Starting over with handgun shooting

[Monkeyleg]

For reasons too boring to list, I haven't been able to shoot a gun for most of this year. And I honestly can't remember the last time I shot a handgun. May have been in March, or even as early as January.

I went out today with my .45 commander-size pistol. It was like I'd never shot a handgun in my life. I was all over the paper.

That's the way it was back in 1999 or so, when I got back into shooting handguns. And it took me a couple of years and thousands of rounds before I could shoot a target that experienced shooters at my club would say looked good. Not great, but good.

My biggest problem is shaking. It wasn't a problem when I was in my thirties, but it's been a consistent problem since I started again in 1999, and just seems to get worse.

I'm sure that all of the fine points will come back to me: grip, breathing, sight picture, follow-through, etc.

The shakiness, though, is another thing. Even when I was shooting well a couple of years ago, that was a problem. If I could lose that, I'd bet I could outshoot the best of the bunch at my club.

I'm skinny, and don't have the even moderately-muscular arms that I see on the good shooters. Even when I tried weight-lifting, I didn't build up any kind of arm muscle. The only thing I accomplished with lifting weights was to damage various body parts.

Anywho...

If anyone else has been through this and has any advice, it would be much appreciated.

************************

Just a side note on being skinny: I've had very physical jobs all my life, and very physical hobbies. No matter how much I could lift, no matter how strong I was, no matter how much I ate or what I ate, I've always been skinny. Go figure.

 

[Standing Wolf]

I'm skinny, and don't have the even moderately-muscular arms that I see on the good shooters. Even when I tried weight-lifting, I didn't build up any kind of arm muscle.

I'll bet my arms have less meat than yours, friend! I could run like the wind as a boy and young man, but have never had any upper body musculature to speak of. That's just the way people in my family were built.

I've found exercise helps. It doesn't add muscule mass to me, but seems to increase strength a bit, and gives me more control during aiming. I've lately added hand exercises to my daily regimen, partly to allieviate the adverse effects of arthritis and keyboarding and mousing, partly because I figure at the very worst, there's not much chance I'll do any damage.

I shoot air pistol every day. I dry-shoot regular pistols at least two evenings a week. Whenever I grip a gun, I squeeze the stocks until the front sight starts to shake, then back off until it steadies back down. I shoot bullseye two evenings a week, and always bring home my targets, score them, and tally and average my scores. I'd like to average around 850, 40 X out of a possible 900, 90 X. I'm averaging around 830, 20 X. There's probably no very great chance I'll ever add those 20 points to my average, but without a definite goal, I'm sure I'd just flounder and make no improvements.

Choose a shooting discipline. Persist. Figure out where you stand. Set some goals. Work toward them, and persist in working.

Any idiot can point and click. It takes a great deal of practice and effort to shoot hand guns well.

 

[pauli]

get thee to a 22 (with some weight to it). regular trips to the range with that will get you back in shooting condition, and will build the endurance (not strength) you need for shooting. once you've got the 22 under control, start shooting your 45 again.

for the cost of one 45acp round, you can shoot a magazine (or two) of 22lr... and that'll benefit you a whole lot more.

my hands tend to shake as well. personally, i don't bother shooting my 357 unless i'm feeling pretty darn stable with the 22 that day. there's just no point in burning up expensive ammo when i'm not going to accomplish anything. sure, the weight of the big steel revolver helps a lot, but not as much as practice.

 

[telomerase]

no shake recipe

Exercise, and give up your trimethylxanthine* addiction (bad for blood flow to the brain anyway).


*aka caffeine

 

[Monkeyleg]

Thanks for the advice.

Standing Wolf, if you're skinnier than me, you could be my shadow.

telomerase, I don't take caffeine in any form--coffee, soda, or even headache remedies--and haven't done so in over twenty years.

OTOH, I chain smoke, so there's lots of nicoteine coursing through my veins.

Next month, it's time for my wife and I to quit smoking. That's our deadline.

 

[WarMachine]

Slightly off topic, but if you start up a dedicated (STAY FOCUSED) exercise regime and actually stick to it, even the smalled and thinnest of us can bulk up. I have been doing the same thing myself.

I eat a LOT of calories a day (nutrional foods of proteins, carbs, fibers, veggies/fruits, etc.), and strength and endurance exercises 4-5 times a week. I have noticed not only an increase in size from my previous skeleton-like figure, but also an increase in upper body strength which has helped me to improve my shooting.

Try holding a 15-20lb weight strait out in front of you for a while, and them pick up a pistol and do the same. It makes the pistol feel like a piece of cork

 

[SpookyPistolero]

I feel your pain in being an ultra-thin shooter, it's the pits. And it's really hard to 'bulk up'. I've been working construction for a good while now and have barely gained strengh, and still have trouble beating the wobbly shakes at the range. Winter is a good friend, because underneath those long sleeved shirts you can wear some of those wrist weights all day. After a while, you're used to something extra out there, and every little bit helps. Like others said, consistency and persistence in weight training will eventually pay off.

 

[GregGry]

I figure I will offer some advice as far as strength goes..
Being bulky, and strong, are two different things. You can have both, but it depends on your body type. I have seen guys with huge arms (that look like they could bench 350+ pounds), barely be able to bench press 160 pounds, and I have seen little 5'7" tall guys bench over 200, yet they looked like they could bench no more then 120 pounds.

Some people have body types where they have a very hard time gaining muscle, however if they work out right, they can gain lots of strength. My best friend is a small guy (5'7) and he doesn't have the biggest arms on the block, but he can bench 150+ % of his body weight, which is insane for how he looks. You don't have to look like a hulk to be strong, just like you can look like a hulk and be weak considering how much muscle you have.

I have never known someone that would not gain strength when lifting weights. Unless your body is not doing well, if you work out, you can gain strength. You must work out properly, and do specific exercises for your body type. It sounds to me that you thin skinny guys are built of primarily dark meat, you probably have good endurance (can swim for a while, run, etc). The problem is you can say lift 60 pound bags of concrete all day and not tire, yet if you try to do heavy lifting, you can't keep up. Versus a guy like me, who can lift heavy and medium weight, however my endurance isn't that great. Its likely that I will get tired at the same point be it lifting 60 or 80 pound bags. Its not so much of a weight issue, as it is how long I am under the strain. Kind of like in the bench press, give me a 170 pound barbell, and I will rep it a bunch of times. Give me a lighter (like around 130 pound barbell) and ask me to rep it many times, and I will tire out way before I should considering the amount of weight I can bench. That's due to the type of muscle I have.

You skinny guys that are made out of dark meat, could run laps around me on the track, but put 150 pounds on your back (mine as well) and I would very likely outlast you by far. If you skinny guys want to gain strength, its best to do low reps of heavy weights. Depending on how much dark meat you are composed of, it might be very demanding of your body. The key is to find the ideal number of reps. I prefer to stay in the 4 to 12 rep range (mostly 4 to 8 for most exercises), but I am mostly white meat. For someone composed of mostly dark meat, 4 reps will likely be to taxing, a good starting point would be 8 to 12).

It will be hard to lift heavy, but it will help you gain strength. Just like if I were to lift light (but high reps) I could increase my endurance a lot, but it would take a lot longer (and be harder for me to do) to do that, compared to increasing strength. I am pretty fortunate that even when I train with high reps low weight, I still gain strength, and muscle mass. Its just not as much as compared to lifting heavy, but I still do. Don't lose hope you guys, if you stick to a gym routine, eat good food/ lots of protein you will gain strength

I'm skinny, and don't have the even moderately-muscular arms that I see on the good shooters. Even when I tried weight-lifting, I didn't build up any kind of arm muscle. The only thing I accomplished with lifting weights was to damage various body parts.

If you didn't build muscle, you weren't lifting right, and the fact you mentioned that you damaged body parts, tells me that was the case for sure. I have been lifting weights for a long time now, and I have yet to suffer any injuries. Granted I have not taxed myself to the extent that I could be. Proper form is critical, it doesn't matter if you do 100 reps of a weight, if your not doing it right, it wont matter. I still have not so great form sometimes, and I do stupid things like bench without a spotter, but I still play it safe, and use weights I can handle. For a skinny non muscular guy, trying to lift heavy without proper form is a recipe for disaster. Even trying to lift heavy right away after starting a new workout routine is a accident waiting to happen.

Also, before I go, I want to mention that your bodies bone structure will play a big role as well. Guys with short arms typically do better at curls/bench press. I am a big guy (6'6 with a 6'9" finger tip to tip measurement when I spread my arms) and although you would think a man of my size would be able to rock things like the bench press, the reality is the opposite. When I bench a weight, I have a huge distance to cover with the bar, easily atleast 3 more inches then most. If I could eliminate 3 inches of travel I have to go through (perferably at the bottom of the rep) I could easily handle 25 to 30 pounds more. I could bulk up my chest, which would allow me to bench heavier, yet I could quite possibly be not any stronger.

Short arms aren't good when it comes to dead lifting, because you have to pick the weight up and bring it up really high. Granted since I am so tall, I still have to bring it up high, but my arms are long enough that I can still do well at it. If I had short arms It would be a whole lot harder for me. It just goes to show that nobody has the ideal body type for everything.

Also, to make you guys feel better, I had the most lanky arms of anyone, for the longest time. Even now after lifting weights for a long time, my wrists are still skinny. I could focus on them some more to get them to bulk up, but I have tried it a couple times, and it never really worked.

I have included some pictures for you guys to see my how even guys with skinny arms can bulk up (your results will vary ) The first picture is what my left arm looked like about 1 year ago (I was trying to make a muscle for the shot while showing off my new tattoo, as you can see there wasn't any muscle to work with lol). The second shot shows my right arm (left is the same) In may of this year. About 5 months of moderate working out totaly changed my arms. Not only has most of the fat left (and muscle replace it) but I have increased my strength considerably.

EDIT, yes that is a can of beer in my hand

 

[Boarhunter]

Yet another point not to forget.

Every shooter has the shakes to some extent, and a shooter can become so focused on eliminating all shake that he looses sight of the fact that Trigger Control is far more significant to good shooting than totally eliminating the sight's waiver across the target.

I shoot a good bit, but never improved significantly until I accepted the fact that I can not stop all shaking and focused on improved trigger pull.

Work out; get strong; but work on Trigger Control as well.


Boarhunter

 

[Monkeyleg]

GregGry, your reference to us skinny guys as "dark meat" makes me feel like a turkey.

Thanks for the insight, though. It will help me figure out how to exercise properly, which is obviously what I need to do.

One advantage of being skinny I noticed back in high school was that I could do pull-ups all day, climb the rope to the ceiling of the gym, do gymnastics, and all sorts of things that the football players could not. Used to drive them crazy.

The endurance aspect also paid off when I was dating.

 

[pax]

Dick ~

I've helped a lot of shaky old guys learn (or re-learn) how to shoot. Biggest thing is, ignore the dang shakes! Don't worry about them at all.

Point your gun in the general direction of the target. Line up your sights as well as you can. Focus completely on the front sight, line it up on target as best you can, accept the wobble, and smoothly press the trigger.

Don't try to stop the shakes. The harder you fight the shakes, the worse your shooting will get.

Whatever you do, don't try to grab the magic moment when the front sight is absolutely, perfectly, 100% aligned with the bullseye.

Accept your wobble. Know that your shots will land somewhere within the wobble zone and pull the trigger smoothly. That wobble zone which seems huge from the shooter's perspective is really very small; no matter how bad the shakes are, the wobble zone is almost always a circle less than 2" diameter at 10 yards.

If you try to grab the shot within the fleeting instant your sights are absolutely lined up, your shots will go everywhere except into that 2" wobble-zone circle which includes the bullseye.

If you have trouble believing this and have access to a laser-equipped handgun, you can use it to graphically see how small your wobble zone really is. Just line everything up, and then watch what the dot does. It'll wiggle around out there, but the overall circle is going to be pretty small no matter how badly you shake.

pax

 

[Janitor]

Next month, it's time for my wife and I to quit smoking. That's our deadline.

Go for it - stick with it. I quit just over two weeks ago and it's been 100% positive. Good support from someone helps a lot.

Keep your deadline.

pax

+1

 

[trickyasafox]

greggry- it does suck being tall lifting. im in a similar boat. though i disagree he's doing things wrong. some people just can't pack on mass. im 6'4'' which compared to you really isnt all that tall. though i am much thicker. i'd try modifying your diet first. you may avoid caffine but their are a lot of other substances that make ya jittery. things from nicotine to even sugars can all give you the symptoms you have.

have you considered just trying to hold your firearm for a few minutes a day, just to build muscle memory? you wont really gain strength, but your body can get used to the repetitive motion.

 

[GregGry]

though i disagree he's doing things wrong. some people just can't pack on mass.

Some people don't pack on mass, but you don't need mass to be strong. My best friend is a skinny guy, and sure his arms show muscle, they aren't exactly big at all. Just looking at him you wouldn't think he was as strong as he is. Some people are destined to be skinny for most of their lives, but you can still be strong. You may never look like a body builder, but it doesn't mean you can't lift heavy weights like one.

 

[Monkeyleg]

Pax, I don't know if you or other readers of this thread have ever taken Massay Ayoob's LFI course, but I did about three years ago.

One of the lessons is focused on how to shoot through the shakes. You're instructed to hold your gun like Don Knotts: IOW, shake like crazy.

I did better in that exercise than I did the other day.

What's frustrating about all this is that I devoted some three or four years and thousands of rounds to get back to where I was in my thirties. And now I have to start all over again.

Handgun shooting is not like riding a bicycle.You do forget.

 

[pax]

Monkeyleg ~

Yes, I've taken that course. But I'd already learned to shoot through the shakes, since because of my asthma I have to use albuterol fairly often -- and it always makes me shake like crazy.

You know you'll get back to where you were. It'll come back to you fairly quick once you get hsooting again.

pax

Shooting is a perishable skill, but regular practice is a good preservative. -- me.