So I learned along the way.
The first piece to be replaced was a manual powder hopper.
It leaked & was inaccurate with some powders.
Then I found a primer piece that looked interesting, then a MUCH faster scale.
But like I said, it got me started & I still have the single stage press that I use occasionally.
(and the manual that gets used on a regular basis)
Any time "Lee" reloading equipment is mentioned, some "Lee Hater" crawls out from underneath his rock and spews his "wisdom" about the "junk" made by Lee. Ignore it if you want to get a factual, real life look at various loading tools/equipment. I have a mixed color bench (most of today's reloading tool manufacturer's tools) and each has it's drawbacks and each has it's shining points. Mentioned above was a Lee Perfect Powder Measure. I've used one for 25+ years, (not the same one as I donated one and sold a bunch of equipment during a messy divorce) and just like a high dollar measure it has it's preferred powders (I used a lot of W231 and could hold less then .1 grain from throw to throw). Lee has a "bad name" mostly from those ignorant of innovative manufacturing processes (I don't remember much ado about Ruger's use of sheet metal and investment casting for handguns), and of course those too smart to read the instructions. I have used Lee products and have never had any of the problems that the Haters rave about, but I know how to use hand tools (life long machinist/mechanic).
Research each tool you want to try, pay little attention to forum "experts" and you'll be fine with any manufacturer's tools you choose...
Research each tool you want to try, pay little attention to forum "experts" and you'll be fine with any manufacturer's tools you choose...
bullseye308
Member
First things first, you need to determine a few things and that will help guide you in the right direction.
Which calibers will you reload?
How many of each do you expect to load in a year(double it)?
What will they be used for(plinking, target, hunting, self defense)?
What is your initial budget?
How much time can you dedicate to this new endeavor?
Do you have someplace to load and store components?
Can you be dedicated to keeping good notes?
Personally I started with a Lee Anniversary Kit back in 89 and started loading 30-30, 7.62x39, and 7.62x54R with no mentor or Internet. Just the Lee book that came with the kit was all I had to learn from back then. I'm still loading with some of that kit and have added 2 Reloader presses and a Loadmaster. For years I simply used the single stage press, the Lee safety scale, a harbor freight caliper, and hot soapy water with vinegar to clean my brass.
When I started shooting much more I got the Loadmaster and was shooting 16-18k per year and still used the single stage frequently for many things. Now that I'm only shooting 6-8k per year I do almost all loading on the Reloader press and weigh every powder charge and check every round in a gauge and mic it. Time I have aplenty, obviously.
Lee products work, and work well. In the event you get one with an issue they will take care of it. I have gone through 3 safety scales(keep dropping them), broke a pivot contraption on an early "O" press, and a decapping pin or 3. Lee replaced them all hassle free even when I explained I broke them by my carelessness. So far one of my Reloader presses has loaded around 150,000 rounds and is still going strong. Not bad for a $35 press. My Loadmaster has loaded around 500,000 rounds and is still going strong with a few adjustments here and there.
With that said, my only experience is with Lee tools and I have found they work, and work well. You may have a similar experience with them or not. You may try a different brand and have nothing but a great time with great hardware. All brands offer good product or they wouldn't still be available and whichever brand or color you go with will get the job done.
Which calibers will you reload?
How many of each do you expect to load in a year(double it)?
What will they be used for(plinking, target, hunting, self defense)?
What is your initial budget?
How much time can you dedicate to this new endeavor?
Do you have someplace to load and store components?
Can you be dedicated to keeping good notes?
Personally I started with a Lee Anniversary Kit back in 89 and started loading 30-30, 7.62x39, and 7.62x54R with no mentor or Internet. Just the Lee book that came with the kit was all I had to learn from back then. I'm still loading with some of that kit and have added 2 Reloader presses and a Loadmaster. For years I simply used the single stage press, the Lee safety scale, a harbor freight caliper, and hot soapy water with vinegar to clean my brass.
When I started shooting much more I got the Loadmaster and was shooting 16-18k per year and still used the single stage frequently for many things. Now that I'm only shooting 6-8k per year I do almost all loading on the Reloader press and weigh every powder charge and check every round in a gauge and mic it. Time I have aplenty, obviously.
Lee products work, and work well. In the event you get one with an issue they will take care of it. I have gone through 3 safety scales(keep dropping them), broke a pivot contraption on an early "O" press, and a decapping pin or 3. Lee replaced them all hassle free even when I explained I broke them by my carelessness. So far one of my Reloader presses has loaded around 150,000 rounds and is still going strong. Not bad for a $35 press. My Loadmaster has loaded around 500,000 rounds and is still going strong with a few adjustments here and there.
With that said, my only experience is with Lee tools and I have found they work, and work well. You may have a similar experience with them or not. You may try a different brand and have nothing but a great time with great hardware. All brands offer good product or they wouldn't still be available and whichever brand or color you go with will get the job done.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
Welcome to THR. As you see we will need more info to help you better.
I'm using 2 presets right now, a Lee CLASSIC Turret Press and an RCBS Rockchucker. Both are very good and have their uses.
I'm using 2 presets right now, a Lee CLASSIC Turret Press and an RCBS Rockchucker. Both are very good and have their uses.
thomas15
Member
rskent
Member
I don’t think the Lee kit for $120 includes the Lee reloading manual. I started with the Lee kit that has the manual. I still use the manual and the press is set up as a designated 223 sizing press.
The powder drop did leak a bit, but I used it for over a year. I used the scale for several years. It’s a good scale, slow, but good.
If I was going to start over I would pick one pistol caliber. Buy a kit with a manual, a set of dies that comes with a shell holder, and a case gauge. After I decided on a first load, powder, primers, and projectiles.
The powder drop did leak a bit, but I used it for over a year. I used the scale for several years. It’s a good scale, slow, but good.
If I was going to start over I would pick one pistol caliber. Buy a kit with a manual, a set of dies that comes with a shell holder, and a case gauge. After I decided on a first load, powder, primers, and projectiles.
Demi-human
maybe likes firearms a little bit…
I didn't realize that one needed to be an "Expert" to comment.
But, suppose that the original poster is just looking for some experience from other hand loaders and what they did when they were starting out. That would make more sense.
To that, this one suggests jumping in with both feet. Any kit will be a very good start. And any tools that are replaced along the way could be saved for other future hand loaders, sons or daughters. A basic tool is invaluable to one that has none.
I am curious. How many are unable to learn anything else about a particular subject.
A show of hands if you are not an "Expert Handloader"..............yet.
Edited for phrasing.
Last edited:
Klint Beastwood
member
- Joined
- Jul 12, 2017
- Messages
- 622
Yeah I would start with a cheap starter kit, it doesnt have to be lee but I've never had a problem with it. I like single stage presses but that it because doing long range precision work ups, i like to give immense attention to each round being developed. However I kept my starting lee turret press, it makes .223 and .45 plinking ammo quick and easy. need not be super precise...not for plinking, not for me. The problem with investing in quality gear is, like many, after a few months of doing it, you might grow to hate it. I've been reloading for years and I hate it, but i still do it.
Last edited:
Varminterror
Member
- Joined
- Jul 17, 2016
- Messages
- 15,203
@mdi might not care for my honest opinion about the Lee Perfect Powder Measure, or about handheld trimming tools like the Lee cutter and lock stud or the stubby little, skinny debur and chamfer tool from RCBS, or about the Lee safety powder scale, but I'll stand by my opinions.
I too have a mixed color bench, and I'm no Lee Hater. You'll note, I recommended the Lee turret press, the RCBS uniflow, and Lyman powder scale all in the same sentence above.
I have a lot of Lee equipment, including all of these items listed above. The perfect powder measure leaks more and isn't as reliable or precise on adjustment as any of the other brands I have used (blue, green, orange, and the other red). For those reasons, I recommend new reloaders away from the perfect powder measure. They work - any measure throws powder - but they leak more, and tuning is more difficult than other brands. The Autodrum is ok, but I've found it very clunky compared to the hornady measure for press activation. The safety scale is generally ok if you mind your P's and Q's, but I've noted I get more "hangs" with the Lee than the RCBS 505 or 1010, the little plastic fractional grain slider is easy to bump out of position, and the advancing ball bearing can shift your weight depending upon where it sits in the troughs. I added a drop of CA to hold my calibration weight in place, I've never had one move after repeated bumping, but it's always made me itch. I do the same for the calibration leg on the RCBS, to ensure they don't drift.
My hate for "finger tip held" trimming, chamfer, and debuting tools isn't irrational bias either. When I have a bucket of a few hundred brass in front of me, or many more, I cringe at the thought of using my fingertips to hold AND POWER the cutters. A lathe type trimmer and a powered case prep station - of any brand - is a worthwhile investment. I have a hornady and an RCBS for trimmers, and hornady and Lyman for powered prep centers.
I use a LOT of Lee dies, and frankly, I like some features of the Lee dies better than I do Hornady or RCBS dies.
I have 5 Lee presses. Two pro 1000's, two classic turrets, and an Anniversary single stage as a universal recapped. I also have two Forster Co-ax's, and a Redding T7 (boxed on the shelf now). I have owned a Dillon and RCBS progressive.
Would you call me a Hornady hater because I have had 3 Hornady LNL Autocharge dispensers crap out on me and I now recommend against them to would-be buyers? I own hundreds of dollars of their other equipment which I use every round I load, but that ONE tool they make has real, known issues. Some of the Lee tools do too. I boxed up my Redding T7 because it's not as fast as my Lee Turrets, it costs more, and it doesn't make rounds with any less run out. Am I a Redding hater too? Guess I better sell all of my Redding dies.
Guys can get bent out of shape when someone points out how a Lexus IS a better car than their beloved Chevy, but it doesn't change the facts - there are specific weaknesses for the Lee tools I recommended against, and weaknesses for many of the tools included in ANY BRAND loading kits. A newbie will be well served to avoid potential headaches.
I too have a mixed color bench, and I'm no Lee Hater. You'll note, I recommended the Lee turret press, the RCBS uniflow, and Lyman powder scale all in the same sentence above.
I have a lot of Lee equipment, including all of these items listed above. The perfect powder measure leaks more and isn't as reliable or precise on adjustment as any of the other brands I have used (blue, green, orange, and the other red). For those reasons, I recommend new reloaders away from the perfect powder measure. They work - any measure throws powder - but they leak more, and tuning is more difficult than other brands. The Autodrum is ok, but I've found it very clunky compared to the hornady measure for press activation. The safety scale is generally ok if you mind your P's and Q's, but I've noted I get more "hangs" with the Lee than the RCBS 505 or 1010, the little plastic fractional grain slider is easy to bump out of position, and the advancing ball bearing can shift your weight depending upon where it sits in the troughs. I added a drop of CA to hold my calibration weight in place, I've never had one move after repeated bumping, but it's always made me itch. I do the same for the calibration leg on the RCBS, to ensure they don't drift.
My hate for "finger tip held" trimming, chamfer, and debuting tools isn't irrational bias either. When I have a bucket of a few hundred brass in front of me, or many more, I cringe at the thought of using my fingertips to hold AND POWER the cutters. A lathe type trimmer and a powered case prep station - of any brand - is a worthwhile investment. I have a hornady and an RCBS for trimmers, and hornady and Lyman for powered prep centers.
I use a LOT of Lee dies, and frankly, I like some features of the Lee dies better than I do Hornady or RCBS dies.
I have 5 Lee presses. Two pro 1000's, two classic turrets, and an Anniversary single stage as a universal recapped. I also have two Forster Co-ax's, and a Redding T7 (boxed on the shelf now). I have owned a Dillon and RCBS progressive.
Would you call me a Hornady hater because I have had 3 Hornady LNL Autocharge dispensers crap out on me and I now recommend against them to would-be buyers? I own hundreds of dollars of their other equipment which I use every round I load, but that ONE tool they make has real, known issues. Some of the Lee tools do too. I boxed up my Redding T7 because it's not as fast as my Lee Turrets, it costs more, and it doesn't make rounds with any less run out. Am I a Redding hater too? Guess I better sell all of my Redding dies.
Guys can get bent out of shape when someone points out how a Lexus IS a better car than their beloved Chevy, but it doesn't change the facts - there are specific weaknesses for the Lee tools I recommended against, and weaknesses for many of the tools included in ANY BRAND loading kits. A newbie will be well served to avoid potential headaches.
Last edited:
thomas15
Member
^^^ It is fair to say that we all come to this activity (handloading) with our overall attitude towards shooting and the shooting sports in general as a basic foundation. While I'm not a top competitor by any stretch of the imagination, the fact is my father started me out at age 9 in the highly disciplined world of 3 and 4 position smallbore competition and this has guided my feelings about firearms and shooting for the last 50 years.
What that means, and this is not intended to insult anyone, but competitive shooters in general are accustomed to using specialty items not generally available at a local gun shop and their definition of accuracy is usually much more rigid than the casual shooter. Although I know many who compete on a regular basis who give little attention to such mundane details such as a basic understanding of the actual rules of the sport, handgun grip, sight picture and so forth, most are the opposite and place handloading in the same category as the rest of their gear and procedures for shooting. By that I mean they want to give themselves every available advantage in their quest to improve their performance during a match.
All this to say that the shooter who wants to handload but is an occasional shooter or even competes for something to do on a Saturday afternoon is going to be less fussy about their handloading bench that the individual that is striving to do better. Those who think like me are more likely to shy away from anything considered entry level. Again this is not an insult to anyone but rather an explanation of the thinking behind many who look at plastic and say "I want better".
What that means, and this is not intended to insult anyone, but competitive shooters in general are accustomed to using specialty items not generally available at a local gun shop and their definition of accuracy is usually much more rigid than the casual shooter. Although I know many who compete on a regular basis who give little attention to such mundane details such as a basic understanding of the actual rules of the sport, handgun grip, sight picture and so forth, most are the opposite and place handloading in the same category as the rest of their gear and procedures for shooting. By that I mean they want to give themselves every available advantage in their quest to improve their performance during a match.
All this to say that the shooter who wants to handload but is an occasional shooter or even competes for something to do on a Saturday afternoon is going to be less fussy about their handloading bench that the individual that is striving to do better. Those who think like me are more likely to shy away from anything considered entry level. Again this is not an insult to anyone but rather an explanation of the thinking behind many who look at plastic and say "I want better".
- Status
