Stick with DD 5.56 AR - rebarrel for more accuracy?

[Captain33036]

Hello

I have a DD AR upper chambered in 5.56 NATO, 1:7 twist. 16" Govt profile.

It seems very accurate, even with LC 55gr 5.56 and bulk 55gr .223 ammunition. I seem to be able to get 0.33 in groups at 25 yards , informal indoor shooting (no lead sled). And can hit a soda can at 150 yards outdoors (again, just resting elbows on a bench). (1-1.5 MOA?)

Have a CMC trigger on the lower and free float the barrel on the upper.

I have the parts to build a second upper, except for the barrel. Not sure whether or not it is worth it.

SO, would a Wylde chambered, 1:8 twist SS 18" barrel be significantly more accurate than the DD one I have?

Thanks
J

 

[68wj]

SO, would a Wylde chambered, 1:8 twist SS 18" barrel be significantly more accurate than the DD one I have?

Doesn't sound like it.

 

[Captain33036]

It seems that most national match AR competitors shoot guns with Wylde chambers. So....I am curious.

I realize that ammo selection influences accuracy most...but ....would a barrel with a Wylde chamber and 1:8 twist be more accurate for most 55-69gr rounds than a 1:7 twist 5.56 one?

Thanks

 

[HOOfan_1]

How much accuracy do you need?

 

[Warp]

How much accuracy do you need?

Good question.


Also, regular old bulk Federal Lake City XM193 is only going to be so accurate. Have you tried, say, Prvi Partizan 75gr BTHP Match? It is often available for $0.50/round. Have you tried Black Hills mk262 or any other good load using the 77gr SMK? Do you or have you considered hand loading?

 

[Captain33036]

Hello and thanks for the replies

I do hand load, have everything I need for .223, just have not done it for this caliber yet.

I want all the accuracy I can get. If it would take me from 1-1.5 MOA to sub MOA, I would get it in a heartbeat.

I can spend $200 and get a stainless steel, 18 inch hbar barrel, Wylde chamber, 1:8 twist with a target crown, from a good maker.

Is it worth spending that money and getting this barrel, if you already have a DD 5.56 1:7 twist govt profile barrel, standard flash suppressor?

Does anyone have any real world experience shooting both?

Thanks, I appreciate the input.

 

[HOOfan_1]

If you want the best accuracy...yeah buying from a custom shop like White Oak Armament would give you better accuracy than a Chrome lined barrel...but that hammer forged chrome lined DD barrel will last longer.

If I wanted a more accurate rifle, for competition or varmint hunting, I wouldn't replace my Daniel Defense, because I use that for blasting away at the range with open sights. I would just buy a new upper.

 

[Reloadron]

You have a rifle that shoots very good based on your accounts. You do hand load but have yet to load 223.

If I were you I would first do as suggested and try some match quality ammunition in the heavier 75 grain flavors. Then I would get serious with rolling some of your own ammunition and see what you get. That done and depending on the results only then would I worry about another barrel and while there are many good barrels out there I would likely be thinking Krieger or maybe Shilen. Either way I would do some serious handloading first and see what I had.

Just My Take
Ron

 

[Sam1911]

As others said, good ammo is your friend. Off-the-shelf factory ammo is going to hold you back with any barrel.

"I want all the accuracy I can get." Well, you can have all the accuracy you want to pay for. Accuracy in itself isn't a goal, it is a means to achieving a goal. It is a tool that helps you make the hits you want to make. The question is how much accuracy is it practical to purchase? What are you doing with the gun and what accuracy level meets that goal? Building another Gov't style upper would seem like a fool's errand, considering the known great one you have (which would probably excel if fed tailored handloads).

If you want to build a precision upper for long range varmints, precision rifle matches, or paper punching off the bench, you'll probably want something different than what you have now. (Heavier, longer, ???)

But if your goal is shooting soda cans at 150 yds, resting on your elbows, congrat's! You're there!

If your goal is more along the lines of having a "patrol rifle" that you can take to carbine classes and 3-gun matches, you already have more than sufficient accuracy with your current setup.

 

[Captain33036]

Hi Sam and everyone

Thank you for the replies. Yes, the goal is to have a precision AR for paper punching.

I have all the parts for a second upper, except the barrel and another BCG (of course could swap out the one in the DD).

Trying to assess how much more accuracy you get out of a Wylde chamber, 1:8 barrel for the cost.

Thanks

 

[Sam1911]

I don't think anyone will be able to say how much more accuracy you can get out of the Wylde chamber. We don't know what your rifle's mechanical accuracy limit is now. Being able to hit a soda can at 150 yds, resting on your elbows, shooting factory M193 just shows that the accuracy of that rifle must be "good." How good? Who knows?

If you said you're using a higher-magnification scope, very good bench rests/bags and tailored handloaded ammo (or high-quality match ammo) and you got 1.25" groups at 100 yds, we could probably say that a better barrel would improve your group size by some rough percentage. (Probably about half, I'd think.)

Given what you know now, and the way you're shooting now, I really don't think a Wylde-chambered barrel is going to make any noticeable difference at all. You're going to hit that soda can either way!

Until you're shooting with the long-range precision setup and ammo that will let you see what your rifle can do now, I don't think we can offer anything concrete. Your barrel now might print 2" groups at 300 yds, with the right ammo and great technique.

If you're really keen to buy a barrel and build another upper, regardless, yeah get a Wylde chamber!

 

[Captain33036]

Hi Sam

Really appreciate the advice. I have been concentrating on shooting pistols for BE, so, not much effort on my AR, right now.

I have been looking at a lot of reviews, however, and keep seeing that 1:8 twist rifles do very well. Case in point, look at the Spring 2014 issue of the G&A AR-15 rag. Not one...again...not one.... 1:7 gun shot better than 1MOA. While 2 of 3 1:8 twist guns shot sub MOA. Guns tested were DD, YHM, Ruger, Colt and POF.

Does that mean much....probably not...but...given this is 5 guns, shot with roughly similar ammo, and a wide variety of ammo, by shooters who should be better than me....it is information.

Unfortunately, the three 1:8 twist guns were all very different. The POF one had their new 5.56 E2 chamber. But, the Ruger, with the SS 1:8 twist barrel, with a target crown, shot the best of the 5.

Interestingly, the only guns that RRA will guarantee 0.75 accuracy for are the ones with SS barrels with Wylde chambers, 1:8 twist and target crowns.

But....for all that....from what I am reading....you are getting only about 0.25 MOA more accuracy (unless you are getting one of the expensive, high end barrels mentioned by someone above). And ...obviously, you have to know whether or not YOU can get that accuracy out of that gun.

Oh well...so...still on the fence. Before I get deep into a project, I want to make sure I am using the best tool I can afford.

 

[Reloadron]

I have to give you credit for Homework 101. I will add that given a choice I will take the crowned muzzle (I like an 11 degree crown) hands down over any flash suppressor or similar. My best shooting 223 AR is an old Double Star receiver with a 1:8 Kreiger barrel crowned at 11 degrees. A good trigger helps considerably too as well as working up different hand loads.

Ron

 

[eldon519]

I think you'd be better off just having two rifles. I'm not sure as to the full specs of your existing rifle, but it would be kinda weird feeling to me to have a HBAR barrel and a carbine telescoping stock on it. If I had a heavy barrel on it, I'd probably like one of the heavier, fatter rifle stocks that actually allows for a consistent cheek weld. Maybe even an adjustable stock if you are really going for precision. Likewise, such a stock would feel kind of out of place if you swapped back to your carbine upper.

I'd prefer to have a light(ish) patrol carbine with good accuracy such as you have now and then a second heavier setup meant for more static target shooting or hunting.

 

[carbine85]

A good quality stainless heavy barrel should give you the best accuracy. Stainless is typically a more accurate barrel.
My RRA Varmit will out shoot any of my other ARs,

 

[Ar180shooter]

Hello

I have a DD AR upper chambered in 5.56 NATO, 1:7 twist. 16" Govt profile.

It seems very accurate, even with LC 55gr 5.56 and bulk 55gr .223 ammunition. I seem to be able to get 0.33 in groups at 25 yards , informal indoor shooting (no lead sled). And can hit a soda can at 150 yards outdoors (again, just resting elbows on a bench). (1-1.5 MOA?)

Have a CMC trigger on the lower and free float the barrel on the upper.

I have the parts to build a second upper, except for the barrel. Not sure whether or not it is worth it.

SO, would a Wylde chambered, 1:8 twist SS 18" barrel be significantly more accurate than the DD one I have?

Thanks
J

As others have said, how much accuracy do you need? A 2MOA gun can engage a man sized target out to 500 yards with a 100% hit ratio, as long as you are capable of it. Food for thought.

 

[Captain33036]

Thanks everyone, I appreciate all the responses.

From what I have found thus far, a GOOD, stock AR is capable of 1-1.5MOA accuracy. My DD is in that range, I think.

A SS barrel is a +
A Wylde chamber is a +
1:8 is a +
Hbar or heavy is a +
Target crown is a +

.... in terms of accuracy.

SO....since I have all the parts to build a second upper, I have decided to go ahead and get a SS barrel, from a reputable maker, with all the attributes above. I think this barrel will get me sub MOA groups. That will enable me to take my long rifle shooting to the level I want.

And. I will then have two uppers. One set up for close in shooting. One for long range, target shooting.

Just a matter of spending about $200-300. I think it is worth it. Just a matter of the money.

Appreciate all the advice.

 

[Warp]

When you quote 1-1.5 MOA, are you hand picking 3 shot groups from the bench?

Are you talking five or more groups of five or more rounds averaging 1-1.5" at 100 yards?

 

[mavracer]

Yep this is how it starts lol, before long you'll be building another lower, and then...................