SxS...illegal to reduce barrel length?

[A Cleaner]

I was reading an old thread about reducing the length of shotgun barrels and one comment in there got me thinking. It was something to the effect of, "Cutting double barrels is illegal because the ATF considers that altering the serial number." That's paraphrased of course.

At any rate, the question in my mind became...is that really true? If the barrel is still over 18" from the muzzle to the breech face and assuming said barrel reduction did not affect any serial number, wouldn't that still be legal? It seems to me that it would be.

Any links to BATFE info regarding said questions would be valuable.

Mods, if this is in the wrong forum, my apologies. Couldn't decide b/w Shotguns and L&P.

 

[Father Knows Best]

That's ridiculous. It's perfectly legal to cut a double's barrels so long as the finished product is at least 18" in length. Most 'smiths won't cut below 18.25" just in case the measuring tape is a little off.

 

[Preacherman]

Put it this way - it IS illegal to deface or remove a firearm's serial number. However, this is a completely separate rule from the one governing barrel lengths. I don't know of any shotgun where the serial number is on the barrel: normally, it's on the receiver, as per ATF rules.

 

[halvey]

"Cutting double barrels is illegal because the ATF considers that altering the serial number."

It is not illegal. It IS unethical.

 

[foghornl]

IIRC, it is 18" MINIMUM barrel length, with a 26" overall MINIMUM length.

 

[A Cleaner]

Thanks for the replies so far everybody. I agree it sounded funny but it was one of those, "Hey, wait a minute..." moments. Better safe than sorry.

For the sake of conversation, the stipulation was made in the old thread that it would be illegal due to the gun being a break action. Not real sure what the difference would be. At any rate, I appreciate the feedback. Keep it comin'.

 

[pauli]

could you link the old thread? it's coming across as something like "it's illegal to lower the suspension on that car because it's carburated."

 

[A Cleaner]

Here it is...

Old Thread - "Sawing off a shotgun?"

See: Page 3, Post #61

 

[chris in va]

A really easy way to find out is calling your local State Police office.

 

[Father Knows Best]

Saving the trouble of opening the link and searching for the post, I'll quote it here. In the original thread, chopinbloc wrote:

oh, and it may be considered illegal to cut any length off. if it is a break action, the atf considers that altering the serial number. if you want a short shotgun, buy it short from the factory. of course, one would have to actually buy a firearm and maybe even engage in the shooting sports, then.

I have no idea where he gets that idea, because it is simply wrong. Perhaps you should email or PM chopinbloc and ask him what his source is.

 

[cane]

HALVEY, why is it unethical to shorten a shotgun barrel?

 

[auschip]

HALVEY, why is it unethical to shorten a shotgun barrel?

I believe he is joking about cutting a nice classic firearm when you can find them with 20inch barrels already. Similar to those who don't like sporterizing milsurps.

 

[A Cleaner]

Cause he probably likes 'em whole.

And he wouldn't be the first to speak out against the double "going under the knife". I guess its one of those "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" things. If they saw the muzzle end on this one, it would be obvious to all that I'm helping the poor gun. To each his own.

 

[halvey]

HALVEY, why is it unethical to shorten a shotgun barrel?

If you have to ask, you'd never understand...

Do you know how many nice SxS I've come across that have had some 'hack' decide it'd be cool to shorten the barrels? What for? Most don't even realize they now have no chokes. Just this morning I got an email from a FFL on Gunbroker selling an "unfired" SxS. Said the barrels were 27". Are you kidding me? The first thing this guy does is cut the barrels before even firing it?

I guess if its your gun, you can do what you wish, but don't put them out on the market later after the coolness factor wears off or your pattern at 40 yards is just a few pellets.

 

[Father Knows Best]

Halvey, I sort of agree with you, but not completely. It depends on the quality of the double, and how it is going to be used. It is indeed a crime against humanity and all that is good and decent to whack the barrels on a classic old double. A well balanced double needs the long tubes to point and swing with any grace. When you shorten the barrels, you destroy all the qualities that make a fine double, well, "fine." Plus, as you mentioned, you eliminate the chokes (though they can be restored with screw-in choke tubes).

Many double built in the last few decades, however, are not fine guns to begin with. They are clunky and poorly balanced. They will never point or swing with any grace. If you want to use such a gun for cowboy action shooting or home defense, then short barrels are an advantage, and nobody cares how well such a gun points.

I have a couple of shorties, myself, for cowboy action shooting. I'd never use them as bird or clays guns, though.

 

[cane]

I've shortened several shotgun barrels for various reasons. I have 3 Model 97s with barrels between 20 & 24 inches. By the way the 24 inch one was factory length. The two shorter ones have screw in chokes as do my shortened doubles. While I think it is ill advised for someone to cut the barrels of a quality shotgun, it is hardly unethical. Afterall it's his gun, he will suffer the economic loss when he trys to sell it.

 

[halvey]

Plus, as you mentioned, you eliminate the chokes (though they can be restored with screw-in choke tubes).

For some of the older doubles that can get tricky if not impossible.

Afterall it's his gun, he will suffer the economic loss when he trys to sell it.

Yeah, or get some other poor sucker to buy it. Like the 26 1/4" "factory" length a FFL once tried to sell me. I told him it was cut, and he should tell people too. He ignored me.

 

[justashooter]

older doubles may have barrels of unequal wall thickness at mid-point. they may open up on firing if cut down.

that being said, i recently cut a cheap belgian 12 gauge to 18.25" and replaced the broken buttstock with one of my making that has a 9" pull and a good cant. points real pretty. OAL around 31".

 

[A Cleaner]

If it makes any of you more comfortable, this gun I'm considering reducing was a discounted used Stoeger Uplander missing the bead and pitting near the muzzle. It, even if it were in better condition, is not the graceful old double of which you speak. It will have one purpose if cut...nightstand duty.

The "coolness factor" has little to do with it. Space requirements and barrel pitting at the muzzle end has everything to do with it. And, no need or desire to sell, as there is no "coolness factor" to wear off over time.

 

[halvey]

Oh.

Well if its a Stoeger, no big deal.!