Swiss K31 7.5 X 55 .306" bullet seating diameter vs Lee 7.5x55 seating die .308"

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Gert Odendaal

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d75629ec-3b79-44dd-b4ef-6042f5938afa.jpg Good morning I need some information. I have a ,Lee re-loading dies for the Swiss 7.5 x 55 K31 rifle ..the challenge is that this re-loading set has the seating die for the .308 " while the bullets of the GP-11 and the Perigrine bullets I have is .306" ..I do not want to shoot .308 " through the .306 " bore...please contact these companies and ask if they have a seating die with a .306 " diameter ???i

Should I forget to get hold of a .306" seating die and just use the .308" seating the bullet deeper in the case??
The challenge being the .306 reloads do not detonate in the rifle but the shelve bought ammo works well..left side the shelf bought ammo right side the .306" Rerigrine bullets made for me ...on the Lee reloading dies it is indicated as for .308 " bullet..
 
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I highly doubt any die manufacturer's are going to change their seating and sizing dies over concerns about shooting 0.308 bullet through Swiss rifles. Those 308 diameter bullets shoot fine.

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Undoubtedly pressures do increase with a larger diameter bullet, but so what, decrease your loads. Millions of 0.357 diameter bullets have been shot down 0.355" groove diameter Colt pistol barrels. I am going to claim, that the greatest source of danger, is if the case neck is pinched in the chamber. If the case neck is pinched, pressures go way up. I learned this decades ago when I assumed it was OK not to trim once fired rifle brass. Once fired brass has the most case neck growth, and the case necks on those reloads were in the throat. That caused blown primers.

I am not a fan of tight chambers and tight throats are OK if you know, and cut your loads accordingly. There are those who believe "tight" chambers, "tight" throats are a quality attribute, and want weapons chambered with reamers on the minimum side. These things just cause more problems later, feeding, extraction, not going into battery because ammunition is tight. If the case neck expands, and releases the bullet without pinching, a slightly larger bullet will not be an issue. Here is what to do. Take a fired case from the 7.5 Swiss and see if a 308 diameter bullet will drop in. If it does, you have plenty of clearance and all you have to do, is develop loads normally. I do not recommend hot loading old military actions, just keep them to service pressures and velocities.

AA4350 gave excellent accuracy and just about duplicates Ball velocities with 51.0 grains and a 168 Nosler Match bullet. As you can see 52.0 grains produced velocities over Ball, so I do not recommend that load. It is here for reference.

Instead of AA4350 I am shooting surplus WC852 in the 7.5 Swiss. This is a ball powder, and I purchased my lot from Jeff Barlett at GIBrass.com . It turns out Accurate Arms purchased a 90,000 pound lot of WC852, faster burning than Jeff’s lot, and now it is labeled as 2700. My lot of WC852 shoots extremely well, was dirt cheap, and I am using that up. But if I did not have the surplus powder, I would give IMR4350 or AA4350 a go as it shot very well.

7.5 x 55 Swiss Model K-31

AP11 Swiss Ball headstamp DA 78
24 Mar 04 T = 70 ° F

Ave Vel = 2565
Std Dev = 11
ES = 23
Low = 2551
High = 2574
N= 4


168 gr Nosler Match 51.0 gr AA4350 INDEP brass and primer OAL 2.850
22 Dec 01 T = 58 ° F

Ave Vel = 2536
Std Dev = 17
ES = 45
Low = 2510
High = 2555
N= 9

168 gr Nosler Match 52.0 gr AA4350 INDEP brass and primer OAL 2.850
22 Dec 01 T = 58 ° F

Ave Vel = 2624
Std Dev = 31
ES = 72
Low = 2588
High = 2660
N=5

en Garde!

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You are going to adjust the seating die for the cartridge and bullet you're loading, and I'm certain the 0.002 change in bullet diameter won't matter in the slightest.
 
The case body on your reload appears to be sized much too small. I'd need measurements to verify, but visually it appears to be sized too much. I have the Lee 7,5 Swiss dies also. Although no malfunction is caused in my rifle, much force is required to size. They move too much brass. I think excessive headspace is your issue, not the. 306 bullet.

Going forward, I would skip the. 306 bullet and use standard. 308 bullets. I've fired thousands, and new 2018 production GP 11 now uses a. 308 diameter..308 is just fine in the nominally. 307 K31 and. 3075 G11 bores.

If the brass you have is fired in your specific rifle, I would back your size die up at least a full turn. Compare these measurements to unfired and fired cartridge. You may have an out of specifications size die.
 
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I can see where a .308 seating die might cause excessive runout when seating .306 Monolithics. I've never been able to find .306 bullets on this side of the pond and accordingly American dies are set up for .308 bullets. Even PPU, which uses .306 bullets in their 7.5 x 55 ammo, only sells .308 bullets.

I'd suggest contacting Redding and ask them if a .306 die exists. They make a K31 specific sizing die so would be best versed on loading 7.5 x 55, IMO.

https://www.redding-reloading.com/
 
[QUOTE="
The challenge being the .306 reloads do not detonate in the rifle but the shelve bought ammo works well..left side the shelf bought ammo right side the .306" Rerigrine bullets made for me ...on the Lee reloading dies it is indicated as for .308 " bullet..[/QUOTE]

If you mean that your rifle doesn't fire your reloads, that has nothing to do with bullet diameter. The first two things to check are primer seating depth and excessive headspace caused by a sizing die screwed down to low.
 
If your picture shows a factory round and a reloaded round, the shoulder position and case neck are very different. Does your reloaded case allow the bolt to close? The left round is a soft point and said it is the factory round. The right round has the shoulder quite a bit farther forward, but if it chambers, that is fine. It looks like you have a really heavy crimp though, way more than is needed. If that’s not a crimp, you may need to seat the bullet a little deeper.

You said that the reloads don’t detonate. Did you mean that they won’t chamber and allow the bolt to close? The bullet diameter would not cause the primer to go off. My guess is that the right round doesn’t chamber. You need to size your brass more. Keep adjusting your sizing die down 1/2 turn or so and try the brass in the chamber after each adjustment until the bolt will close. Once the brass fits your chamber, seat a bullet and make sure it will chamber. If not, seat the bullet a little deeper until the round will chamber. No crimp should be needed.

After sizing the brass so it will chamber, make sure you check to see if it needs to be trimmed. Brass that is too long will cause problems.
 
Gert, I don't think you are measuring a pulled bullet. Anybody measuring .306" is measuring outside of the gp11 brass case. The largest diameter of the bullet is inside of the case. Most find .3075" bullet diameters for gp11. And the Swiss do recommend using .3085" diameter bullets for reloading, sort of. As the Swiss gov. doesn't reload gp11. Slamfire gave you good advice, see if a fired case will allow a .3085" bullet to slip into the fired case. With tongue in cheek,- be very careful some people are shooting Swiss model 11 and 31 types made to shoot 308 ammo at 2550fps in 26" barrels. BestAll
 
most "308" projectiles are close to .3085" in diameter. I'll try to find my letter from WFBern about recommending .3085" projectiles in the 7.5 swiss rifles as the correct bullet diameter. I've shown it more than once at SwissRifles.com in past postings.Best
 
.3085" US mil 173gr
.3085" Sierra 150 sp
.3085" Rem 165 sp
.308" Horn 150 rn There's the first four I pulled off the shelf. so 3 out of 4 are .3085" BestAll
 
I started reloading for 7.5 Swiss in 1967 . At that time the only loading data was contained in The Hornady Reloading Manual 1st Edition (1967) . Remember there was no internet or PC's then ...
All the data was developed with standard 30 cal. Hornady bullets , .308" dia. , 130 gr. , 150 gr. , 165 gr. , 180 gr. , spire point bullets . the cases were Swiss and Berdan Primed no American / boxer primed cases were available . Hornady stated the data shown was pressure tested and safe with .308" dia. bullets in the Model 1896/11 , Model 1911 and the Model 31 Schmidt-Rubin rifles .
This loading data has been updated in newer editions and my latest edition #8 - 2010 still contains loading data for the 7.5 Swiss Schmidt-Rubin.
The Dies I started with were CH dies and configured to use .308" bullets .
Still loading for the same two rifles bought in 1967 ... have started using cast bullets in one , a 1911 Short Rifle , with gas checked , 30 cal. bullets sized to either .308" or .309" dia. (both sizes work well) .
If you can't get .307" bullets ... you can use the Hornady Data and safely load with standard 30 cal. .308" dia. bullets made by Hornady .
Gary
 
It took a while to get this from my lost info stack and it also took awhile(3 yrs) to get responses from the Swiss Embassy in 1992. Anybody measuring their bullet diameters with calipers or mics? If every one is safe and working up you can use just about any bullet diameter. And the same for powders? BestAll
 
gwpercle,I here you. Info was hard to find for this kid of the fifties and sixties. My first thirty caliber was Russian. Second was a garand. Third was a thirty caliber Swiss. I've been a K11 newbie since 1969. Yea any 30 caliber will work. Be safe. Work up. A chrono is helpful
 
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