strange 911 police action- opinion?

[Jeff White]

Ahh the 911 hangup, every officer's pain in the posterior call. Yes they happen all the time. Sometimes it is a hardware problem. Here the telecommunicator will call the number back. An officer is still dispatched even if the homeowner says everything is all right.

We have two 911 dispatch centers in the county I work in. Each handles calls to half of the county. Calls are forwarded from the dispatch center to the approriate police agency, but fire and EMS are dispatched direct.

One night the cell phone in my squad rang. It was the county sheriff's dispatcher (they dispatch us too). The deputies were all busy at a disturbance at the other end of the county, about 25 miles away. The dispatcher said they had a 911 hangup at an address in the country about 6 miles Northwest of the city I work for and would I be kind enough to go up there and check it for them. I said I would and off I went. I get up close to the address she gave me and figured it would have to be the next house, well the next house was a mile and a half down the road and about 10 numbers different. Got on the phone and called dispatch and asked if they had a name to go with the number....No name, 911 just forwarded the number. I called the 911 center and asked for a name. It turned out that a serrgeant from the department that houses the 911 dispatch center was sitting at the console, and grabbed the call when it came in and just transferred the call to the sheriff. Turns out that they sent me to the tower . It was a cell cal that was lost so the number for the cell tower it hit came across the screen. I told the 911 operator that the tower was fine, it didn't look as if it was involved in a domestic disturbance.....

The system is far from infallible.

Jeff

 

[JJpdxpinkpistols]

Believe it or not, I know of at least one case in which a phone line was cut and service was assumed to have thus been ended. Years later, it was discovered that the wires in the cut end at the house (abandoned by then) were managing to dial 911 by making contact!

I cannot imagine this to be the case, technically.

Tone/signaaaaaaaalllll

wait a minute!

I can. Pulse dialing. Yes, this could actually happen if the switch was an older DMS switch that still had pulse enabled. Then, just as surely as you could tap out SOS in morse code on an electrically charged line by completing a circuit. Wow, tho...that would be amazingly random, man. Orders of improbability.

JJ
a phone geek.

 

[McCall911]

Since I work at a 911 center as a call-taker/dispatcher, I can contribute to this discussion a little. If we're lucky, I might be able to shed some light on what sometimes happens.

A good percentage of our 911 calls are 911 "hangups" where, for whatever reason, a phone is dialed and the 911 center reached, but nobody is on the line. Speaking just for our department, our policy (and in fact practice) is to immediately call the number back, as displayed on our 911 screen. If we get no answer or a receive a busy signal, then we (always) send police to investigate at the address given on the 911 screen.

Sometimes these 911 hangups are the product of human error or small children simply playing with the telephone. However, there are many cases where all the caller was able to do was dial the telephone before collapsing or being assaulted. As dispatchers, we have no way of knowing what has happened once we do not make contact at the number, so that is why we have to send police.

However, there is another case which occurs less frequently now than several years ago, but it does still happen. (It happened on my shift just a couple of nights ago.) Sometimes the older cordless phones will "dial" 911 when there batteries run low. In these cases, we may be able to reach the caller, who is often clueless about what happened. "Nobody here called 911!" is the response I receive at least weekly.

In the late 90's, this occurrence was so frequent as to be a nuisance and sometimes almost bogged down our law enforcement. Still, we have to send an officer to investigate, as we have no knowledge if there is actually a crime or other life-threatening situation. Because the one who answered the phone may not be aware that someone else in the house has, in fact, called for help but was unable to talk. (This has happened, BTW.)

Anyway, whatever glitch in programming that some cordless phones have, or used to have, they still occasionally hit 911 centers when their batteries are getting low.

I can only say what could have taken place from the standpoint of the 911 center, but one of the above scenarios is most likely the reason for the police to investigate the residence to begin with. Usually a simple, brief interview with the homeowner is sufficient, speaking from my own experience, but there have apparently been some instances where the police have had to investigate further.

 

[thorn726]

thanks a million guys , as you can see, my buddy regged up here to see what you all had to say, very interesting.

 

[pub1tzu]

Latest update from the victim

I spoke with my neighbor and he said that they visited him after they left my house...and had a whole different story...they were looking for a parolee.
This aroused my suspicions even more...
So, my neighbor called the Sheriff's department too...and got the real story that they were in fact looking for the parolee...same name the officers used last night...so everything checks out...
but then, is it legal for the officers to use a false 911 call to gain entry to look for a suspect?
I'd love some input from some of the people who speak leagaleze here on this board.
One thing I wonder, especially from this forum, if they had "stumbled" across something at my house that in and of itself might not be legal, would they be justified in charging me with a crime, even though they didn't have probable cause, and they used false pretenses to gain entry?
Well, thanks again for all the input...I think the roller coaster ride is over, and I do feel much better that they weren't "impersonating" an officer.

 

[LAK]

What Preacherman said.

I would want to have a copy of any audio of the alleged 911 call as well.

A good old fashioned tape recorder is a handy device. If the police show up on an alleged 911 call or any other suspicious reason, record the conversations while they are there. If you have a phone with a voice memo feature you can record it that way - or a phone that automatically records a message if you dial your own number. That way you create a remote and protected recording.

-------------------------------------
http://ussliberty.org
http://ssunitedstates.org

 

[beerslurpy]

They tried it with me too, but I dont have a phone. After the 3rd time I called the phone company and they fixed it.

 

[Highland Ranger]

This just happened to me this week. Kind of odd because we only have one landline in the house and no one was near it when the call was supposed to have happened.

I opened the door and let the 110 pound dog growl at the nice officer while I told him everything was fine.

No warrant no entry!

 

[McCall911]

They tried it with me too, but I dont have a phone. After the 3rd time I called the phone company and they fixed it.

Here's an example of a case I overlooked: 911 calls from no-longer-existent telephones still listed to a valid address. (I call these "ghost lines.")

I have no idea how these happen, but a call to the phone company usually clears them up, just as beerslurpy said.

What's disturbing to me is how some think that police can legally search a residence based only on a 911 hangup call. Generally, it's a face-to-face at the front door which rarely lasts even as long as three minutes. Such searches are beyond my experience in all the years I've been a dispatcher. Laws may vary from state to state, but it's always been my understanding that an officer responding to a 911 hangup is mainly doing a welfare check, period.

 

[Lupinus]

I can see both sides. One being that I don't want cops coming here henever they feel like it demanding entry, this will not happen. On the other hand though, if I am tired up in my bedroom by some loony that got the drop on me, I want the cops to bust their way in.

Show up, look at my lisence see that the address matches, then go away that is enough to show you I'm the guy that lives here and am not in any kind of trouble, if you want to be careful for domestic violence you can see the ID of the person living with me then leave. If not then you can kiss my hairy rump after my lawyer is done with you for unlawful entry and the damage you do to my house cause the door is getting shut and deadbolted.

 

[DagoRed]

We had a portable phone that would dial 911 when the batteries were low.

Had a cop come to the house once because of it. I let him to take a quick look around inside, when he saw there was no problem, he left.

It was his job, I didnt get mad, rather I appreciated he had a job to do and he did it, if there had been a problem (home invader etc) I would want him to check around.

 

[insidious_calm]

The real problem right now is 911 spoofing. This came about because of VoIP. If you use VoIP service, such as Vonage, you have to "program" the 911 features of the service. There is no traditional 911 service with VoIP. The calls can originate literally from anywhere on the planet. There have been several high profile cases of this in the news. Several resulted in full scale swat deployment to homes where unsuspecting folks were lucky to have remained unharmed. That's scary stuff.


I.C.

 

[Optical Serenity]

Believe me, us cops hate 911 hang ups. mainly because we do not know if its bs (95% of them) or if its someone who called and hung up in hopes we would show up to help.

And yes, there are odd situations where for some odd reason the wrong info shows up at the 911 center.

Its pretty tricky, but I've never seen any officers around here falsely claiming to have a 911 call just to enter a house.

I'm not sure why you all are so paranoid about "fake" cops showing up at your doors. I can't even remember the last time anything remotely like that happened around here. People don't go through all that trouble typically to rob you or otherwise violate you... Around here they just show up in a suit and holding a Book of Mormon and then hold you up. That was a recent trick we had a lot of trouble dealing with...

 

[Jeff White]

I will verify that ghost lines exist. Spent 10 minues driving around a neighborhood one night looking for an address that was now a vacant lot, the house on it having been torn down.

It seems like there is a lot of paranoia out there. I don't think any police department is so underworked that they make up 911 hangups just to get into someones house and look around.

All of the incidents are recorded, both the audio and the computer screen the telecommunicator sees. A wiley defense attorney like our own El Tejon would certainly want to see all the documentation if he thought the whole 911 hangup was a made up deal to gain entrance to someone's home. In most places this would involve a conspiracy between the 911 dispatch center (often a totally different entity then the police department.) Are any of you who suggest that that might be the case involved in such illicit activity that you think someone would go to all that trouble to gain entry to your home to look for evidence against you?

Jeff

 

[Taurus 66]

Do you always answer the door to everyone who knocks? every time? badge or not? What if it's a pizza delivery guy sent to your door on a prank? Are you now feeling obligated to pay for it soon after finishing a surf & turf inside? How 'bout Jehovah's Witness? Do you answer each and every time they knock? If the police leave after a number of knocks with no answer and no phone pick up, then all will be OK. If the cops force entry, well then ...

Once upon a time I waved back to everyone who waved to me. Then I stopped.

 

[Jeff22]

911 hangup calls

The difference in perspective on this topic is amazing.

As a police officer, I go to 911 hangup calls fairly frequently. It used to happen more often. Lots of wireless phones used to randomly dial 911 for some reason when the batteries got low. It doesn't seem to happen as much as it used to.

The people who responded to this who were cops or communications operators who are actually familiar with the dynamics of this common situation just explained the way it was. And the people who were NOT familiar with the reality of it often times tended to paranoid interpretations of events. If you aren't familiar with something, it doesn't make you a bad person, but know what you don't know!

Most of the 911 disconnect calls I've been to were caused by kids playing with the phone, a low battery on the wireless phone, somebody making an error trying to program the phone, or bumping the "emergency" or "911" button by mistake without even knowing it. A few times it was because there was a domestic disturbance going on, and all the victim could do was get to the phone and call 911 before their significant other took the phone away or tore it off the wall . . .

A tip to the unaware or unfamiliar in dealing with the police: first of all, know who the police are!Know the difference between the city police, the county sheriff's department and the state troopers. They have slightly different but overlapping jurisdictions. Their cars are probably painted differently and they probably have different colored uniforms. Know who your primary service provider is!If you live near the border of your jurisdiction, know what the uniforms and the squad cars of the neighboring town look like. That isn't too hard -- just pay attention when driving around on your normal business, and then remember what you see. Neighboring jurisdictions back each other up all the time, and if one agency gets tied up on a major incident, the department next door may end up being primary responders to calls in your town. It happens all the time, and it is NOT evidence of a particular emergency nor of a government conspiracy . . .

If you live in Hickory Hills and the Communications Center gets a 911 disconnect from your house, you may get the Hickory Hills PD or the Sheriff's Department or the State Police or cops from the next town or village over, depending upon the situation. It's not at all unusual.

Any time you interact with the police, be truthful, don't have an attitude nor appear to be concealing information and your day will go a lot smoother. Almost always when we encounter somebody with a belligerant attitude, it's because they're trying to hide something. You don't have to offer information, but answer the legitimate questions that you are asked. If you appear to be trying to hide something, cops treat that the same way that sharks treat the smell of blood in the water . . .

Pay attention to what agency the officer works for, and ask for their name and badge number or radio number or ID number. We get issued business cards to give to people we interact with. Get a business card from officer friendly and ask for the case number of the incident (if there is one), the address of occurance and the case title, and write down the date. That way, if at some later time you need to make an inquiry or make a complaint, you'll have the information that you need.

 

[McCall911]

Thanks, Jeff White and Jeff22.


Jeff22, your advice of people knowing their law-enforcement service provider is right on target! (To keep this gun-related. )

I might add that it's equally important to know who your fire/rescue/EMS service is, but that's another matter.

 

[pmcbooks]

but then, is it legal for the officers to use a false 911 call to gain entry to look for a suspect?

...

One thing I wonder, especially from this forum, if they had "stumbled" across something at my house that in and of itself might not be legal, would they be justified in charging me with a crime, even though they didn't have probable cause, and they used false pretenses to gain entry?

The police can give any story they want. If they had forced entry or entered without your permission it would be a different matter, but you permitted them to come in so they were there lawfully. They don't have an obligation to hide their eyes from any criminal wrongdoing they happen to see openly in your house.

I spoke with my neighbor and he said that they visited him after they left my house...and had a whole different story...they were looking for a parolee.

This might be the most important part. Your local servants didn't feel the need to BS your neighbor. You said you were new in town. This might be a good opportunity to get to know your sheriff etc. so they'll know they don't need to BS you, don't need to prowl around, don't need to arouse suspicion and create an us vs. them attitude across the internet and can count on you when they need help with a legitimate matter.

 

[dfaugh]

another thing

Having worked on computers for years, I have seen modems do some really weird things (thankfully most people are now using broadband!)... I'm quite sure that some false 911 calls have probably been generated by modems over the years...Not a high probability, but more than likely.

 

[LawDog]

If the police leave after a number of knocks with no answer and no phone pick up, then all will be OK.

You know, more than a couple of serial rapists in this area thought that exact same thing.

Victim managed to hit the 911 speed dial button. The rapist sure was hoping that if no one answered the return phone call, or the knocks on the door, that all would be okay.

LawDog

 

[DeputyVaughn]

False 911 calls are not that uncommon in my county. When it rains we get 911 (open line) calls to vacant lots where mobile homes have been removed. Water gets in the cut phone line and shorts something out.

We also get the "kids playing with the phone" a bit too.

However, every now and then there is a real problem and someone is hiding it. I had a 911 call to a residence on a Saturday afternoon that was such a call. I knocked on the door and a man answered with a beer in his hand. His son (about 18 years old) was on the couch and it looked like they were simply watching the football game. I asked if anyone else was in the house and he told me his wife was asleep in the back room. I told him I needed to see her before I would leave. That's when he got antsie. He told me to leave and started to shut the door. I put my foot in the door and entered the residence. He and his son began blocking me from going further. After a short struggle they were in cuffs in my car and being watched by my backup unit. When I got to the back room I found a woman bleeding from her ears and nearly unconscious. She wouldn't say he had beat her but it was pretty obvious. She was scared to death of him.

The man and his son were charged with domestic violence and resisting arrest. They argued unreasonable search but I won in court. They promised and appeal but I never heard from the circuit court.

The whole point is sometimes the officer at the door is not the bad guy. A little patience and honesty on everybody's part will usually resolve the situation to everyones satisfaction.

Scott

 

[rabidgoldfish]

This is funny, I was messing around with my phone that is supposed to have gps capibility and you had to dial a specific number to get your position. I dialed the number and got 911, ooops. The cops didn't send anyone out but it was one of those moments for me.

 

[TallPine]

When I was going to college I worked as an accounting intern in the only local hospital. For some reason that I am unclear about now, apparently 911 calls came directly to the hospital as well as the police dispatch.

Anyway, one day there was a 911 call from the child of one of the hospital employees asking his/her mother where the peanut butter was?

That lady was sure embarrassed!